How would you feel when they're gone?

[goofycrumble]

My mother called on Sunday to say Dad is going downhill. It's to be expected due to his dementia and age (84).

My first post explains https://www.outofthefog.net/forum/index.php?topic=79841.0 their lifelong dysfunction

Mother is concerned about the financial side of losing her social security money if she claims his as a widow. I've made calls and done my best but I really can't help. The government will only speak with her. I'm just calling crematoriums to find the most cost effective option since of course they never had a funeral plan and I'll end up paying. I was furloughed in April (live far away in the UK) and Mum stopped calling asking for cash as she thought the money fountain ran dry. The company asked me back in May but I've not said a word to her

I wanted to see how she would get on and so far she begs from other family and makes due. My therapist says I'm under no obligation to tell her if I'm working yet as she in reality sees me as a resource to consume. So I've just been helping quietly making calls and putting cash aside for the final preparations

One thing in the midst of all this is I am looking forward to Dad passing. He is suffering and his life was always mediocre and sad. He had a terrible relationship with his family and screwed up most of his life. I feel like its one down one left to go. I'm worried I am becoming a unsympathetic psychopath. I think deep down I'm just want them gone. No more toxicity, no more chaos and resentful family grudges for decades. No more bleeding me and the family dry for handouts and fixing their bad decisions and stupid choices. Undiagnosed mental illness and disorders take a toll everyone around it and I'm so done. I told my SO that i'm grateful for COVID because there are travel restrictions and funerals where Mum is are also restricted. I was dreading having to organise a service to invite angry relatives and inform estranged friends.

It feels weird that I laugh, and enjoy friends and i'm not dropping everything and panicking losing my wits. I feel calm. Very strange feeling. Like I care but then again not so much anymore?

Has anyone else felt this?

[SunnyMeadow]

One thing in the midst of all this is I am looking forward to Dad passing. He is suffering and his life was always mediocre and sad. He had a terrible relationship with his family and screwed up most of his life. I feel like its one down one left to go. I'm worried I am becoming a unsympathetic psychopath. I think deep down I'm just want them gone. No more toxicity, no more chaos and resentful family grudges for decades.
Has anyone else felt this?

I feel this every single day and can't wait for my day of freedom. A huge weight will be lifted when I can live without chaos, poor me and drama. This is a safe space to share these feelings. From what's posted here, many people are in the same situation.

I've gone a step further to look up all the symptoms she has and try to determine what's going to put an end to her and how long it might take.    I do worry that I'm becoming an unsympathetic, evil person to have these thoughts but I keep in mind, she caused this! 

Good thinking not telling her you're back to work. If you become useless to her because you aren't giving her money, maybe she'll leave you alone and move on to others.    A few days ago I had a 'should I tell or not tell' situation and received good advice here. Which is basically, 'what they don't know, can't hurt me'!

[Psuedonym]

Hi goofycrumble and SunnyMeadow,

As someone who has been through this whole process I can tell you both that your prediction of feeling relieved and happier when they are finally gone is 100% correct, if not a bit of an understatement.

I was close to by my dad, who was an enabler but a kind person (as most are) and it was awful when he got very sick and eventually died. M (aka Negatron) was an entirely different story. She made the last year of my dad's life hell and the year after that was even worse. When I finally dropped the rope and went NC I was starting to have panic attacks at work. I'm 5'8" and I'd gotten down to about 112 lbs from not eating. It was no bueno. After that my wonderful H kept in contact with her and we'd get her groceries and books and manage her finances, etc. but I didn't speak to her in the last year and a half of her life. Still I felt this weight, like this black cloud hanging over me. I'd cringe every time I'd hear H's phone ring, thinking it was her and I'd be wondering what shoe would drop next. I'd also be fighting off constantly thinking about the situation, imagining her being miserable and alone in her beautiful AL apartment, which was her constant complaint (of course the director of the facility acted surprised when my husband mentioned this and said she had 'quite the circle of friends' But you know the drill, you get it ground into you how sad and lonely and depressed and upset they are your whole life. And of course there was the smear campaign she ran against me for a year and a half, calling pretty much everybody in her phone book, everyone she met, and of course my H, what a monster I was.

And then about 5 weeks ago I got a call from the hospital saying she was in a coma and wouldn't make it through the day. She'd gone in for some tests, taken a turn for the worse, and that was it. She died that day. And I felt: euphoric. I think that's the best description of what I felt. I felt like I'd won the lottery. I felt like this black cloud of dread and guilt was just, gone. The black hole of endless neediness and self pity just disappeared. I think I wrote in another post that I realized it was like swimming in the ocean towing a 20 pound anchor. Once the anchor is gone, everything is infinitely easer. I felt finally free of this burden that not only had profoundly negatively impacted my life, but that no one else could even see, because, like most PDs, she hid a lot of her dysfunction from most people.

Five weeks out, I still feel that way. I do have moments when I feel sad over the situation in general, but it doesn't come close to the relief. I have been having dreams about her and the worst experiences and emotions I felt at that time, but honestly, even those aren't really bad, because I wake up and I feel, more relief.

Of course neither of you are sociopaths. You know this because you care deeply about other people. My therapist once described it to me this way, if you know she's never going to change, never going to accept boundaries, and never going to accept you not being her emotional support animal/dumping ground/punching bag/therapist, then what else is going to change things other than her death? That's just logical. That helped me and maybe it will help you, too. Things will get better, one way or the other, and don't ever feel bad about wanting someone who brings you nothing but misery out of your life. Any healthy person would feel the way you do.

[lkdrymom]

Count me as a person who understands how you feel. My father has had no quality of life for the past two years.  Now he has Covid and is going down fast.  This may actually be the end. I want his suffering and my worrying to be over. I will feel a bit sad at times but overall this will be the best for everyone.  I just did a Facetime with him an hour ago. He is barely conscious and did not know what was going on. It is no way to live.

[Maxtrem]

This article written by a doctor explain that your fealings are totaly normal :
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-intelligent-divorce/201405/the-borderline-mother

[SunnyMeadow]

That's an eye-opening article, Maxtrem. It helps me to understand my feelings a little better. Thanks for sharing!

[Maxtrem]

You're welcome, I think it's really a common feeling we have towards an abusive parent. It's not the person we want to see disappear, it's the abuse. Without wishing my uBPDm dead, every time she threatens to commit suicide (she does it to excess every time she doesn't get what she wants), I can't help but have this thought that tells me that my life would be so much easier without her. Recently a narc. uncle died and the first thought I had was that this was going to be deliverance for two of his children!   

[Pepin]

While it hasn't happened yet, I know I will feel relieved and...safe.  I have already spent more than I should, grieving.  In fact, when both NF and PDmil are gone, I will likely be unable to stop smiling; smiling is something that is extremely difficult for me and has been for quite some time.  Really, I've been trying so hard to live like they aren't here but in the back of my mind, they are.  I'm NC with NF and with PDmil it is more complicated because DH is still in denial about her.  LC for her from me.  I am ready to move on and be free from these people of the older generation in my life that have caused considerable damage - not just to me but many others. 

[Ariel]

Wow Maxtrem that article hit home. Everything you all said I feel. And feel guilty feeling it. My dad also had dementia and was treated horribly by my mom , verbal abuse, neglect and sometimes hit him, I wanted to take him with me but he was horrible at night without and got very agitated, I was relieved when he died because he was st peace, was safe and was happy in heaven.
My moo makes me feel horrible 90 percent of the time and when she doesn't I'm waiting for it, I just want peace I just want it to be over too. I know she won't change, won't love me so I also want this torture to end

[raindrop]

Just been through this and felt exactly the same. M recently passed(last week) and I do feel relief, as well as sadness, anger, a whole host of things. I was mostly estranged but having to deal with the constant hoovering and guilt attempts was exhausting. Now she's gone I'm also aware I could get sucked back into my old family role as it was the whole system that reinforced it.

I wrote a post about it over at the NC board.

https://www.outofthefog.net/forum/index.php?topic=85201.0

You are definitely not a psychopath! It's not like you want them to die, it's that you need relief from the unbearable pressure.

My thoughts and live are with you :hugs:

[p123]

My mother called on Sunday to say Dad is going downhill. It's to be expected due to his dementia and age (84).

My first post explains https://www.outofthefog.net/forum/index.php?topic=79841.0 their lifelong dysfunction

Mother is concerned about the financial side of losing her social security money if she claims his as a widow. I've made calls and done my best but I really can't help. The government will only speak with her. I'm just calling crematoriums to find the most cost effective option since of course they never had a funeral plan and I'll end up paying. I was furloughed in April (live far away in the UK) and Mum stopped calling asking for cash as she thought the money fountain ran dry. The company asked me back in May but I've not said a word to her

I wanted to see how she would get on and so far she begs from other family and makes due. My therapist says I'm under no obligation to tell her if I'm working yet as she in reality sees me as a resource to consume. So I've just been helping quietly making calls and putting cash aside for the final preparations

One thing in the midst of all this is I am looking forward to Dad passing. He is suffering and his life was always mediocre and sad. He had a terrible relationship with his family and screwed up most of his life. I feel like its one down one left to go. I'm worried I am becoming a unsympathetic psychopath. I think deep down I'm just want them gone. No more toxicity, no more chaos and resentful family grudges for decades. No more bleeding me and the family dry for handouts and fixing their bad decisions and stupid choices. Undiagnosed mental illness and disorders take a toll everyone around it and I'm so done. I told my SO that i'm grateful for COVID because there are travel restrictions and funerals where Mum is are also restricted. I was dreading having to organise a service to invite angry relatives and inform estranged friends.

It feels weird that I laugh, and enjoy friends and i'm not dropping everything and panicking losing my wits. I feel calm. Very strange feeling. Like I care but then again not so much anymore?

Has anyone else felt this?

Hi goofy - im in uk too - wales....

That must be so tough with the money thing. I'd do the same about the job to be honest.....
Do they REALLY need the money you give them to live? I'd say no since they've done without it now for a few months....

Yes agree. Lockdown has been good. Didnt see Dad for months and I'll be honest didnt miss him AT ALL. Hes ramping thing up massively now though which was not unexpected.

Will I be sad when he goes? To be honest, I worry that, at his funeral, I wont even be sad at all. Dad used to be OK - had his ways but he was OK. Over the last 10 years hes become the most selfish, self-centred, spiteful old man I've ever met. If he wasn't my Dad I'd never speak to him. I dream of moving away and not seeing him.

So, I've mourned the last decade for him - what I lost. All the nice things about him slowly faded away and it made me so sad and angry. Whats left is an angry old man.

[lkdrymom]

Well he is gone. A victim of Covid 19.  I'm not sure how I feel. I'm not really feeling anything.  It is sad that the person he was 20 years ago is gone. A blessing that the person he has been for the last 2 years is gone.  I lost a lot of sleep over him yet I am still not sleeping well. I expected people to be more nostalgic about him passing but they seemed more interested in catching up with one another. It is like he is already forgotten. He was a big PITA to me most of the time but to others he was the fun guy. It is just weird.

[SunnyMeadow]

Well he is gone. A victim of Covid 19.  I'm not sure how I feel. I'm not really feeling anything.  It is sad that the person he was 20 years ago is gone.

I never know the correct thing to say when a PD person passes on. Sorry for your loss is what I'd usually say but in our case, it doesn't sound right. It is sad that the person he used to be is gone. I think the way you're feeling is to be expected. I hope I feel the same when my time comes.

I'll be thinking of you lkdrymom. 

[lkdrymom]

Well he is gone. A victim of Covid 19.  I'm not sure how I feel. I'm not really feeling anything.  It is sad that the person he was 20 years ago is gone.

I never know the correct thing to say when a PD person passes on. Sorry for your loss is what I'd usually say but in our case, it doesn't sound right. It is sad that the person he used to be is gone. I think the way you're feeling is to be expected. I hope I feel the same when my time comes.

I'll be thinking of you lkdrymom. 

Thank you.  I feel like I mourned him two years ago. It is a very weird feeling. I don't know how else to describe it.

[WomanInterrupted]

I understand - please take good care of yourself, Lkdrymom!   

When Ray died a few months ago, I felt the same way - I felt nothing because I'd mourned the father I never had years ago, and I was more annoyed that THIS was now taking up a portion of my day.   

It was a very strange feeling - I didn't have the elation I had with Didi's passing (I was FREE!  The monster of my nightmares couldn't keep reaching out to try to grab me in her pincers!).  It was more ambivalence?  A sense that somebody HAD to have made a mistake because Ray was just too damned stupid to die?  A sense that it was just TOO easy?

I don't know, but it was definitely weird - and like all things, that too passed. 

Eventually, it sinks in - nobody is going to call from the nursing home about this, that, the other, he fell, he acted out, he lashed out, he defiled a bathroom, he tried to re-enact the movie, "The Great Escape" - none of it. 

And there will be NO more of those ridiculous, "You gotta come now - I gotta ask you something!" calls.

I'd been NC for over 4 years and I still lived with a vague sense of unease I'd get one or more of those.

The whole thing was a like a non-event.  The world was busy with other problems.  I was busy with my own stuff.  Ray's FOO of that generation had mostly passed away and I was no longer the focus of an enormous amount of ill-will.  People had other things to do.  Life went on, and it was like Ray had never existed at all.

It's odd the little things that are lifted away, too - sure, you'd probably decided you were never taking your dad out for a meal again (the whole catheter and logistics of the car situations), having him in your home for the holidays, or going to the ER after any of those things because he'd Just happened to get SO sick when out - those are *no longer things that can be lobbed in your direction like hand grenades!*   

You're free of that niggling dread - will he ask?  Will it just be expected of me?  Will I have to stonewall or go dark?

None of the above - your life is your own again and your holidays (as well as any other days) are free to spend as you see fit. 

It gets better - just give yourself the time and latitude to get comfortable with the new reality.  I think  you'll be surprised at how well it fits - and suits you. 

[lkdrymom]

I really thought I would have a huge sense of relief but until everything is settled that feeling will not come. I am through the funeral so one thing down. Now on to settling the estate. I am hoping once that is over I will feel some peace.

I was lucky, for quite awhile he had been pretty quiet at assisted living.  Then when he fell in May and ended up with Covid....we went back to all the phone calls and dealing with this, that, and the other problems.  Everything was an emergency. I am the type of person that plans ahead so I don't have emergencies to deal with. Very frustrating having crap fall out of the sky onto you.

[raindrop]

Well he is gone. A victim of Covid 19.  I'm not sure how I feel. I'm not really feeling anything.  It is sad that the person he was 20 years ago is gone. A blessing that the person he has been for the last 2 years is gone.  I lost a lot of sleep over him yet I am still not sleeping well. I expected people to be more nostalgic about him passing but they seemed more interested in catching up with one another. It is like he is already forgotten. He was a big PITA to me most of the time but to others he was the fun guy. It is just weird.

I am sorry. Sorry for what you lost and what you never had, and the legacy you're still carrying. I hope you are taking care of yourself ok.

Xx raindrop

[Adrianna]

I really thought I would have a huge sense of relief but until everything is settled that feeling will not come. I am through the funeral so one thing down. Now on to settling the estate. I am hoping once that is over I will feel some peace.

I was lucky, for quite awhile he had been pretty quiet at assisted living.  Then when he fell in May and ended up with Covid....we went back to all the phone calls and dealing with this, that, and the other problems.  Everything was an emergency. I am the type of person that plans ahead so I don't have emergencies to deal with. Very frustrating having crap fall out of the sky onto you.

I am sorry for what you are going through but understand that whatever you are feeling is normal. My grandmother is obviously still alive but when she went into the nursing home, I had a very hard time adjusting to not being on pins and needles wondering what chaos was around the corner with her. Panic attacks over the phone ringing. It took me months to let go of the feeling that I was pushing back a wave of anxiety and pressure that she put upon me. I still get anxiety when I get that random call from the nursing home, wondering what trouble she's creating. I don't think I'll be at peace with her situation until she is gone. It's always in the back of my mind that she is sitting up there wanting me to bring her home, give up my life basically and arrange 24/7 servants for her, who she would no doubt abuse anyway. She's 45 minutes away but still in my head.

It's really CPTSD, like we were in a long, drawn out war, and we went home after the war, trying to get back to normal, but not being able to fully enjoy that freedom yet. It's trauma recovery in my opinion. Long-standing emotional abuse and manipulation takes a toll and it's not a quick recovery. It may take a while until you really feel relief from the situation, mixed in with regret for the life he could have had these last few years, had he not had a personality disorder.

[BefuddledClarity]

How would you feel when they're gone?

It'd be either 1 of 2 things.

The first, feeling nothing at all. Nothing, because I'm **NC/VLC and would move on as if nothing happened.

The second, being a range of emotions. Angry that I didn't get to have the parents I needed/wanted. Guilty for having terrible thoughts, but ultimately relieved that I don't have to look behind my back anymore and feel anxious or dread.


**I want to say I'm NC but they somehow creep back up in my life to where they're technically VLC.

[lightereveryday]

newbie here.

So I just found out about the term "self orphaning".
I used to tell people in high school that I was an orphan. Looking back on my dating history (aka repeated cycles of loving narcs) I realize that, most of my past lovers were...you guessed it, adopted or orphaned. I've never dated anyone with parents.
Which is funny because I have a helicopter narc mom and an enabler enmeshed dad. NC just under a year.

To get back to the question at hand,

I'll feel aligned with myself when they pass. I used to wish through tears of guilt that my mom would pass away magically, and that my brother and dad could have space to heal and maybe even have contact with me. Now, this father figure I wished to have been left with, I realize has not been who I remember him to be, for a long long time now. He had given up and given in. He barely lives as is, so in his case I think I'd be grateful that his spirit is finally free.

I don't feel guilty but I dread the inevitable stares and whispers which are product of the multi decade smear campaign, at the first funeral.