uPD sisters are continuing the cycle with their kids.

[peaceinthepines]

It's heartbreaking.
They scream at their children and their children are starting to show the same signs of a volatile household that my sisters and I did as children.

My husband and I have made it a distinct, deliberate point to raise our baby in a calm, loving household where we don't use yelling as a way to resolve anything. Unfortunately, my sisters-- who think they have life figured out and will continue to remind me of it-- scream at their children, physically drag them around, make them feel awful about themselves, etc. They think they're excellent parents.

Here's an example: My uPD older sister's youngest child (6yo), who may have an undiagnosed mental/behavioral disorder, defecated outside near the back door. I thought it was dog poo, but he exclaimed that he did it-- without regret. My mother and I were afraid to tell my sister, but she came outside and saw it. She grabbed a plastic bag and picked it up, then came outside and practically rushed her little child, yelling at him. "I can't believe I just had to pick up your POOP! That's DISGUSTING. You do NOT do that!" Just absolutely screaming at him, just like my uNPD or uBPD father used to do to us. She was humiliating him and he was crying and calling her names. She took his toys away. Later, she walked away and he said, in a sad voice  "She tells me and {brother} to just let things go after a fight, but she never lets it go! She never forgets it!" And he cried more. Then I asked if he wanted to come with me to go for a ride, and she overheard and said "I will NOT reward him for this behavior." Her face was red and she was holding it against him. She never asked him why he would do that, she never talked calmly to him, she never hugged him. Ever. She was embarrassed and took it out on him.

I had to walk away during the event because my own child was scared of her. I'm afraid of her anger, too.

And then my diagnosed BPD younger sister, recently: Her also 6yo son didn't want to go home from his grandmother's house yesterday and he got sad. She escalated it and screamed that he won't be able to EVER stay home from summer camp again (because he was allowed to that day) and "actually, [you] will not be spending time over at your grandmother's AT ALL." The same type of threats my uPDfather used to give us. Then she walked quickly at him and he said he didn't want to clean up before leaving and she yelled "WHAT DID YOU SAY TO ME?!" and he screamed and ran. Then she came back to my mom and I and said "WHAT?!?!" defensively when she thought my mom and I "looked at each other." I didn't look at my mom, but I know she was paranoid that we were uncomfortable with how she dealt with the situation.

I'm so disappointed with them. They are perpetuating the problem. They are continuing the cycle.  My older sister enables my father and infantilizes me and my mother. My younger sister demonizes my father (rightly so), but acts just like him. My older sister's oldest boy who is 10 years old said he has a "troubled childhood" to my husband. My husband and I are just going to make sure that they always have us to talk to and to understand that it's not normal to be afraid of your parents. That's the only reason we're not going full No Contact with them...we want their kids to have someone to talk to.

[PeanutButter]

peaceinthepines that is incredibly heartbreaking! Im so sorry. Im sorry for all the children.
Unfortunately this is an example of intergenerational abuse. By the time we are born into it it is usually several generations in.
IME the enablers are just as responsible as the active abusers. They give a silent audience to it therefore are actually participating. There is no excuse for a parent acting in the way you described. There is no excuse in a parent watching idly a parent acting in the way you describe.imo
Im glad you are aware, addressed wounds from childhood, and chose to lovingly teach your child.

[peaceinthepines]

peaceinthepines that is incredibly heartbreaking! Im so sorry. Im sorry for all the children.
Unfortunately this is an example of intergenerational abuse. By the time we are born into it it is usually several generations in.
IME the enablers are just as responsible as the active abusers. They give a silent audience to it therefore are actually participating. There is no excuse for a parent acting in the way you described. There is no excuse in a parent watching idly a parent acting in the way you describe.imo
Im glad you are aware, addressed wounds from childhood, and chose to lovingly teach your child.

Ah, this is so true and I'm feeling a lot of guilt for not calling them out on this behavior enough. I have recently called my own PDfather out for yelling at my nephew and it threw my entire family for a loop. I was afraid to do it again to my sisters, but I want to protect my nephews. I will speak to my sisters.

ETA: My fear is that speaking to them won't change a thing besides making them guarantee I never see my nephews again.

[PeanutButter]

peaceinthepines that is incredibly heartbreaking! Im so sorry. Im sorry for all the children.
Unfortunately this is an example of intergenerational abuse. By the time we are born into it it is usually several generations in.
IME the enablers are just as responsible as the active abusers. They give a silent audience to it therefore are actually participating. There is no excuse for a parent acting in the way you described. There is no excuse in a parent watching idly a parent acting in the way you describe.imo
Im glad you are aware, addressed wounds from childhood, and chose to lovingly teach your child.

Ah, this is so true and I'm feeling a lot of guilt for not calling them out on this behavior enough. I have recently called my own PDfather out for yelling at my nephew and it threw my entire family for a loop. I was afraid to do it again to my sisters, but I want to protect my nephews. I will speak to my sisters.

ETA: My fear is that speaking to them won't change a thing besides making them guarantee I never see my nephews again.

No you speaking up wont change anything. I understand you trying though. Imo the only person who has the power to change the situation is the 'other' parent.

My enF gave a silent audience to my ubpdM's verbal, emotional, and physical abuse!

I know how sad, mad, and hopeless it seems. But I think you being a calm adult your nephews can always come to talk to is a wonderful 'gift'.

Again Im so sorry for you and your nephews!

[JenniferSmith]

This is very sad!!  The best thing you can do is make sure you stay in their lives so they know they have family that loves them. Maybe there will be times you can have them visit at your home, so they get to experience what safety feels like. And as they get older, you can tell them that they should talk to you or their teacher if they ever feel unsafe at home.

When I was quite young- probably age 1-2 through 8-9, I was physically abused by my nmother. Most of this was slapping me repeatedly across my face and or hitting me on the head.   When I became an adult, my paternal grandmother told me she had once witnessed this abuse and she told my father that he better do something about it or she would try to take me to live with her.  At least she was trying to do something to help.

With my two siblngs, they have each had kids. We are estranged so I don't see them or ther kids, but I hope that having children will cause my sibling to get his anger in check so he can be a good father. I hope he is able to turn  it around and be a good father

[PeanutButter]

Yes I believe having healthy interactions with you and your family could make the difference for those children!
They can observe the difference, by having a healthy example to compare their family to. That could be the catalysts to your nephews becoming determined to break the cycle of their FOO's disfunction. If not for you they might not know soon enough that there is a different choice they can make?

I hope your doing well. Let us have an update when/if you feel comfortable. We support you and understand what a difficult challenge you have wanting to help them.

Hold compassion for yourself too. You are only the aunt so that limits what you can do.