Checking In

[PDMagnet]

Tomorrow, 10/02/2020, will be my 51st birthday.  I've had many PDs in my life, including a very abusive Paranoid PD stepdad and an absent-minded Histrionic PD for a real dad.  I've "drawn" many PDs and obviously been drawn to many PDs in my lifetime.  Additionally, I am a recovering alcoholic and Thanksgiving should mark my 30th birthday.  I would like some feedback regarding the recent loss of a 29-year friendship with a college buddy I met in AA in the fall of 1990.  He was actually the one who convinced me to give AA another try after my last relapse/drunk.  I met Jack (not his real name) in the fall of 1990, as I was turning 21 and going through alcohol withdrawals - having quit one more time.  I think I latched onto Jack as though he was my older brother.  We bonded instantly and effortlessly.  Although I have been fortunate enough to remain sober this entire time, Jack has had many trips back out, including stops in jail along the way.  Jack retired about a year ago from his city job as a blue collar worker, although his dad is a physician and he was a privileged kid.  I figured out Jack was PAPD about 15 years ago, when he went through one of his "I don't ever want to see you or be friends again" routines.  Of course, I hear from Jack again a few years later - when he had lost his job due to a drinking related arrest and had nobody else to turn to.  I was in law school at the time.  I've not been an attorney for the past 5 1/2 years.   Earlier this year, I was working for a law firm but left when they tried to take a substantial fee from me for a case I had worked on for years prior to going to work there.  I vented to Jack about this over the phone a few times.  He told me about his then-recent year-long drunk he had been on and of getting back into recovery.   We had re-established our old friendship and it felt like old times.  One day out of the blue, Jack set me. a text that read something like this, "College was a special time.  Healthy relationships are a priority for me today.  I think our friendship has simply run its course.  I wish you nothing but the best."  This really hurt me.  I have known for a long time that Jack is PAPD, but only mentioned it in passing.  He has pulled this stunt on me about five times over the years.  I live about 3 hours from the large city where Jack lives and used to drop in about once a year to visit.  The only thing that precipitated this recent split was his comment to me that "you dump your shit on everybody" one day as we were discussing our problems.  This is not true and he is a master at manipulation.  I don't know why this last separation has hurt so much, but it does.  I wonder whether severing a relationship hurts the PD as much as the NonPD.  This feels like a death of sorts.  I would like feedback from those who have experienced with PAPD and other PDs. 

[xredshoesx]

welcome to the group PDmagnet

i am sorry for the loss of your friend.  you are right, even though no passed, losing a relationship with a PD/ uPD person is like grieving for someone who passed- esp when it comes to having closure within the relationship.   it's painful to lose a friend, esp one that has had a significant impact on your life in the fact that he knew you during your journey towards sobriety.   the passive aggressive nature makes it even harder because the possibility remains that he may pop back into your life again after a hiatus, and then try to reinstate himself as your confidant, which leaves you open to being hurt again.

one of the kids i grew up with,  who was in my wedding as my best man and witness for the certificate signing, was recently diagnosed with a schizophrenia.  he refuses to take his meds, barely sees his kids and lets his equally disordered second wife feed him conspiracy theories all day.  he has cut all of us from the past out, and it hurts because we know if he just let himself get the help- maybe it would be different....i feel the worse for his sons because one is old enough to remember him healthier.  when i get really down about it it just have to remind myself that it's all his choice.  i think you are spot on that someone dealing with the disorder isn't capable of feeling the weight of their decisions when the disorder gets in the way of decision making-

moving forward the decision is on you if he tries to make friends again-  one thing the forum has helped me with is to build up my own resolves so when stuff like this happens, it hurts still, but affects me less because i have the tools to better identify red flags as well as healthier copy skills to not get caught up in circular discussions or no win situations where a PD /u PD controls every outcome with their behaviors.

congrats again on your sobriety and keep working on what is best for YOU as you take steps away from being someone who feels like a PD magnet.

[LemonLime]

Hi PDMagnet, welcome!  We're glad you're here.

I am in a bit of a rush this morning so I'll be brief.  First, congratulations on your sobriety.  You've accomplished a lot personally and professionally, it seems.  Sometimes this is a trigger for PD's, when they see "what could have been" for them.  Just a thought.

The Toolbox, if you haven't checked it out, is worth its weight in gold.  My favorite axiom from there is "You didn't cause it, you can't cure it, and you can't control it".    Easy to say, hard to digest it and live it, IMO.   But it is the truth.   It's best to assume they will never change because it's so exceedingly rare that they do, and you have a lot of living to do.   All the sections in the Toolbox would likely apply to your situation right now.

PD's are really really good at a few things, and one of them is finding people's vulnerabilities and exploiting them.   You may want to think about (and maybe journal about) how your buddy has done that to you over the years.  All the ways.   If he has been getting away with it, his behavior is getting reinforced.   These people know who is "safe" for them, who they can abuse with impunity.

They can be tricky, these people.  I have discovered that being PD does not necessarily preclude one from also being empathetic and fun and creative and loving.   It's just that they cannot reliably be all these things in a sort of steady-state-no-matter-what kind of way because of their dysfunction.   They have such a huge crevasse in their sense of self that they have what feels to me a "fatal flaw".   They will turn on you like a rabid dog if their sense of self is threatened, and any healthy person will eventually be seen as a threat by them.   So you can see there is no winning with them.
If you're healthy they will eventually hate you.  If you're not healthy, well then,......you get the picture.

It is like a death.  It will never be the relationship you want.   

[stormbrewing]

Welcome PDMagnet, from another very new member. Sorry you have to be here, but glad you found this forum. Jack's comments about you dumping your shit on everybody could be something that was recently said to him by someone else, and he is projecting/deflecting by saying it to you. PDs can't understand the way a healthy, balanced friendship would work, and he probably feels that any time spent discussion your problems is time taken away from what he sees as his bigger, more important problems.

They can be tricky, these people.  I have discovered that being PD does not necessarily preclude one from also being empathetic and fun and creative and loving.   It's just that they cannot reliably be all these things in a sort of steady-state-no-matter-what kind of way because of their dysfunction.   They have such a huge crevasse in their sense of self that they have what feels to me a "fatal flaw".   They will turn on you like a rabid dog if their sense of self is threatened, and any healthy person will eventually be seen as a threat by them.   

LemonLime - thank you, thank you, thank you. I felt something shift when I read this. My stbxupdh was all of those wonderful things - except when he wasn't. This is the best description I have heard yet of how his PD manifested in our relationship. He would turn on me like a rapid dog with the sole intention of inflicting as much emotional pain on me as he could manage if his self-concept was threatened in any way. His self-concept changed all the time though, so it was never possible to predict what the trigger might be.