I'm failing, and yet...

[Matteblak]

There is a sense of cognitive dissonance being a Christian living with an abusive PD spouse. There is an earthly loneliness, like hiding in plain sight, yet I know I am never alone. I meet weekly with my counselor, but the rest of my encounters on earth are a mix of lies and half truths. People ask how I am doing, and I answer "I'm good," and in a sense, in the most important sense that is, I am good because I have been forgiven, I have a hope, I have an amazing Savior who loves me and paid a price for my evil that I never could. Yet in the sense that I think they are meaning, I am not good. I am crushed, I am broken, I am tired, I am sad, I cry, I hide, I bleed, I fail.

I sin with my wicked heart. I covet a smile, a REAL smile, not the smile we've all seen a thousand times, like the smile of a lion over a gazelle, but one with the INTENT of a smile behind it. I covet rest, that the tension not be at 1000% with the line ready to break at any moment. I covet intimacy without a lecture before, during, and after. I covet a godly brother or sister to prop me up where I stand, to preach the goodness of God to my heart because I am without strength. In the end, I covet what is good in the eyes of my flesh, but to say anything beyond that is to say that my Jesus does not know what is best for me.

Oh how I wish he would just tell me, and yet I know that His answers are His alone until eternity. I am failing, but I have not failed. I am hurt, but I am not dead. I am tired, but i am not asleep, I am enduring, building callouses and lean muscle for a journey that is honestly more terrifying than my current predicament, because whatever requires this level of training to accomplish is beyond my comprehension. So I sing, and I pray, and I read the words of God, and I talk to him, and I believe him. Because I don't believe me. I repent to those of you who believe because I cannot do so with my local brethren...

[ChillNow]

Dear Matteblak,

Are you over-thinking this?  Evidently your wife is consistently abusive.  I completely understand if divorce isn't an option for you at this time – but a separation may be very beneficial and the Bible clearly allows for that.  It would get her attention as a real consequence and would reveal what is in her heart.   Repentance after confronting her own behaviors.  Or, it could be increased attempts at abuse.  Either way you would be able to observe safely from a distance. 

You described yourself as 'evil' and as 'having a wicked heart.'  It is good to be humble enough to admit our areas for improvement and be willing to work on them – but that kind of self-talk is unhealthy.  God is not a bully in the sky.  He loves you and doesn't ask more of you than you can handle.

Lastly, I'd like to share a couple of thought-provoking quotes that I came across recently;
•   'I had to face the fact that I would never grow spiritually beyond my level of health emotionally. I had many unhealthy patterns of thought and behavior that had dug ruts in my soul..'
•   'Why are so many Christians, frantic, exhausted, overloaded, and hurried? Few Christians make the connection between love of self and love of others.'

[Mary]

People ask how I am doing, and I answer "I'm good," and in a sense, in the most important sense that is, I am good because I have been forgiven, I have a hope, I have an amazing Savior who loves me and paid a price for my evil that I never could. Yet in the sense that I think they are meaning, I am not good. I am crushed, I am broken, I am tired, I am sad, I cry, I hide, I bleed, I fail.

I concur. So many times, I put on a smile and say I'm fine, when if they only knew a tiny bit of what I had walked through from Sunday to Wednesday, ...they couldn't conceive it. If I share a snippet, it's so easy for them to tell me I need a counselor. But what I need from them is compassion, not pity. An understanding that they know it's rough, and they're not judging me for that. Beyond this, just regular old friendship that doesn't require me to spill my guts every time we are together. For some of my friends, we're getting there. I have explicitly told them that I don't need them to "fix it", but that just getting together sometimes and not forgetting me brings me so much comfort. They can ask how it's going, and I can just say, "About the same," and move on. They know all is not well, but there are other things we can chat about.

On confession, we pray for eachother on this forum that we will be healed. Each victory increases our spiritual muscle to climb higher and win the next battle. "My soul crieth out, restore me again, and give me the strength to take, the narrow path of righteousness, e'n for his own name's sake. His yoke is easy, His burden is light. I've found it so, I've found it so. He leadeth me by day and by night, where living waters flow" (His Yoke is Easy).

Mary

[tragedy or hope]

It feels like we are living a double life. At least for me in the past i felt like that. b/c I am a woman, others in a church environment think he is a godly person etc. the women think he is just great.
I have lived feeling the secret pain all of my committed life to marriage and my Lord. I have only begun to feel some freedom when I decided to open up to one or two friends, outside any church environment. Other Christians I know who I could trust. It is not easy but just knowing someone else knows what I deal with took a lot of the feeling of secrecy away.
What's worse, I have in the past decades kept quiet when this man clearly was abusive to me, behaving as if nothing was wrong.
Watching him parade around others who were in leadership acknowledge his "skills." I thought I was bibically "covering his sin."

What I did not realize is that I was totally negating my own existence to cover his shortcomings. He expected it, in fact, he feels that since no one is. perfect, this kind of behavior is even okay for someone in some form of teaching capacity. He has a pie in the sky focus on being an "elder" leader in some church someday. I am resistant and not in favor.

Being a person of good repute starts at home with ones spouse and children.

There is no need to be dishonest. I need prayer is fine. My family needs prayer. No need to say why. That is enough. If someone gets inquisitive.. doesn't every family need prayer? is a good answer.

God knows, but suffering alone I think was self punishment. Living with abusive personalities makes us feel unworthy of being loved and heard by anyone.

Writing things down on paper or email to someone else, or yourself, gives great clarity. I was able to see the person I am with on paper, so I could also see where I could change things for me.

I had to ask myself what I was getting out of not talking to anyone and my pain was so bad I HAD to take a risk with one other person.

Now I don't share everything, but I am trying to entrust one other person or two for the less intense stuff.

Most important, God gives us only one life. A day of pain gone by can never be retrieved.
God gave ME my own life. NOT his. Why I wasted so many years making him the focus was just ignorance I guess.

A marriage is commitment, sometimes not so much 'love" as we think it should be. I learned not to be married for love. If I get it fine, if not... oh well. Marriages have been arranged for centuries and in other countries, people learn to live with each other. In our culture, the world has told us that romantic love is everything. That's why we see so many in public influence go from one to another.

Hang in there. This is about you. You are important and so are your feelings, I hope at some point, you will see the value
God places on you to share yourself honestly with someone who is willing to receive you. Hopefully of the same gender. In our weakest moments... beauty/ attraction has fangs. It will devour.

[Matteblak]

Thanks you all for allowing me to talk through these things. Grateful for prayers and encouragement.

[Wolf]

Although you probably won't agree with my opinion, I want to share it, not presenting it as fact but simply presenting my perspective. I think you need to seriously evaluate your faith from a rational perspective and figure out exactly why you believe that the Christian god exists. I'm not telling you to stop believing--I respect your choice of religion. But I think you should evaluate the evidence for your position and see if there's any good reason to practice your religion and believe in it, or if it is in fact holding you back or being used to manipulate you. I recommend reading Nietzsche for a new perspective.

[Boat Babe]

I think that's a step too far. Even though I am an atheist, I never question people's beliefs in their god/goddess/whatever. That really isn't my job.  But, it is very healthy to question all the religious structures, habits, interpretations of sacred texts, power structures, political alliances, economic structures that a long established religion develops.

So here, many Christians, especially the fundamentalists, feel absolutely bound to a horribly abusive spouse by their marriage vows. Other Christians feel that abuse is a very valid reason for walking away.  We don't often hear from Jews, Muslims, Hindus on the subject and I would be interested in their take.

[SonofThunder]

I think that's a step too far. Even though I am an atheist, I never question people's beliefs in their god/goddess/whatever. That really isn't my job.  But, it is very healthy to question all the religious structures, habits, interpretations of sacred texts, power structures, political alliances, economic structures that a long established religion develops.

So here, many Christians, especially the fundamentalists, feel absolutely bound to a horribly abusive spouse by their marriage vows. Other Christians feel that abuse is a very valid reason for walking away.  We don't often hear from Jews, Muslims, Hindus on the subject and I would be interested in their take.

Boat Babe,

Upon reading Matteblak's post, I find it to be beautifully written in creativity and contrast and very poetic.  I can also relate in many ways, to being a nonPD in a complex close relationship with a uPDw.  There are parts of Matteblaks writing regarding being "crushed" and "broken" in which I have moved beyond on my journey down the path that many of us are on, but I recognize that the path is long and there are many of us here in different areas along the similar journey.   

I don't read any part of Matteblak's post that directly discusses being (as you wrote);   "absolutely bound to a horribly abusive spouse".   

It could be assumed that Matteblak is currently (legally) attached to a PD spouse by a marriage contract, but Matteblak does not, in this particular post, discuss viewpoints regarding departing from or staying with a PD spouse. 

Maybe your reply to Matteblak should be a separate post?   Your reply is, from an Athiest perspective, an interesting question regarding the viewpoints on stay/leave,  of yourself and other religions, but I don't personally believe is relative to Matteblak's specific post. 

SoT

[Boat Babe]

I should have made it clear that I was replying to the post directly above mine. I think that may contextualise my post.

[SonofThunder]

I should have made it clear that I was replying to the post directly above mine. I think that may contextualise my post.

Boat Babe,

Yes, that does assist in understanding your post.  I find it helpful to use the 'Actions-Quote' reply vs the 'Quick Reply', so others are aware to which context I am referring.  I always assume that posters who did not quote, are referencing the original post.  Thank you for the clarity.

SoT

[Boat Babe]

Thank you. I will do that next time.

[SparkStillLit]

So I don't know how to operate this at ALL let alone do the quote thing. Let me just say I am responding to Wolf's response? Does that work?
I don't think perhaps it is so much Matteblack's belief in Christianity leading him astray. I think PDs will use any tool. Our empathy. Our willingness to continue to see the glass half full. Our willingness to give second and third and umpteenth chances. Our careTAKING. I think we need to see this in US and set it aside. I still don't think Creator ever meant us to do this. I still think PDs take advantage. Not Creator.
You may think what you wish, of course. It's your right as is ours.

[Andeza]

Well put, Spark. I think you've summed it up nicely.

[Adria]

I think the hardest lesson to learn in this life is to love, cherish and take care of ourselves.  I am an empath, have lived in an abusive marriage for many years, got out, got into another difficult marriage, take on all the problems of my friends, colleagues, children, etc.  I take on their pain, I've taken much abuse in my life, and because of that I have grown tired, weary and have been close to liver failure.  Why do we always know how to advise others, but we do not know how to advise ourselves.  It is easy for me to advise my kids on what to do to take care of themselves, I know how to take care of my pets, I can always help a friend. I give all my energy to other people and sit home on a couch because I do not know how to give that energy to myself. God has given us one life. We are not supposed to live other people's lives. We are supposed to care enough about ourselves so that we can live out our God given destiny.  I'm not saying be narcissistic, or not care about others, but when other people start destroying us, our strength, ambition, desires, we need to go to God and ask for discernment on how to move forward. He will show the way.  I have learned to not talk to God as much as to be open to hear what God wants to say to me. I pray for ears to hear and eyes to see what He wants to  share with me and where he wants to lead. Sometimes He is silent, but other times He will surely let me know.

Matteblak, you are a beautiful writer, and I am so sorry for what you are going through.  I think a lot of times Christians think we need to hang in there with everyone's issues to the point of just about killing us.  That is what the church will tell us about our marriage. You know . . . just forgive and forget. And that is noble to a certain point.  However, Jesus says to rebuke a brother who is doing wrong, and if it doesn't work, take it to the elders, if that doesn't work, walk away and shake the dust off your feet. Sometimes, people can't be fixed, and sometimes we have to save ourselves. I, and many others here, have learned that lesson the hard way.  Maybe try giving yourself some good advice, like the advice you give your spouse or the advise you would give a friend in your position.  Take time to reflect on that along with prayer and asking God to help you discern what to do and where to go next. God loves you too, but we are not God. Sometimes, the other person needs to be handed back over to God as we can no longer help them, and they are dragging us down to our demise.

I pray that you find your way, whatever way that is.  You are special, one of a kind, loved and cherished in God's eyes.  He has created you for His purposes, and you have to save enough of you to fulfill your destiny.  Please take care. My heart goes out to you.  Hugs, Adria

[1footouttadefog]

I covet a smile, a REAL smile, not the smile we've all seen a thousand times, like the smile of a lion over a gazelle, but one with the INTENT of a smile behind it. God wants these things for us. Read the Proverbs. So many verses relate to falseness and the looks of deceitful people. I covet rest, that the tension not be at 1000% with the line ready to break at any moment.Come u to me, ye who are heavy laden
God wants us to be at rest. He calls us to be still and k ow that He is God. I covet intimacy without a lecture before, during, and after.This should be yours. You were given in marriage to be one flesh. Paul's writings even suggest it's wrong to be denied intimacy in marriage unless both partners give it up as a fast. I covet a godly brother or sister to prop me up where I stand, to preach the goodness of God to my heart because I am without strength. You should have this. It is the purpose of the fellowship. Also church discipline if carried out in a biblical manner would cause wrong doers to be called out  privately at first, and more publically as needed, and they would be accountable to the fellowshipIn the end, I covet what is good in the eyes of my flesh, but to say anything beyond that is to say that my Jesus does not know what is best for me.
God ordained marriage and the binding of man and women.  To deny one's spouse the benifits of marriage is to brake the vows of marriage.  This includes clinging to parents more than spouse and other issues.

Oh how I wish he would just tell me, and yet I know that His answers are His alone until eternity. I am failing, but I have not failed. I am hurt, but I am not dead. I am tired, but i am not asleep, I am enduring, building callouses and lean muscle for a journey that is honestly more terrifying than my current predicament, because whatever requires this level of training to accomplish is beyond my comprehension. How many times I have thought and felt these things.  Consider also, however that sometimes God uses thorn rows to guide us to the next place.  Closed doors might not mean imprisonment, but rather that the very walls are going to crumble or that the jailer will release us. 

So I sing, and I pray, and I read the words of God, and I talk to him, and I believe him. Because I don't believe me. I repent to those of you who believe because I cannot do so with my local brethren...Yiu are only responsible for your part.  If you own your part and fix your own flaws, the rest is the fault of the other partner.  I found it useful to examine the traits list on this website. I marked what were things I did and things my spouse did and whether they were habitual or not and if they were responses to the other party's abuse.
It was eye opening. I owned and decided to fix my part and continue to struggle against a few bad habits.  I knew then that if things failed I have given the marriage my all.

[SonofThunder]

 

There is a sense of cognitive dissonance being a Christian living with an abusive PD spouse. There is an earthly loneliness, like hiding in plain sight, yet I know I am never alone. I meet weekly with my counselor, but the rest of my encounters on earth are a mix of lies and half truths. People ask how I am doing, and I answer "I'm good," and in a sense, in the most important sense that is, I am good because I have been forgiven, I have a hope, I have an amazing Savior who loves me and paid a price for my evil that I never could. Yet in the sense that I think they are meaning, I am not good. I am crushed, I am broken, I am tired, I am sad, I cry, I hide, I bleed, I fail.

I sin with my wicked heart. I covet a smile, a REAL smile, not the smile we've all seen a thousand times, like the smile of a lion over a gazelle, but one with the INTENT of a smile behind it. I covet rest, that the tension not be at 1000% with the line ready to break at any moment. I covet intimacy without a lecture before, during, and after. I covet a godly brother or sister to prop me up where I stand, to preach the goodness of God to my heart because I am without strength. In the end, I covet what is good in the eyes of my flesh, but to say anything beyond that is to say that my Jesus does not know what is best for me.

Oh how I wish he would just tell me, and yet I know that His answers are His alone until eternity. I am failing, but I have not failed. I am hurt, but I am not dead. I am tired, but i am not asleep, I am enduring, building callouses and lean muscle for a journey that is honestly more terrifying than my current predicament, because whatever requires this level of training to accomplish is beyond my comprehension. So I sing, and I pray, and I read the words of God, and I talk to him, and I believe him. Because I don't believe me. I repent to those of you who believe because I cannot do so with my local brethren...

I have a friend who is a US Navy SEAL, now in his mid 50's.   The cognitive dissonance you speak of exists in this man's life as well, as he lives among us in everyday civilian life, yet has experienced and confronted so much evil in the world; so much pain at the loss-of and taking-of human life, including loss of his SEAL brothers, both in combat and in realistic training accidents, and even the tragic loss of his 8 year old daughter in an accident on a piece of playground equipment. 

He cannot tell me the details of his SEAL operations, which are only known to his comrades and leaders, yet he must live among us and keep his secrets...even from his own immediate family.   I consider us who live with PD's, similar to my friend.  I consider us who live with PD's to be my brothers and sisters in the secret, inner-circle battles of our lives where very few reside or understand. 

Christ's life on Earth (and in general) is also similar, as he experiences the continuous devaluation and discard of most of his very creation.  He was mistreated, abused, misunderstood and ultimately 'discarded' on the cross by humanity, although God the father had a very different plan unfolding, unbeknownst to mankind at the time.  I am comforted in knowing that I share a similar experience with all of us here on Out of the FOG and with Christ and my SEAL friend.  I am not alone. 

I also am now, after 30 years in this daily PD battle, able to look back and see that the decades of suffering has been used for good, but at a price, both mentally and physically.  I am currently in my last discard cycle and my future with my uPDw is unknown.   I am now indifferent to her attempts to devalue and discard, with high protective boundaries and a quiver full of tools from the Out of the FOG toolbox.   It has taken years to hone these skills and I have God and my fine comrades here at Out of the FOG to thank for the expanding education, support, encouragement and insight.  My uPDw is running out of PD options because everywhere she turns, her efforts bounce off, as I am also able to predict most PD moves from her and at worst, react very quickly, shutting it down in self protection.   I am ready for divorce, both mentally, physically, situationally and in financial planning.  It has taken me this long in training to be able to say that.   I accept that this may be Gods timing and his mill grinds exceedingly slow and fine. 

So, the cognitive dissonance is an attribute we share with many, and I am honored to call each of you, my comrades.   Matteblak, thank you for your post and I encourage you along the journey and look forward to meeting you someday in Heaven. 

SoT

[square]

To covet means to desire what rightfully belings to another.

But it doesn't apply to your unfulfilled needs. A starving person does not covet food, but needs it.

Likewise, you do not covet care, tenderness, presentness, intimacy with your spouse. You lack these things that you need, and that God wants you to have in holy union.

I think about the ways I sin and can improve - pride is my big one - but I fear where you might go if you adopt the austere outlook that suggests you deserve nothing at all and that your suffering is itself sinful. When Jesus carried the cross, he stumbled and the man named Simon bore it the rest of the way. When he was crucified, he cried out. Your suffering is real and to feel it is not a sin.

[Call Me Cordelia]

1foot, what a beautiful post. I was thinking many of those same things but you expressed them so well. God bless you!

[JustKeepTrying]

I am in awe of the beauty of the writing in many of these posts.  Also, the biblical analysis is way beyond my ability.  I am a cradle to grave Catholic - well maybe not grave yet.  But definitely cradle.  I stayed in the marriage in large due to my beliefs.  You marry for the good and bad.  It is a vow and contract. 

When considering separation, I met with several priests over the course of my 32-year marriage.  Many said that I could not break the covenant for any reason.

Then I met a priest who told me that the covenant was already broken - by my husband and the marriage was probably not valid from the beginning.

As I came Out of the FOG, and the past cleared, connections were made and I see that he was right.  I married a person with a mental illness who was not in his right mind and therefore not able to fully give himself to a union.  Like 1foot quoted in the bible, there was no real union of flesh or spirit. 

Granted I waited for several years before leaving after I met him and we had talked within the confidence of confession.  I sought a divorce, not a dissolution.  I own my part of the marriage.

Divorce is real and I did owe it to the vow I made before God to give it everything.  But God also gave me this body and my safety was at risk.  I also owe God the promise to take of myself in spirit and physical. 

Will I marry again?  No.  Will I be intimate again with another man?  No.  That would definitely be breaking my vows.  In the eyes of the church, I am still married.  In the eyes of God, I was probably not married.  In the eyes of the government, that contract was voided.  I find it helpful to view it as such.

Matteblak,  You have a deep and abiding faith.  That is beautiful and I lift you up in spirit.  I find when I can stop and find the quiet and peace - I can clearly hear God and his desire for my life.  I hope you can too.

[Mary]

I am in awe of the beauty of the writing in many of these posts.  Also, the biblical analysis is way beyond my ability. 

I agree. This discussion has some meat to it, like the SEAL analogy SoT shared. Why should I expect that all of my Christian friends would understand? I would not wish this on them. I do want some of them to know it's hard and not forget about me. And it feels like I have to be the one reaching out so often, but it is what it is. I do appreciate any efforts they make, and I need to remind myself to be thankful for that, however flawed.

1foot's explanation of how to examine yourself in light of the toolkit is helpful. I am in couples counseling right now, and the counselor seems to be buying the lies and joining my uPDh in advising that I isolate from several friends that I rely on for support. Supposedly I am talking with them too much about private marriage information. But, as 1foot pointed out, I should examine this accusation in light of the traits on the website.
Is my sharing private information with others in response to abuse? YES
Is it habitual? NO
Have I ever spoken inappropriately or too freely to my friends? YES-I can own that and commit to following James and bridle my tongue.
Does this mean I should cut my friends off as uPDh presses me to do? NO, but trying to avoid WWIII by backing off a bit.
Do I need to set a protective boundary on myself in this area as SoT often teaches us? YES
Where is God in this excruciating scenario? After all, I've experienced my first panic attack over it. He whispers to me, "BE STILL MY SOUL."

Be still, my soul: the Lord is on thy side;
bear patiently the cross of grief or pain;
leave to thy God to order and provide;
in ev'ry change He faithful will remain.
Be still, my soul: thy best, thy heav'nly Friend
thro' thorny ways leads to a joyful end.

Be still, my soul: thy God doth undertake
to guide the future as He has the past.
Thy hope, thy confidence let nothing shake;
all now mysterious shall be bright at last.
Be still, my soul: the waves and winds still know
His voice, who ruled them while He dwelt below.

Be still, my soul: the hour is hast'ning on
when we shall be forever with the Lord,
when disappointment, grief, and fear are gone,
sorrow forgot, love's purest joys restored.
Be still, my soul: when change and tears are past,
all safe and blessed we shall meet at last.
(Jean Sibelius)