Psych rewriting history/reversing diagnosis?

[anxiousmom]

Hi all,

I know it's been awhile since I've posted, which isn't to say it's been drama-free. In fact, it's been one stupid obstacle after another since the interjection of ex NPD's now-fiance, who has to control every interaction that occurs.

My main issue I'm seeking advice or perhaps feedback on is something that was recently revealed to me by my ex NPD.

He was diagnosed with bipolar when we were married. It was a little surprising, as he didn't seem to have extreme manic phases, but he was diagnosed as type 2 - hypomanic. I would make the argument it was always just the narcissism, not bipolar, but we all know how difficult it is to get that diagnosis in the mental health community. Either way, he is not a stable person.

During our latest meeting with our parenting facilitator, I pointed out that our new order instructs that his psychiatrist be able to communicate with our PF about medication and compliance. After becoming very defensive, he divulged that "I should know" that his psychiatrist (same one he went to when we were married, who sent him to the mental institution for a week long stay at one point, but who has since the divorce years ago seemed to be fooled by ex's re-writing of history) has "decided" that ex does NOT have a bipolar diagnosis, despite it being confirmed by two doctors. His reasoning was that "it was always related to alcohol use and since ex has been sober, he hasn't had any manic phases, so he must not have bipolar."

Well, here's the problem with that. My ex NEVER had an alcohol problem. And I mean never. He was diagnosed when we were married, after he cheated on me and things went really downhill, and alcohol/substance abuse was never an issue. In fact, in his assessment forms at the mental hospital, they rated him a zero on the substance abuse chart.

During the divorce, he told me he started going to AA. I always questioned him WHY he went to AA, since he wasn't an alcoholic and did not have a drinking problem, but he informed me that it wasn't about the alcohol, but about the program. He went through the steps and always did a great job not only playing the "reformed alcoholic" but used his "sobriety" as an example of how he was really getting his life together.

Now, we have yet to hear from the psychiatrist, so maybe he will give a completely different story, but has anyone heard of a mentally ill person being successful in rewriting history so much that a psychiatrist "removes" their previous diagnosis by two other doctors? It just doesn't seem like something that a mental health professional would do, and I'm perplexed by the idea that he would just take my ex's word at reporting all these previous incidences involved alcohol when there is clear unbiased documentation that it did not.

Thoughts?

TIA!

[Stepping lightly]

Hi anxiousmom,

I would say that it isn't possible to remove a mental health diagnosis, but that if anyone can do it, a narcissist can!  I say it can't be removed because BM in our situation forced a false mental health diagnosis on DSS in order to gain control of a child that had seen her mask slip.  The diagnosis was given SOLELY on her/her Bf's input (and she cut DH out of the process), and the psychiatrist refused to hear from DH or teachers or anyone else once we found out what was going on.  We were devastated- labeling a 10 year old with a false mental issue...that will never go away- and everyone we talked to confirmed it.  Even at the point we jumped in to stop it, it was "too late" for it not to stick for the duration.  Even if we had proven malpractice, we were told the diagnosis would stay....nothing would erase it.

Now- on the flip side- BM is what we have gathered to be a nice blend of BPD/NPD, and incredibly intelligent.  The things she has convinced doctor's of (see above) are beyond comprehension.  I think they are insistent enough, they can make all kinds of magic happen that we ...as non's, would never be capable of.

I guess it comes down to how he behaves now and if the PF has access to his psychiatrist.  He can say he doesn't have BP, but does he act like it?

[mamato3]

It's actually really very common for psych diagnoses to change throughout life as more information is known.  You said yourself it was a surprising diagnosis for him to have since you didn't feel he fit the symptoms.

[anxiousmom]

Right, but that was before it was confirmed by another doctor - and removed "because" of a substance abuse problem he has literally NEVER had...that's what gets me.

I'd understand if it was removed and replaced with something else that made sense, but this psychiatrist was involved in these mental breaks and should have the medical records to show they had nothing to do with alcohol. So to go back and blame it on ALCOHOL...? He was THERE when this was happening. How can he possibly be fooled by ex's re-writing of history?

[anxiousmom]

Yes, and I can tell you the last time (I know of) that he went off his bipolar meds several years ago, he had a total psychiatric break. He was stalking me, going through my trash, calling me in hysterics, threatening to buy a gun, etc. His psychiatrist was involved during this episode.

And now all of a sudden the same psychiatrist says he doesn't have it because of a made up reason no one discussed or recognized when it was going on? Seems very bizarre!

Hi anxiousmom,

I would say that it isn't possible to remove a mental health diagnosis, but that if anyone can do it, a narcissist can!  I say it can't be removed because BM in our situation forced a false mental health diagnosis on DSS in order to gain control of a child that had seen her mask slip.  The diagnosis was given SOLELY on her/her Bf's input (and she cut DH out of the process), and the psychiatrist refused to hear from DH or teachers or anyone else once we found out what was going on.  We were devastated- labeling a 10 year old with a false mental issue...that will never go away- and everyone we talked to confirmed it.  Even at the point we jumped in to stop it, it was "too late" for it not to stick for the duration.  Even if we had proven malpractice, we were told the diagnosis would stay....nothing would erase it.

Now- on the flip side- BM is what we have gathered to be a nice blend of BPD/NPD, and incredibly intelligent.  The things she has convinced doctor's of (see above) are beyond comprehension.  I think they are insistent enough, they can make all kinds of magic happen that we ...as non's, would never be capable of.

I guess it comes down to how he behaves now and if the PF has access to his psychiatrist.  He can say he doesn't have BP, but does he act like it?

[mamato3]

Yes, and I can tell you the last time (I know of) that he went off his bipolar meds several years ago, he had a total psychiatric break. He was stalking me, going through my trash, calling me in hysterics, threatening to buy a gun, etc. His psychiatrist was involved during this episode.

And now all of a sudden the same psychiatrist says he doesn't have it because of a made up reason no one discussed or recognized when it was going on? Seems very bizarre!

Hi anxiousmom,

I would say that it isn't possible to remove a mental health diagnosis, but that if anyone can do it, a narcissist can!  I say it can't be removed because BM in our situation forced a false mental health diagnosis on DSS in order to gain control of a child that had seen her mask slip.  The diagnosis was given SOLELY on her/her Bf's input (and she cut DH out of the process), and the psychiatrist refused to hear from DH or teachers or anyone else once we found out what was going on.  We were devastated- labeling a 10 year old with a false mental issue...that will never go away- and everyone we talked to confirmed it.  Even at the point we jumped in to stop it, it was "too late" for it not to stick for the duration.  Even if we had proven malpractice, we were told the diagnosis would stay....nothing would erase it.

Now- on the flip side- BM is what we have gathered to be a nice blend of BPD/NPD, and incredibly intelligent.  The things she has convinced doctor's of (see above) are beyond comprehension.  I think they are insistent enough, they can make all kinds of magic happen that we ...as non's, would never be capable of.

I guess it comes down to how he behaves now and if the PF has access to his psychiatrist.  He can say he doesn't have BP, but does he act like it?

What hinges on the BP diagnosis?

[GettingOOTF]

Does he have anything a court would accept to back this up? This wasn’t clear to me from your post.

My BPDxH would say all kinds of stuff about how well he was doing. Once he gave me permission to speak with psychiatrist and the dr told a totally different story.

The fact that he became defensive is a massive waving red flag to me. If he had the proof and what he said was true then he wouldn’t have needed to be defensive. This is a deflection. I would proceed under the original assumption until there is proof from his dr that states otherwise.

My ex is terrifying when off his medication. Please be careful.

[anxiousmom]

I'm not sure I understand your question?

Yes, and I can tell you the last time (I know of) that he went off his bipolar meds several years ago, he had a total psychiatric break. He was stalking me, going through my trash, calling me in hysterics, threatening to buy a gun, etc. His psychiatrist was involved during this episode.

And now all of a sudden the same psychiatrist says he doesn't have it because of a made up reason no one discussed or recognized when it was going on? Seems very bizarre!

Hi anxiousmom,

I would say that it isn't possible to remove a mental health diagnosis, but that if anyone can do it, a narcissist can!  I say it can't be removed because BM in our situation forced a false mental health diagnosis on DSS in order to gain control of a child that had seen her mask slip.  The diagnosis was given SOLELY on her/her Bf's input (and she cut DH out of the process), and the psychiatrist refused to hear from DH or teachers or anyone else once we found out what was going on.  We were devastated- labeling a 10 year old with a false mental issue...that will never go away- and everyone we talked to confirmed it.  Even at the point we jumped in to stop it, it was "too late" for it not to stick for the duration.  Even if we had proven malpractice, we were told the diagnosis would stay....nothing would erase it.

Now- on the flip side- BM is what we have gathered to be a nice blend of BPD/NPD, and incredibly intelligent.  The things she has convinced doctor's of (see above) are beyond comprehension.  I think they are insistent enough, they can make all kinds of magic happen that we ...as non's, would never be capable of.

I guess it comes down to how he behaves now and if the PF has access to his psychiatrist.  He can say he doesn't have BP, but does he act like it?

What hinges on the BP diagnosis?

[anxiousmom]

I'm not sure what "proof" he has, and we still have yet to hear from the psychiatrist so I'm hoping he paints a different picture.

It's just extremely scary to think one mental health professional could be so easily fooled into rewriting history, and then there goes my ability to have a safety net in court if things get bad with ex's mental health again.

Does he have anything a court would accept to back this up? This wasn't clear to me from your post.

My BPDxH would say all kinds of stuff about how well he was doing. Once he gave me permission to speak with psychiatrist and the dr told a totally different story.

The fact that he became defensive is a massive waving red flag to me. If he had the proof and what he said was true then he wouldn't have needed to be defensive. This is a deflection. I would proceed under the original assumption until there is proof from his dr that states otherwise.

My ex is terrifying when off his medication. Please be careful.

[CagedBirdSinging]

Hi anxiousmom, is there any way you could call the psychiatrist to talk to them independently?
My pdH told me he'd had an appointment with his psychiatrist and had told the psych that all his mental health issues were because of x *a totally unrelated health issue. He said the psych agreed and was basically discharging him. I phoned the psych in a panic, only to be told that: they did not believe my H, he was NOT being discharged, and he has serious mental health issues (pd). Basically H had told me a load of lies about what psychiatrist said. I'm wondering if this is the case with your ex? Perhaps if you could phone the psych they might be able to offer reassurance?

[mamato3]

Hi anxiousmom, is there any way you could call the psychiatrist to talk to them independently?
My pdH told me he'd had an appointment with his psychiatrist and had told the psych that all his mental health issues were because of x *a totally unrelated health issue. He said the psych agreed and was basically discharging him. I phoned the psych in a panic, only to be told that: they did not believe my H, he was NOT being discharged, and he has serious mental health issues (pd). Basically H had told me a load of lies about what psychiatrist said. I'm wondering if this is the case with your ex? Perhaps if you could phone the psych they might be able to offer reassurance?

That would be a huge, ugly HIPAA violation.

[hhaw]

Just bc the PD said a thing... doesn't make the thing true, IME.

PDs SAY a lot of things to many people.

They're disordered.  They say disordered nonsensical things more often than not, IME. 

[GettingOOTF]

You can call his doctor and let him know your concerns. This is what I did when things were really bad with my BPDxH. The doctor couldn’t tell me anything but it was helpful for me to fill him him on what was going on.  Your ex is only one patient who the doctor sees for a very short time and you have no idea what he is telling his doctor.

I honestly would take anything your ex says with a pinch of salt. People don’t magically “get better”. As I said before my ex was terrifying when off his medication. And probably worse than his moods was his lack of self care. He’d wear filthy clothes, not shower, throw trash on the floor, eat really unhealthy meals and drink to much.  Given you have kids in this situation him having to be transparent about taking his medication is not unreasonable.

It’s unlikely that any changes will be made to the agreement on his say-so and it’s likely that if he no longer has a bi-polar diagnosis he has a new diagnosis.

Yes a persons diagnosis can change. My ex was diagnosed with depression but after a hospitalization he as diagnosed with BPD. It’s really difficult for doctors to give an accurate mental health diagnosis when they spend so little time with their patients. My ex needed to be hospitalized to get a more accurate diagnosis.  His psychiatrist explained to me that they give a BPD diagnosis when the patient didn’t meet all the criteria for Schizophrenia so this was very far from a “better” diagnosis.

Yes some conditions improve, but some conditions get worse. Do what you need to do to protect yourself and your children.

[Penny Lane]

Just bc the PD said a thing... doesn't make the thing true, IME.

PDs SAY a lot of things to many people.

They're disordered.  They say disordered nonsensical things more often than not, IME.

[Rose1]

Exbpdh was diagnosed with bi polar and bad and medicated for bi polar.  He used to mess around with his mess and also became scary.

He told me his doctor had said he no longer required medication. I knew the doctor well and decided to ask if this was true. The doctor said "I told him that if he was going to mess around with his medication like he is that he may as well not bother with it" not the same thing at all.

They make things up. When questioned ex knew exactly what the  doctor had said, what it meant and that going on and off medication could make him worse.