Would this be an appropriate way to enforce a boundary?

[DancingStar]

Please excuse me if this comes across weedy and silly and a bit venting but I am rather new to setting boundaries after realising that for 60 years I've not had any.

I'd describe my mother as a waify/queen covert N.    She's 86 and was recently widowed from my step dad.  She previously lived 200 miles away but she's living for the time being with my sister 10 minutes down the road from me.   I really enjoy my sister's company and love to visit her, but now mum is living there too it means I get to spend lots of time with her.   I'd forgotten how resentful/bitchy/judgmental she is of other people.  And how easily she loses her temper if she's not getting her own way.  She's like a spoiled 86 year old child.   

Yesterday in a conversation with me she was bitching about my 2 nieces.  One of them - who has gone to live with a friend so my mum can have her bedroom - she said she didn't like because she was lazy (niece had visited and sat wrapped in a blanket on the sofa instead of helping her mother with cleaning or whatever).   My other niece has recently moved into a flat with her boyfriend and my sis had bought her a washing machine and hoover, and this according to my mum's rant makes her dis likable because she's greedy and what kind of child takes off their parents like that and how she (mum) would never have dreamed of taking a penny from my grandma & grandpa.

I love my nephews and nieces (curiously the nephews can do no wrong in my mum's eyes unlike the nieces).   I like them as people and like spending time with them.    I wasn't going to agree with my mother that they are lazy and greedy,  imo they're not,  but never really said anything except that times have changed and it's not unusual for parents these days to help their kids.   But that didn't seem enough - I wanted to say "I don't want to listen to you running down & being horrible about people I love and care about.  If you don't stop I am going to leave the room"  But I wasn't sure if that was over the top and inappropriate.  Also, I know that the result would be either tears because I'm so mean to her, or impatient bad temper while she told me how bad tempered I am (the irony) .

So, would saying "I don't want to listen to you running down & being horrible about people I love and care about.  If you don't stop I am going to leave the room" be appropriate?   How would you deal with it?

[lkdrymom]

Maybe point out that the 'lazy' one gave up her room so that judgmental mom would have a room to herself.

[11JB68]

I started to basically refuse to fan the flames when uocpdh would go off on other people. Medium chill. When he complains about his sister and her kids who we really have no relationship with I say it's really not our concern.
I think it's appropriate to say "I'm not comfortable participating in a negative discussion about people who are not here to defend themselves" and yes, leave if it doesn't stop. I think you can state what you are not comfortable with, without calling her (or implying that she's being) horrible.
I think the key is to make it about you not her

[Psuedonym]

11JB68 makes a good point.

What worked for me, uPD M would do exactly the same thing by the way, was to say 'okay' to whatever nasty thing she'd just said in a very bored/uninterested tone, and then changed the subject.
At which point she would feel obliged to say, "Well, don't you agree that....?"
Since she'd now asked for my opinion I would say, "Actually I don't think it's my place to judge other people's decisions that are none of my business" and change the subject.
At this point she'd usually back peddle a bit and say she wasn't judging or she just thought, blah blah blah, and I'd change the subject.

I think the key is to act totally disinterested. They're basically looking to stir up drama (your mother probably knows how you're going to react and is trying to provoke you) so refusing to take the bait is the best thing you can do I believe.

[nanotech]

I'm really careful what I say when my dad brings up other people and starts criticising them.  I grey rock mostly.
I realise that I used to join in to get approval from both my parents. I had to be in agreement with them.
Then I discovered NPD and along with BPD it described my family perfectly.
I told my dad (about six years ago) that I wasn't going to discuss the faults of my older sister with him any more. I told him pretty directly.

This is what he told me in a very stern tone,

  "You may not want to hear these things about your sister Nano, but unfortunately, you ......"'
then his voice lowered and trailed off and I suddenly got a load of Word Salad. 

He was GOING to say that I HAD to listen, and of course as I wasn't under his roof any more, that simply wasn't  true. So he stopped himself. But the mask had slipped and I saw what was going on.
And he couldn't make me listen. 



He tried a few more times to lure me in after that.
I just calmly Grey rocked, then rang off. One time I got drawn in though, and that resulted in a conflict between me and said sister.
Because he'd told her what I'd said. I'd been tempted because he'd asked for my advice. It flattered me I guess. Watch out.
It's so easy to slip back into old habits.

If you keep your cool and keep repeating that you are no longer discussing others, ( see the Broken Record technique) there's not a lot they can do. It points the finger toward the judgemental nature of their actions. This made my dad back down fairly quickly.
It's malicious gossip.
My family of origin judge everything and everyone in extremely negative terms. It was normalised in our house. Once I'd left home it continued by telephone. It's like a cult you can't leave.
Well, I left.

[Thru the Rain]

I realize this isn't quite what you're asking, but it may make it much easier to shut down the negative talk.

If she's talking this way TO you, she's talking this way ABOUT you.

My own uPDM is very critical and negative about just about everyone, and especially family. I was so far in the fog, I was shocked when my sister told me that my M says some pretty nasty things about me when I'm not in the room.

Just think about what you would like other people to say when you M says negative things about you, and then say those things when she starts in on other people.

[moglow]

So, would saying "I don't want to listen to you running down & being horrible about people I love and care about.  If you don't stop I am going to leave the room" be appropriate?   How would you deal

I'm with you - but I wouldn't include the "if you don't stop ..." part. That sounds like a challenge and\or a threat and she might see it as subject to debate. No - I'd go with action, immediate and every time. I'd say my peace with "a look" and firm time of voice and leave the room, go talk to others. If it continues and she follows you around trying some more (mine would/had done this), it's time to go home.

If she's talking this way TO you, she's talking this way ABOUT you.

If yours is like mine, I guaran-damn-tee this is the case! I sat through way too many of those sessions with mother, her ranting on about this that and the other person, digging for a response. And if I did, she'd run straight to that person with "well Mo said ..." She'd attribute her comments to you to drag you down to her level, stirring drama as hard as she could go. Divide and conquer as one of mother's favorite games, and she polished that act regularly. It just never occurred to her that we'd eventually compare notes and see it for what it is.

Basically, I had to come to peace with the fact that she is who she is - bitter, vindictive, negative and  spiteful. That's not who *i* am or anything I care to be a part of. I gray rock and deflect the hell out of her bs when I have to be around her, then it's time for me to go. It's a sad form of acceptance but at least it doesn't eat me up anymore.