Strategically placed insults

[tragedy or hope]

Unpdh and I were kind of debriefing about separate experiences during the morning, when a subject was brought up about a coming trip to visit a relative of unpdh.

I mentioned taking my dog, to which he replied, "no problem, we'll be outside if we have to, with two leashes, one for her and one for me."

He was raised in the town we will visit, and perhaps he knows I would not like some of the old places he has in mind to visit. (without me) I don't know.

This shocked me emotionally of course, loaded with ammo waiting for the trigger to be pulled. I did not address it until a little later. Mostly because I couldn't believe I heard it. Typical N behavior, get us off balance.

I said, "What were you implying to me when you said -----? It sounded cruel, as if implying something negative directed toward me." Then I let it go.

He never responded. However, I see the new cycle starting. I think he has had enough serenity for awhile. The love bombing has stopped and the "N" behavior and rejection will begin. It starts like this. Overt at first, slowly like trickery, a complement, then a put down etc.. till his desperation sets in, then it's all out war if he can muster it.

I am so glad to be on this site as it was so crystal clear to me what he was doing. I am glad I addressed it with him. I will say no more.

"Game on buddy!"

That's how I feel. Makes me wonder again how I ever bother saying anything nice to him at all.

My strategy...MC.

[SonofThunder]

Sorry you are experiencing.  Yes the IDD cycle is a constant attempt with them, but once we recognize the signs and are educated well about the cycle, we can utilize the toolbox, to keep ourselves as best unaffected as possible, as we get ourselves mentally off the cycle. 

In my recent experiences over the past two years, i found that my toolbox skills caused my uPDw to move into the discard phase much quicker.  I believe PD's actually combine devalue and discard as well, until they realize devalue is having zero effect and then more weight is poured onto discard, with jabs at devalue where cracks in the non's armor exists. 

I am committed to never returning to riding the cycle.  I am in strong (yet not full) discard at this time with brief attempts at devalue if my uPDw sees an opening she believes can be effective, but MC and indifference (more on this below) shuts it down.  In recent months I have been having a little experimental fun with trials of mirroring/matching her discard to test how far my indifference can go before it backfires.   

The results are this:  PD's are masters at hypocrisy.  Therefore, when they experience for themselves, what they do to other people, they use it to devalue the person.  What they wont realize (i didnt say 'dont') is that they are doing the exact same thing (hypocrisy). 

Therefore, actually matching the discard is not advised.  What IS advised is for us to master (in addition to MC) very strategic 'indifference', not discard.  Indifference is, imo, similar to MC, but requires a high radar and advanced planning for certain PD discard/devalue attempts and very thick skin and determination on our part to keep moving forward with our daydream-planning, (and other necessary things in life) regardless of the attempts of the PD (using the IDD cycle) to detour us, both mentally and physically.  I also must use the 51% rule and the 50% rule to guide my indifference and keep it in check. 

So, ToH, I want to recommend to you, during the devalue stage you see is starting once again, that you not only use MC (haha your "game on!") and boundaries to keep drama to a minimum and keep yourself (by advance planning) from allowing yourself into manipulation-capable trap experiences as little as possible.  But also to have a mindset of careful yet caring indifference, like you would with a homeless person doing some odd things on a city street.  You would observe, evaluate, stay as clear as possible and not engage the stranger, for your own protection, but respect their right to be on the street just like you.  The next time you had to walk that way, and saw the same odd stranger on the sidewalk, you would either do the same thing, or this time, cross the street and walk on the other side, for even better protection.  If the stranger verbally attempted to communicate, you would decide what is best (avoid or minimize) for whatever you believe is best for your own max benefit.  Completely ignoring/avoiding  (discarding) is not always our max benefit, because it sometimes heightens the drama attempts of the other person.  But, a minimized, MC indifference, can defuse a situation quickly. 

Im finding that MC and balanced (50% rule) indifference is protective from the current and VERY passive-aggressive discard phase i am in with my wife (and very frustrating for her....her problem).  In fact, I cant see us ever departing the discard phase, because I wont return to the hamster wheel of the IDD cycle, and her hidden fear-of-abandonment, which is the foundation of her personality, is going to be a very high obstacle for her to surmount. 

Frankly, imo she is going to have to engage in a love-bombing emotional affair with someone else, to ever allow herself completely out of the discard phase with me.  Imo, its the only way she will get beyond her fear-of-abandonment, since my current indifference (still loving though) to her love-bombing, devaluation and discard are like dealing with a self-protective, high radar, highly aware but still kind and caring stranger on the other sidewalk.

I wish you the best ToH, in your very knowledgable journey this time with the IDD hamster wheel and hoping for you and everyone here as well, that you thoroughly enjoy (with full toolbox protection), your climbing down off the wheel and watching it slowly stop at the turn of discard. 

SoT

[Mary]

Thanks for sharing ToH. I'm learning from you to point out that you are aware of what's not right, and then quickly move into MC and/or indifference.

Question: How do you avoid contempt during the love-bombing phase?

Mary

[1footouttadefog]

My first thoughts after reading this op  were what would happened if you suggested staying home to sit the dog so he could enjoy himself and not bother with two Bs on a leash.

If he declared he never called you a b asks what else is implied by you needing to be in a leash, as you have obviously gotten it all wrong.

[tragedy or hope]

To avoid contempt when being love bombed is a challenge. I say thank you. smile. acknowledge whatever was done. mostly pray. self talk to remember he is 4 emotionally and needs the atta boys.
the more I see things from that perspective the easier it is to respond. it does not mean to me what it means to him, but he cannot comprehend that. He really thinks he is convincing me he loves me.
I do sometimes get impatient with it, but I try not to, it only makes it more difficult.

[1footouttadefog]

So where I get a times is impatient with being patient with a 4year old.i got married to have a MAN in my life and instead have a child to whom I am a permanent parent.  Things have been timed such that right as we are on the way to  becoming empty nesters pd is entering dementia or such.  He would not be able to live alone so divorce would be almost cruel. 

I will see that he is taken care of.  I am trying to live my promises to God.  I am quite frank with Him that I don't like being celibate all this time and trapped in a non marriage with seeming no moral solution.

While it would be easy enough to outsource this aspect of my life and I would find a great many willing to so engage, and even if I could somehow justify this for myself, I don't see a way that justify it for the other person.  I don't see taking a really great guy down with me, nor do I see being a bad Christian example to someone who needs led closer to God not further away. 

So on I march, trying the wait upon the Lord knowing that His Grace is sufficient. 

[tragedy or hope]

Oh 1foot,
That all sounds so sad. I appreciate your commitment to what you know is right. I too think there is a level of dementia... from past health issues.

Things continue to deteriorate. I almost have to tell him what the definition is of most words I use... I can't tell if this is pd manipulation or he really doesn't know. Seems to do fine outside the relationship so...

The physical stuff... no easy answer. God knows what you need, beyond that there isn't much I can say.

I am sad for you and I understand. I am grateful for your sharing and that you come to this site. Who else would get all this!?! Your strength and dignity come through your words.