Possessive of the grandkids

[WinterStar]

My MIL sent me an email congratulating me on the news that I'm pregnant with, as she put it, "my new grandson." She offered to come to help when he is born, which she has done when our other kids. Turns out, her help is the opposite of help, so I'm not interested. My husband told her we didn't need that help over the phone. In the email she also offered to come out with her husband over the summer instead and then stressed that she really wants to see her new grandson.

In the rest of the email, she tried to empathize with my current situation by comparing it to hers; she has four kids too with similar spacing; she was in her late 30s when she was pregnant with her last. She understands how tired I must be because she was so tired with her last. I need to take plenty of time to rest. She said she's really excited, which I think is the first time I've ever witnessed her expressing an emotion. Thing is, I'm not nearly as tired with this pregnancy as I was with the last one when I had a one year old. All three of my older kids are in school this time. I know advising me to take rest is supposed to be nice, but it sounds more like an order, and it's hard to get rest since I have three kids, a husband, a job, a house. I think she means to express empathy, but it's all about her. And I hate the comparisons to her experience. I actually had a hard time when I found out I was pregnant and the number of children and the spacing lined up so similarly with my inlaws. I just don't want comparisons, and I don't want to be anything like them. Is that weird?

And, my husband is so encouraged that his mom offered to help, though he recognizes that she's not helpful (he's made some progress!). I said I appreciated that she was trying to express empathy because that was the most positive thing I could say. His mother sends all communication through me, I think because I'm the woman. I've been forwarding all emails to my husband for awhile now, but I can't help myself and still read them. Today, I set my email account up to forward all her incoming emails straight to my husband and then delete them. I won't see them in the future.

I know part of my frustration with this email is my FOO. I'm vvvvvvlc with my Nfather who recently sent an envelope to "my grandkids" even though he has no relationship with them (hasn't met most of them). And my PD mom said when I told her about the baby, "I know how I'm spending my vacation this year!" and just assumed we would want her to come for a week to "help out." Again, not really help. The help is just an excuse to spend time with the grandkids, which it really feels like is the same for my PD MIL. I feel like I'm being overly judgmental about my MIL's email, partly because my husband tells me that I shouldn't be so negative about his family and partly because in a lot of ways my inlaws aren't quite as bad as my FOO.

But I'm just so tired. Tired of people assuming untrue facts about me based on their own experience. Tired of no one asking me what I want/need. Tired of the possessive way these grandparents treat their grandkids without recognition that they're my kids, and my husband and I are the ones doing all the work in raising them without any actual helpful help.

[inHistime]

I echo your aggravation. my mil has only ever referred to grandchildren as "our" or "her" then their name. Never acknowledging my H or I as parents. Sends a very clear message to me. I also read your post about your F sending the MY grandkids. It's ridiculous to claim children as possessions and to boot have nothing to do with them, good decision on your part. I just wanted to agree with you and say YES that's disrespectful and I hate it too.

[candy]

But I'm just so tired. Tired of people assuming untrue facts about me based on their own experience. Tired of no one asking me what I want/need. Tired of the possessive way these grandparents treat their grandkids without recognition that they're my kids, and my husband and I are the ones doing all the work in raising them without any actual helpful help.

Oh, WinterStar, I can relate to your experiences. For me the IL's surpass my FOO with regard to possessive behavior. Both my MIL and my M are mistaking empathy for projection of their own life.

I don't think you're being judgmental at all!
You are pregnant with your child, and this is your family, and the healthy and caring thing to do would be to ask you how you are doing, whether you and H need help and in case you do what kind of help.

Real empathy doesn't demand ,,theirs". I agree that it is disrespectful to refer to my grandson/daughter when talking to the parent.

[Leonor]

Congratulations on your newest little love coming into your life, WinterStar!

I totally support you in keeping grandparents OUT until you are feeling recovered and decide who, how and when you'd like to share your joy with others.

I certainly wished I had! Instead we had mil and fill to "help" when I was pregnant with number three and wound up taking care of them instead. Like, FOLDING THEIR LAUNDRY WHILE IN LABOR (yes I know caps are shouty but when I think back I get so mad I start shouting ARGH!)

They also say weird things. My sil is BPD and my mil would watch my three children playing in the park and sigh and say to me in a regretful voice, "This is what sil needs." Like, my kids?!? "Oh, yes, because she always wanted to be married with three kids." Me:

But the love and adoration your little baby will have for you and you alone as the most wonderfulest, lovingest, safest, bestest mommy in the whole world will never change no matter what silly noise mil is making on the sofa over there.

If they want to help so much, give 'em a list. Put cradle together. Order food to be delivered to our place. Pick up major laundry items and return freshly pressed. That's helping.

Congratulations!

[candy]

Leonor is absolutely right.

And I forgot the most important: WinterStar, congratulations on your pregnancy! Good to read you are doing fine. I wish you all the best for the time remaining!

[Phoenix Rising]

Hi! Just got to reading your thread and OMG 

First of all, big congrats on your pregnancy! Such a fun and exciting time 

I agree with the others that you are definitely NOT being judgmental. I like Leonor's suggestion of giving them a list. Doesn't necessarily mean that PDMIL will not try to find a way to otherwise maliciously do things her way or make it about her but that's actually communicating what is needed. I noticed so many IL forget or don't care that their kids are ADULTS, not possessions.. same goes with grandchildren 

[WinterStar]

Thank you inHistime, candy, Leonor and ingenting! I appreciate the congrats, and your posts are really helping me.

I have tried giving MIL tasks. My husband kept asserting that she was happy to do them, and even though my instincts were telling me that she was trying to avoid doing those things, I believed that he really did know his mother better than I did, like he said. It took me years to realize that she's as extremely avoidant as she seems. She used to do jobs poorly until I would give up asking her, like putting diapers on so loosely that there was always a major leak that required a whole new wardrobe at the next diaper change. She wants to feel like she's helping without actually doing anything more than spending time with my children.

The projecting as empathizing thing is really awful because it looks like empathy from the outside, but it's really self-absorption and often an opportunity for PDs to dump their own crap all over you. How many times have I listened to M or MIL talk about how hard their lives have been? And if I ever shared any struggle of my own, I got back a story of something that they went through that was probably worse. Excellent listening/empathy skills, ladies, thanks.

Latest news, MIL emailed my husband, saying she and FIL will not be coming to help when the baby is born because they don't want to fly due to coronavirus. But they "expect lots of pictures"! Yes, there's nothing new, tired parents who have three other kids need more than an edict to email a bunch of photos.

The one thing that gives me solace in all of this is that I won't be like these people. If my kids end up having their own families, I'm going to say, "I want to do whatever works best for you whenever it works for you." You could use somebody who takes on the poopy diapers and cleans the bathroom? I'm on it! You need to vent and have somebody listen? I know it's tough right now and that you have your own unique challenges that aren't about me. You don't want me there right after baby is born? Fine by me. Not offended. Blessed that my kids will be able to tell me the truth!

It makes me feel better, but it also makes me feel sad because I know that's the support I need and should be getting. It's hard to be the generation that actually supports the kids because you supported your parents and then supported your kids but never had the proper support you needed. I really struggle with anger at the unfairness of it. It's especially acute when I'm pregnant.

I need to figure out how to shrink the amount of head space the PDs in my life have right now and reorient myself toward my FOC, but I haven't been succeeding at all for the last few months. Any ideas?

[Entj]

Congrats on your pregnancy!   

My MIL was calling my firstborn 'my baby', 'my child'. Asked my husband to tell her to stop that, then she started saying 'your son and my grandson' 

No help is better than unhelpful help, I've been there too...

How to have them occupy less space in your head: what works for me is to fill up my cup and practice self- care. Yoga, meditation, a walk at a park, doing your favourite activities...

[WinterStar]

MIL called for DD birthday and told her to pass on a suggestion for a middle name for our son... DH had only shared the first name so far, but we picked out our favorite boy first name AND middle name 12 years ago when I was pregnant with our first. What makes her think we don't have a name or want her input? I am insanely livid, raging inside. Can't share that with DH because he'd say I'm being unreasonable. And I feel like I am unreasonable. *Sigh*

[Leonor]

 

Hm. Sounds to me like mil is triangulating through dd to get under your skin.

If you react with rage and upset, then she gets through. The triangulation worked. If you then triangulate through dh by yelling at him about it, she "wins" (in her own messed up mind), because she will blink and sigh, "Well I had no idea, it was a mere suggestion I though she might like it blahblahblah" and all of a sudden it's her and dh triangulating over *you*.

If instead you can respond by honoring your anger and reinforcing your boundaries ("Grandma said that, dd? Hmm."), then you have blocked the triangulation.

It's like a circuit breaker, you just need to shut down the toxic charge before it overwhelms you.

Plus, if dh does hear about this - and I think it's pretty certain that dh will be her next target - he won't have anyone to be all defensive about, because you won't be defensive, either. "Oh yes, dd mentioned that to me, but I have my heart set on the names we picked out together those many moons ago. It is such a sweet memory for me to remember us back then, can you believe how far we've come together? Smooch smooch!" He'll probably be a little bewildered and flattered. You've made your case, defended your boundaries and redirected his attention to your special bond in a loving way. Win!

Breathe. Walk. Meditate. Weep. Allow the negativity to dissipate. Fake it til you make it. Eventually, you will!

[WinterStar]

Hm. Sounds to me like mil is triangulating through dd to get under your skin.

If you react with rage and upset, then she gets through. The triangulation worked. If you then triangulate through dh by yelling at him about it, she "wins" (in her own messed up mind), because she will blink and sigh, "Well I had no idea, it was a mere suggestion I though she might like it blahblahblah" and all of a sudden it's her and dh triangulating over *you*.

If instead you can respond by honoring your anger and reinforcing your boundaries ("Grandma said that, dd? Hmm."), then you have blocked the triangulation.

It's like a circuit breaker, you just need to shut down the toxic charge before it overwhelms you.

Plus, if dh does hear about this - and I think it's pretty certain that dh will be her next target - he won't have anyone to be all defensive about, because you won't be defensive, either. "Oh yes, dd mentioned that to me, but I have my heart set on the names we picked out together those many moons ago. It is such a sweet memory for me to remember us back then, can you believe how far we've come together? Smooch smooch!" He'll probably be a little bewildered and flattered. You've made your case, defended your boundaries and redirected his attention to your special bond in a loving way. Win!

Breathe. Walk. Meditate. Weep. Allow the negativity to dissipate. Fake it til you make it. Eventually, you will!

Okay, so I get how it can read like my MIL is using triangulation to get under my skin, but I don't think that's what she's doing. My MIL is not a malignant PD. Sometimes I have trouble talking about this on this forum because so many people here are dealing with malignant PDs. My father definitely is one and so is my SIL. Both pull strings and are extremely controlling. My NF actually enjoys causing other people pain. SIL just doesn't care if she causes pain for the people she doesn't really care about; she will apologize to my husband, her brother, but not to me.

MIL and my mom are different. They both lack the ability to see things from someone else's perspective, which means they use a lot of projection and lack true empathy. They suck up my energy and are perpetual reassurance seekers. They are both eternal victims who use guilt to get the attention they crave. But I don't think either of them actually wants to annoy me. MIL has no boundaries and no understanding that suggesting a name for someone else's child is rude. She's focused on what she wants. I think it's the pattern of boundary breaking that is really causing my internal rage. She cannot respect even the simplest, clearly stated boundaries let alone have the good sense to know what rude behavior is.

And she's probably coming to live in my house for at least a week this summer. I don't want her here. But as we soon won't have a spare bedroom (our son will likely be sleeping in our bedroom this summer, but soon after that he'll be taking over the guest room), it may not make sense to tell my husband that she can't stay here for this one last visit. I started requiring that he take vacation time during her whole visit so that I don't end up alone all day long with her. He doesn't even like that boundary.

[Call Me Cordelia]

If you don't want her there, then it makes sense not to have her visit. It took me some time to get there, but nobody is entitled to your hospitality. Especially for a week. That's a long time for a WANTED houseguest!

[WinterStar]

If you don't want her there, then it makes sense not to have her visit. It took me some time to get there, but nobody is entitled to your hospitality. Especially for a week. That's a long time for a WANTED houseguest!

Yeah, I used to tell my MIL to come any time she wanted and stay as long as she liked, and my husband would take maybe a day off from work. She'd come for a couple of weeks to "help" but then didn't really help. Husband wasn't here and kept thinking she was helping even though I said it wasn't helping. I kept thinking that the problem was that I wasn't communicating my boundaries clearly enough. Then, I got better at boundaries and stating them clearly and found that this made no difference whatsoever. That's when I told husband that if his family comes, he has to take 100% of the time off and be 100% responsible for them. I'd prefer it if they get a hotel, but I felt this was a compromise I could live with.

Husband was mad. He thinks I'm too sensitive and too particular. But it turns out that he didn't want to spend all that vacation time on his mother. Her visits got shorter and less frequent. She wanted to come out for my eldest's First Communion, and I said to husband, "As long as you take the time off, no problem." Well, his job wasn't interested in giving him a week off in April. He blames me and says I didn't allow her to come. Um, no.

Last time MIL and FIL came, I didn't take the time off my job, and I work from home, so I just hid in the bedroom. Sometimes my work bled into Netflix time. I ran a lot of errands too to get away. It's still a lot of meals with them and having them invade all the common areas of my house, and it's a small house. It's still tiring but manageable. Since it would be their last time ever staying in my house, I'm not sure it's worth trying to discuss the possibility of them staying in a hotel this summer. Husband is mad enough at me already regarding his family. We recently started therapy. I expect the in-law situation being a major area we will be working through.

[all4peace]

WinterStar, I love your boundaries and stance on your DH taking off work for his family. I'm also glad you are getting therapy. It took a therapist telling my DH we needed boundaries for him to come out of his avoidant stance and realize we actually had significant boundary issues with his family.