If it was abuse...

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Re: If it was abuse...
« Reply #20 on: February 04, 2020, 04:41:31 PM »
yes, but an NPD can also just read it somewhere.  Only recently, have I learned that it is abuse when parents destroy their children's property or that the silent treatment is abusive.

These two are new for me too. My parents had no boundaries with us kids. Nothing was ever ours. It was my parents. And they punished by destroying toys or special things kids collect. I see now how awful that was.

Its funny because I work with someone who I suspect is NPD. He bought some air pods for his son who is in college so not a child. He used them on a trip to the beach before he gave them to his son. He considers them his property. Another colleague who I admire a lot was saying his kids (12-16) had them but he wasnt interested. I was telling him why hed love them. He said he was curious to try them.  I was so shocked that he hasnt just taken a pair from one of his kids. There was just no concept of things belonging to us as kids.

My abusive BPDxH used to destroy my things. Hed claim it was an accident, but I read something in Why Does He Do That? that was almost exactly like my situation and I saw for the first time how my ex deliberately destroyed things I cherished.

I have come to see abuse as anything someone does to control someone else using fear.

The silent treatment is the worst. It really makes you doubt yourself and forces you to dance to get the attention of the person doing it. So humiliating to look back on. 



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Re: If it was abuse...
« Reply #21 on: February 05, 2020, 12:36:48 AM »
Wikipedia has some information on child abuse:  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Child_abuse

It's where, I am sure, I found the bit about destroying children's property.  WP does get written over and that was a few years ago.  But I did see something that applies to me:
In 1995, APSAC defined it as: spurning, terrorizing, isolating, exploiting, corrupting, denying emotional responsiveness, or neglect" or "A repeated pattern of caregiver behavior or extreme incident(s) that convey to children that they are worthless, flawed, unloved, unwanted, endangered, or only of value in meeting another's needs"

Both of my parents would harp on me to help clean up where ever we went.  There were couple times when the hostess would "don't worry about it.  Just have a good time."  When I go back to my mother she would to go ask something else and on and on.  One time we were visiting my father's sister and her family in another city where they lived.  My aunt had dinner and about 20 people came along.  Never mind that my aunt has 2 daughters; both were there and one was living with the parents full time.  but somehow I and my younger got singled out to clean up.  I was very angry.  And I believe my mother made that offer to my aunt.



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Re: If it was abuse...
« Reply #22 on: February 05, 2020, 03:08:51 AM »
Interesting posts - In the past 10 years I have had three therapists.  The first was mostly a listener and I felt that all I was paying for was an hour of someone's time listening to me complain.  I was with her for a year.  It was my first experience.

The second therapist was supposed to be experienced in trauma.  I did like our two sessions and he did call after a month passed to see if I was Ok.  I believe he would have been a good fit if it wasn't for his heavy cologne and my allergies.

At this point I was troubled.  Was it really supposed to be this hard to find someone to work with.  And then my diagnosis of c-PTSD came down and I had to find someone or else have a life of seizures and aphasia.

So I tried again, and bam I found someone I clicked with.  She specializes in EMDR and when I asked about the first EMDR treatment she said that it would be several months.  She told me it needed complete trust and honesty between parties. I have been going there for two years almost weekly and it has taken a long time to develop the trust and honesty.  To really dig deep and hear and say what needs to be heard and said.

It was a year before she told I was experiencing emotional and financial abuse.  Funny enough the previous two had told me the same thing but I wasn't ready to hear it.  When she said it, it clicked.  I think if she had told me sooner, I would've left.

For me, the two years were needed to really develop the confidence in myself to say out loud what was happening in my life. And believe it.  That is after more than 32 years of marriage to my xOCPDh. 

My advice, if you don't feel a connection to your therapist, then keep looking.  When you do find someone you click with, only complete honesty will work.  And complete honesty takes a great deal of courage.



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Re: If it was abuse...
« Reply #23 on: February 11, 2020, 02:10:47 PM »
I talked with her recently because person contacted me with vague depressive expressions (nothing like, "I'm going to kill myself," but depressed/hopeless sounding).  She does care, and said some things that makes me think she gets it, but it's hard to tell.  idk.  I don't need what I'm saying to be gospel, but I do need it to be seriously considered by my counselor.  She's supportive of me finding a new one and wants to make sure they're good.  If I keep seeing her, it can't be very frequent.  And maybe that's not very productive?

I don't know how to take these despairing comments--implying being mentally "off," finding life pointless, etc.  On the one hand, I don't want to miss warning signs, but on the other, I can't really do much besides suggest counseling, spirituality, and what probably sound like platitudes.  And I can't be the support person.  It keeps me locked in place, doesn't help them get closure, and all the water is muddied.  There's a chance it's manipulative, too, and I don't want to reward that.  I feel callous saying that.

Is not wanting to ever see someone again a "discard"?  I read about that and immediately turn it on myself.  "You wouldn't be thinking of leaving if you weren't the narcissist about discard my innocent spouse," etc.  :(  I'm sorry if I'm drifting off topic; I can start a new thread...I didn't want to clutter up the board and I'm in one of those "spiral of self-doubt" slumps anyway.



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Re: If it was abuse...
« Reply #24 on: February 11, 2020, 05:08:03 PM »
One of the lines in the sand that is easy to determine abuse, in my mind is to ask this question.  Is it their intention to make you feel bad?  And where does that intention come from?  Does it make them feel better?  Do they get secret pleasure out of it?  You can ask that of yourself as well.  I can honestly answer in times of emotional upheaval that yes I did want him to feel bad so that he would change.  This takes recognition on both sides to make it stop.  So I guess abuse can be on a spectrum as well, yes there are the petty backhanded comments that can be made all the way up to straight out name calling or just plain old making you doubt yourself.  When you "grow up" you realize that you really don't want to hurt anyone like that to serve your own purpose.  I think that at some point in everyone's life they have been what I would deem as abusive in one way or another, but the difference is that some of us grow out of it and some don't.  And some of us learn to master it to control others as well.