Feeling Very Rusty

[Hepatica]

Hey everyone,

Anyone out there feeling socially rusty? I mean, I am not great socially at the best of times, but after a year of the pandemic it hit me yesterday that I am really out of practice. It's been pretty cold here so I haven't done a lot of socially distanced walking outside. Yesterday we had a couple over to our backyard and I swear it was like I had lockjaw. I had trouble finishing sentences, finding words.

Worst part was I shared something personal and it was met by the couple really badly. They very, very, very much judged my choice. (Around ancestry research and privacy.)  It got a little dystopian and much was said about privacy, and then they left. 

I felt like a total fool. So in essence the entire social experience has left me feeling really weird. Like here I am trying to be a human being and it didn't feel good.

What am I even talking about? I guess it's about navigating the limp, so to speak, of coming from a hard childhood, and how this makes me feel so anxious socially. Perhaps it's about perfectionism? Perhaps it's about feeling shame?

But, having one of my first social experiences since COVID didn't feel great. It felt bad. I felt rusty and childlike and vulnerable.

Yeck feelings. I've had them before Covid and i hate the feelings so much I tend to avoid social activities.

Is this all about me though? Or are we in this strange world where so many of us feel unsafe about a variety of issues that even, regular sharing can become pits we fall into and end up debating the good and bad about?

Or maybe this couple just aren't my people?

Ugh.

[DistanceNotDefense]

I'm sorry this happened. This sounds like an uncomfortable situation...

I think there's two things here - A: Knowing what to share and with whom.

I've learned this big time. I thought my bubbly jabbering about anything and everything on my mind was maybe charming and delightful at times when meeting new folks, then I realized it's not what most people do in situations with folks they don't know.

I spill my guts and I think to some people that's a sign they can feed on them and even pick them apart. I show my soft underbelly. So I'm trying to be more withholding, which goes against my nature and is pretty hard. On the other hand, if we seem to have something in common, I'll spill away a little more on that subject....

B: Yeah they're probably not your people.

I could see someone having hang-ups about privacy (I'm assuming you're wanting to reach out to someone about a potential family tie?) but it's not like that's hugely or politically controversial. It's not something people have to feel outspoken about. Those folks sound a kind of uptight and not your speed, and they disagree about your personal interests so maybe not a good match.

You found out too quick and in a painful way, but I don't think you should be hard on yourself about it! Easier said than done, I know. It's probably just not a match.

Sure it may seem like you missed out on a good connection - but did you actually like those people? Rather than wonder if they liked you.

You might have dodged a bullet!

[SparkStillLit]

What could have been so fraught about ancestry and privacy? I mean, if you feel kind of tinfoil hatty about it, that's an understandable POV, even if I do not share your views. (I have no opinion one way or the other, I really don't know much about it). Why would anyone get all wrapped around the axle? Just, if the topic is not for you, move on!
Also, if someone dropped an awkward bomb, being awkward myself, HELP THEM FFS and gently and quickly move the conversation along!
I don't know. Nobody really has manners anymore, if you ask me. It's not about manners if you're awkward, but it IS about manners to argue and engage when someone doesn't want to, and it's just a silly topic. That's not what you do at somebody else's house.

[GettingOOTF]

Shortly after I separated from my BPDxH I went to a work event. I'd avoided them when I was married as it caused too many issues at home if I went. I was standing around and a colleague came up and started talking to me. I realized that I had completely lost the ability to hold a conversation. I never spoke unless it was to agree with someone and even then I'd run through every possible reaction first as I never knew how my ex would react.

It took me a while to get back in to the rhythm of conversing with others and this was something I had to actively work on. I forced myself to go out and interact with others. Dating was actually really helpful for this as it was a low pressure situation. I knew I never had to see that person again if I didn't want to and that took a lot of the pressure off me.

I have also become rusty during lockdown. When I see people now I feel like I just vomit out stuff as I have so much pent up conversation in me.

For me I found that I was really bad at picking up on social cues. I'm better at that now and I have more awareness around the pitfalls of various subjects. Ancestry research is a touchy subject for many, on both sides. It's a subject people tend to have very strong views about. Who knows what it triggered in that couple. From this group we can see that it is impossible to know anyone's background or triggers. I wouldn't take it personally, but for me when things like this happen I spend time asking myself why I felt the way I did about it and how I could handle it differently. For me personally in social interactions I don't want to debate anything. I want to have a good time with likeminded people. To facilitate this I avoid certain people all together or I avoid certain topics with certain people.

It's been a stressful time for everyone and we are all navigating this new Normal. I wouldn't be too hard on yourself. And as you said, these may simply not be your people. There's nothing wrong with that.

[Boat Babe]

Hey Hepatica, don't beat yourself up about this. And yes, Covid has done all sorts of weird shit to people. There's a growing and worrying increase in mental health issues, especially for the young, after a year of isolation and uncertainty.

Luckily I socialis easily and it isn't one of my "things"  but I find if I spend any amount of time with anyone, even a zoom meeting, I am really tired and need to recharge by being alone. I used to HATE being alone!

As to other people, well if the conversation isn't easy, respectful and warm, then I'm not interested.

I hope your next contact with other people is enriching and entertaining. ❤️

[Hepatica]

Thanks everyone.

This is a recurring issue with this couple. I'd say it might be over 50% now that I depart feeling annoyed and a few times I've been quite angry. But we keep slogging along over the years bc of a past we share. In many ways we have similar views but the wife in the couple is often a critical person, judgemental and controlling. Of course after years disagreements come up about certain topics. But she seems to perceive her opinion the gold standard. And her husband is a yes man.

Someone gave me an ancestry dna test over the holidays. I thought a lot about doing it. I think quite a lot about privacy and risk and I guess I did feel a little angsty about doing it. But in my own individual way of calculating risk I came to the decision to go ahead. I mean, for goodness sakes (she brought up police state issues and totalitarian gov't control in future who has your DNA) well.... maybe. But I could also die in a car crash. Or climate change could end us in thirty years. I just wanted to know where my ancestry came from. If some shadowy figure at the top decides to clone me one day, well.... good gosh. It'll be that or a climate snowmageddon or cancer or anything...

I just wanted to know more about my past. I took a risk. And both of them battered me about it. They might as well have said I am an idiot.

But you're right SparkstillLit, where are manners anymore? They came to my house. I shared something I thought was cool and didn't ask for their opinion on it. Where are manners anymore? If I choose to do this and they choose to use cell phones that track everything, what right do they have to judge me at my house, around my campfire? And she's done it before. To her husband and to me. She's judgement and rude.

[Fiasco]

.... but the wife in the couple is often a critical person, judgemental and controlling. Of course after years disagreements come up about certain topics. But she seems to perceive her opinion the gold standard. And her husband is a yes man.

Red flag alert. I have found that I sometimes get the MOST obsessed with getting argumentative jack hats, people I don't even truly like or respect, to change their judgey opinions or me. Is it a reaction to being raised by a PDm? Is it my people pleasing behavior? Am I just weird? Could be all three but it was a toxic behavior I really had to examine and then stamp out of myself. There is huge value in talking with people with different opinions than yourself, but not when it means just being judged over and over again by someone who thinks their opinion is the gold standard.

I also wanted to let you know how much I identify with feeling socially awkward after a year of covid isolation.  You should have seen me at my first job after staying home with my kids for 8 years. OMG, I both laugh and cringe when I think about it.

[pianissimo]

Here, ancestry research based on census is provided by the government. When it was made available, everybody checked it to see where their ancestors came from. It was part of daily conversation for a while. I checked mine to see if there was anything interesting. I think ancestry research is interesting. I was curious about the one that based on tracing DNA. I would do it if I had access. I think it's the most natural thing to talk about if you have access to some version of this service and feel excited about the opportunity to use it. I would also mention it to people because it's an entertaining topic.

[DistanceNotDefense]

Yeah I take back 85% of the emphasis on my part A on sharing things. These people just sound really difficult and getting a DNA test is hardly controversial. I get why it could be to some, but I think that's an opinion easy to keep to yourself and not share with someone at what is supposed to be a pleasant backyard fire that someone so kindly invited you to.

[Poison Ivy]

COVID-19 and social isolation awkwardness is a real thing.

[Fae Greenwood]

Thanks everyone.

This is a recurring issue with this couple. I'd say it might be over 50% now that I depart feeling annoyed and a few times I've been quite angry. But we keep slogging along over the years bc of a past we share. In many ways we have similar views but the wife in the couple is often a critical person, judgemental and controlling. Of course after years disagreements come up about certain topics. But she seems to perceive her opinion the gold standard. And her husband is a yes man.

You don't sound like you enjoy many of the interactions you have with this couple. I know we are in a time of pandemic and social isolation and friendships are vital, but do you genuinely want these people as intimates in your life in your future? The wife sounds like a person who is willing to die on every hill, even little ant hills. Christmas cards and a big summer BBQ may be a better fit for them. Don't you deserve people in your life who treat you like they value your friendship?  This couple was aggressive with you about their OWN fears of what MIGHT happen someday. It was all about THEIR feelings. Did you feel liked or valued by them at the end of the visit? It's hard for us to trust our feelings after being through such difficult experiences because they were so abused for so long but they're still there and waiting. Is it possible your "rustiness" is refusal to accept this bullying any longer?

What am I even talking about? I guess it's about navigating the limp, so to speak, of coming from a hard childhood, and how this makes me feel so anxious socially. Perhaps it's about perfectionism? Perhaps it's about feeling shame?

But, having one of my first social experiences since COVID didn't feel great. It felt bad. I felt rusty and childlike and vulnerable.

[Hepatica]

Thank you to each of you. I am tired and have a lot of body pain today, so can't respond individually. I'm sorry about that.

Fae Greenwood,
You know, I never considered what they did to be bullying but when I read your comment it feels right. They ganged up on me when all I wanted to do was share some funny things I learned and how I didn't get the results I expected and how it's sort of shifted things, even like where I want to travel to one day. And I got a lecture and the thing is, I also felt scared afterward. I was like, oh damn, did I do a really dangerous thing? And I was trying to think of every worst case scenario of what nefarious people were going to do with my DNA. I was really upset.

This is added to years of strange comments from the woman. One specifically where my child got into a specialized arts program. It was hard to get into and he had to go thru a rigorous interview process. We were so thrilled for him and shared it with this couple and her comment to him directly was something to the effect, "You won't make money in arts...." He was barely 15. And this one really makes me mad bc now he calls arts courses "bird" courses and he's thrown arts out as even an elective at uni. It's like he absorbed her words, like they were a poison dart.

She is a bully. I've let it go far too many times and yes, Fae, I think I'm waking up and refusing to take her bullying any longer.

Adding: I felt exquisite emotional pain last night after they left. I didn't sleep well and I woke sad and cried while talking to Dh about it. And instead of calling what is was as rude and bullying, I instead went to the habitual place of blaming myself for opening up to them and doing something dumb and even dangerous, by doing the ancestry test.

I do deserve people in my life who value me and consider my feelings before they speak. Wow. After all of this work I do and have done and I didn't even think about it that way.

Distance, thank you. Your insights were helpful. I needed to give more clarification. And what is true is that I do share things with people. It's like an ingrained happened and maybe I don't like silence and I put in filler. I've thought about his the past few months as I work hard on what self-respect looks like and also how I do not need to people please, that I can let that old habit go. It was part of my survival as a child and it's still with me, but it allows people like this couple to believe they have power over me I think.

[SparkStillLit]

Oh my stars. What nefarious thing is anyone going to do with a cheek swab.
My fingerprints are on file because of jobs I've had, I've been investigated several times in the manner that you are when you are in close contact with important political figures, if THEY wanted to track or get me, I'm sure I'd be gotten by now.
In fact, I AM THEM on a low level.
You just have to live your life.
Surround yourself with people who bring joy. Avoid those who bring doom and gloom.

[Lauren17]

Hepatica,
I think we, as a society, are all feeling rusty social skills. I recently read a BBC article about this very thing.
I think healing from a PD relationship makes overcoming the covid rusty even harder.
It sounds like there is a pattern of poor behavior form these people. Trust your gut.
I hope you've rested and cared for yourself today.

[treesgrowslowly]

Hi Hepatica

I'm sorry you went through that.

I wonder if it is a part of the process that we go though.

Your post reminded me of a time about 1 year post NC, all of a sudden in spaces where I had not felt icky before I felt off with people. I would come home and wonder what the heck was that?

You used the term "rusty" and at the time this happened for me it did feel like i had lost ground...like why were these social chit chats with people leaving me feeling so off? I had been through the same conversations before with them and it didn't hit me the way it did all of a sudden after NC.

At the time I had a counsellor but they couldn't make heads or tails of this for me. Which didn't help...

So it led to me choosing my events more carefully because it was so off putting to come home and feel that 'why is it so rusty' feeling.

Now I can look back and actually what I now believe this was about is that after going NC and making some really hard decisions for my own life I didn't like that people didn't know my beliefs about different topics. So like you I was out there chit chatting and telling people what I believed.

About just basic stuff sometimes...like even just the weather forecast! Or more substantive things too like current events or like you said, ancestry services. It could be anything.

But for a lot of people...they don't really want to know what others around them believe unless it is the same thing they already believe. To them conversation is for one thing....for them to hear themselves talk. Not to learn or relate to someone else who might have a new idea for them to consider.

Looking back now this was me (post NC) learning that the world outside my FOO was just as uninterested in healthy conversation with me as my FOO members were.

And that finding more empathic people would be more work than I first had hoped....

I don't bother telling people what I believe anymore until I see them in action. I need to see signs that they show respect for ideas other than the ones they feel they own already.

Otherwise I know they will just make me repeat an emotional experience I've already had enough of.

My FOO already gave me a lifetimes worth of experiences already where they hold the "right" opinion and everyone else is wrong.

There are caring empathetic people out there but they can be hard to find.

You didn't do anything wrong by wanting to share your own views with this bully. She just didn't want to hear it.

During my time in this stage I really wanted all the bullies to be wearing signs on their heads so I could see them coming!!! Wouldn't that be helpful lol.

Not everyone is like her obviously but there are a lot of folks like that out there.

I found they tend to say "wow this was such a nice visit" after a visit when we've shared almost nothing about ourselves and it was all about them. 

Trees.

[SparkStillLit]

"This was such a nice visit" HA!!
Trees is right. You do want to watch out, it feels like there are an extra lot of the crummier sort of folks out there (especially now, I don't know why, do I just notice them better, or do they feel more free to let their crummy flag fly?).
The better sort usually show an actual interest in you, and leave some lead ins in conversation for your thoughts and interests, and they listen and don't interrupt with judgement or THEIR ideas. (WHAT???? People DO that??? They leave places in conversations for you?????)
It's really hard for me to learn to just wait, and see if these places are left for me, and not do my usual nervous verbal barf thing, overshare, or be so excited that anyone even appears to be listening that I burble away like a flowing spring with all the stored up words inside me. (I would naturally talk a lot. When my bestie and I  get together it is NON STOP YACK and we get louder and laughier and updh is always hushing me particularly if I'm on the phone w/her.)

[Hilltop]

Hepatica I don't think you over shared at all. You did something interesting and you shared that with them.  If they don't want to do it so be it but why bring you down about it.  Why not ask you all about the process and when you will find out about stuff.  I think you are blaming yourself when you haven't even done anything wrong.  I realise you may have felt rusty but I'm wondering if this was really because they are rude and judgemental and you spend time with them subconsciously waiting for them to start picking you apart.

They sound really unpleasant.  If they don't want to give their swab they don't have to but why do they think its ok to force their opinions on others.  Rather than have a pleasant nice friendly conversation they turned it into something negative and unkind.  Like you said there were some funny stories to be told and what she said about your son is silly, like you say he was 15 at the time.

I would consider lessening the time you spend with them.  They sound really unpleasant.  This is really not you and even though you felt rusty I think the conversation would have been fine with anyone else.  She sounds like a bully.  You deserve better than that.

[Hepatica]

Thanks so much to each of you. If I could surround myself with folks like you I honestly believe I'd be more at ease. So many people I know are so uneducated about trauma and don't look inward and reflect on themselves. I've been doing therapy since my 20's and many of the people I know have not done any therapy at all. It's not like I need that, but I do think it makes for friends who are more reflective in general. Not perfect but mindful of how they talk to people.

Reading your comments really comforts me and reminds me that there are kind people out there. I just have to meet them.

Been a little down and out the past few weeks, with a weird pain in my upper back. It's draining and I'm tired. Waiting to do blood tests because the pain is so odd. I'm sure I'm fine but feel drained and scared a bit. I'm sure I'm fine but I just haven't had a lot of energy to communicate much.

I really appreciate all of you taking the time to reassure me and comfort me.

[Hilltop]

I hope your feeling better Hepatica, take care of yourself.

Please don't let these people bring you down.  You invited them for a lovely evening of socialising and instead of asking you about your ancestry and which countries your background comes back to which is so interesting they chose to be negative.  That is really about them.  I mean there could have been some really good conversation and they ruined it, that wasn't you being rusty, it was them.

[Hepatica]

Thanks Hilltop,

It helps so much to see it that way, and funny how I didn't. That's why I'm so grateful for all of you.