Is this a narc hoover...

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Sheppane

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Is this a narc hoover...
« on: June 09, 2020, 04:09:27 PM »
Hi everyone
New here. Looking forward to coming OOTF. Dysfunctional FOO and only realising extent in recent years, worsening as time advances. Or more likely worsening with my attempts to leave and get healthy.
Have had difficult past year especially,  where narcMom ( covert) produced huge narc rage to me,  in response to me calmly setting boundaries.  First time I really saw the gaslighting in such full force. Went through feelings of intense shock, self doubt, grief,  fear, sadness at time. But over the months I have " slipped " back in. Was trying to make the relationship work,  accepted an apology ( Im sorry if it made you upset but I am under so much stress), and from a number of episodes between then and now I feel I have slipped back in to the FOG of my FOO.

Recently have been working through a lot of what I now see as " cycles", with covnarcMom and uBPDnarccovsis. Shame, baiting, silent treatment. All in conversation by cellphone or text message. Recently got shut down on a call completely ignored, removed myself from conversation, felt sick, triggered for days. Didn't know what to do next- so did nothing and waited. Decided not to call out on it as might only trigger another attack on me and I could not take any more. Decided to do some more work around boundaries in conversation, and how to communicate them. Knew the longer I didn't call it would likely be kept as a scorecard agsinst me - but body was screaming, no, dont do this again. After a few days reprieve decided to call nMom, mainly as it felt so uncomfortable to wait, also as I had done so much reading/ work on my own boundaries between ..that I was willing to take it on, and curious would I be able to follow through on boundaries if any came up in the call.

Trembling, I made the call..she was the opposite- friendly, warm, asked about me ( never does), even offered to help with my kids. I felt so soothed, my inner child  was loving it, felt safe again, no need to be afraid. Began doubting myself afterwards ...maybe I am the one ..maybe I misinterpreted being shut down/ frozen on call ...maybe I read too much. It was so strange. As if she knew I was going to come in strong with boundaries- and gave me no opportunity but was so "nice" to me. I felt like I had got into a boxing ring but the opponent had left! Then I reminded myself of the huge narc rage before and all she had said to me, the awful things,  and how i was gaslighted at the time, and how the next day she sent a message to me to see how I was. When I said I wasnt good, that the previous days events had deeply upset and disturbed me, she replied " oh no thats terrible, is there anything I can do to help right now xx". I couldn't believe it at the time. And back then, I realised it was a classic hoover. And off we went again.

So hear I am again. Nice sweet call after stonewalling/ ignoring me. I was aware enough from before not to fall in too deep, but after call yesterday still needed to convince myself - back to self doubt, believing all the messages that actually it is me, basically believing the gaslighting. Wondering am I crazy. But even more  telling myself, its ok, she does love me, it will all be ok.

Wasnt sure where to go next. Then today another message telling me how lovely it was I called, arrangements about meeting, and finishing up with  again,  it was so nice to speak  to me and " it would be so nice for me if you could call me at least once per week, hugs and kisses Mom".

Am I right am I just being hovered back in, in a covert manner, after having been given silent treatment ( punishment for setting a boundary) , but I caved, called, gave the supply back and now we are back at the hoover ? It seems like that to me, but I really need the support of others to validate if it is correct.  I want to know am I reading this right. I feel relieved ( though I know this will be temporary as the toxic energy will build up again. So confused.

Thanks for reading !
« Last Edit: June 09, 2020, 04:22:16 PM by Sheppane »

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PeanutButter

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Re: Is this a narc hoover...
« Reply #1 on: June 17, 2020, 04:04:19 PM »
Oh yes! IMO that is straight out of the narcissist's handbook: classic hoover. So be very careful. Enjoy it. But dont relax too much it will end soon ime.

 How they know when your just about ready to call it i'll never know. But they do know when they pushed you just a little to far. Then they back pedal with the hoover.

I did want to mention one other thing about when you said:
 
Quote
So hear I am again. Nice sweet call after stonewalling/ ignoring me. I was aware enough from before not to fall in too deep, but after call yesterday still needed to convince myself - back to self doubt, believing all the messages that actually it is me, basically believing the gaslighting. Wondering am I crazy. But even more  telling myself, its ok, she does love me, it will all be ok.

 This I bolded jumped out at me.

 I use to have an inner dialog like this. I had to convince myself I was wrong. That it was me. I felt like I couldn't survive the truth. In order for me to be alright my mom had to love me. The abuse could not be true or I couldn't go on.

 Im ok though. I was abused. My ubpdM isnt capable of loving me. I am no longer in denial and I survived it. I am happy for the first time in my life. I can experience joy. I did not have that before.
 
IME you can be ok too even if she doesnt love you. You can give yourself the love you havn't received.

Its hard. I had to put physical distance between myself and my ubpdM before I felt safe enough to start admitting to myself the extent of the damage that was done. It was traumatic.

IME I would start with small boundaries that will protect you from abuse. Little by little. You deserve to be safe. Your inner child deserves to finally be safe.
 :bighug:
If there is a hidden seed of evil inside of children adults planted it there -LundyBancroft  Self-awareness is the ability to take an honest look at your life without any attachment to it being right or wrong good or bad -DebbieFord The greatest of faults is to be conscious of none -Thomas Carlyle

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Starboard Song

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Re: Is this a narc hoover...
« Reply #2 on: June 17, 2020, 07:17:04 PM »
We don't know, of course. Healthy people who mess up often get real nice as a way to indicate their regret. That's what makes this hard.

But PeanutButter is right that you are describing a longterm pattern that sure smells like a hoover: temporary or insincere niceness to lure you back in. It is really common for folks on your end of a toxic relationship to doubt themselves each time. In my home, we fell for it over and over, for years. So pause and reflect on the history you've had: you will never again accept mistreatment. If this is a recurring pattern over and over, then it is highly unlikely this is new leaf turned. If this is a recurring pattern over and over, is there something special occurring this time to suggest that the pattern is over?

Starting with small and increasing boundaries as PeanutButter suggests is very healthy. You will never again accept mistreatment.

Good luck to you!
« Last Edit: June 18, 2020, 09:47:47 AM by Starboard Song »
Radical Acceptance, by Brach   |   Self-Compassion, by Neff    |   Mindfulness, by Williams   |   The Book of Joy, by the Dalai Lama and Tutu
Healing From Family Rifts, by Sichel   |  Stop Walking on Egshells, by Mason    |    Emotional Blackmail, by Susan Forward

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PeanutButter

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Re: Is this a narc hoover...
« Reply #3 on: June 18, 2020, 03:29:44 AM »
Im sorry by the way that I missed this post for so long. I should have said that in my first post and I sincerely hope you come back and give us a second chance.

Healthy people who mess up often get real nice as a way to indicate their regret. That's what makes this hard

IME and IMO as well as with every thing Ive read and heard from proffessional opinions emotionally healthy people do NOT use silent treatment. Silent treatment is a hallmark of emotional abuse.https://www.aconsciousrethink.com/5547/silent-treatment-abuse/

It does matter that none of us can label with certianty what disorder a person has or whether they are disordered.
 
 If you are being harmed with emotionally abusive behaviors like the silent treatment, shaming, and baiting and when you tried to set the bare minimum of a boundary it was recieved with severe gaslighting and a rage like you had not ever experienced and NOW she is being nice IT IS NO STRETCH to say with almost certianty imo that she has not suddenly changed into a normal nice person that just feels bad.
https://www.boundariesbooks.com/boundaries/when-someone-responds-to-your-boundaries-with-anger/

 These behaviors you describe have been described on this forum, in books, article, blogs, and videos as the exact way a disordered person reacts to boundaries

In fact on this forum people are warned that their boundaries will be met with rage and a ramping up of abuse and are told to be prepared for it.
So please protect yourself. You may continue to see worse abuse as you set more boundaries. The role that you are trying to remove yourself from has been the status quo for your whole life. It will not be easy to extract yourself but will be worth it.

Also I should have said this in my first post also but better late than never I hope. Good job! Without any support you stood up for yourself and set boundaries with someone who is abusing you. You have strength that you might not give yourself credit for. You can do this! I wish you well. Take care my fellow travelor.
« Last Edit: June 18, 2020, 03:37:55 AM by PeanutButter »
If there is a hidden seed of evil inside of children adults planted it there -LundyBancroft  Self-awareness is the ability to take an honest look at your life without any attachment to it being right or wrong good or bad -DebbieFord The greatest of faults is to be conscious of none -Thomas Carlyle

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Sheppane

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Re: Is this a narc hoover...
« Reply #4 on: August 09, 2020, 06:44:42 AM »
Hey guys I've been off the boards a bit and was reading through some posts,  just realized never thanked you for your replies  :doh: sorry about that!!
Anyway thank you for reading and your responses which were super helpful
Have a great day !

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PeanutButter

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Re: Is this a narc hoover...
« Reply #5 on: August 09, 2020, 10:13:34 AM »
 No worries, its awesome that you're back!
 :D
If there is a hidden seed of evil inside of children adults planted it there -LundyBancroft  Self-awareness is the ability to take an honest look at your life without any attachment to it being right or wrong good or bad -DebbieFord The greatest of faults is to be conscious of none -Thomas Carlyle