Help with gut wrenching physical reaction

[bunnie]

I assume this is a good spot for this.

I need tips on how to identify the exact cause of that sucker punch feeling. What thought am I having behind the feeling and how to dispel it as quickly as possible.

I recognize the feeling from childhood. That "I'm in trouble, something horrible is about to happen". I would get the feeling whenever my parents argued or I knew I was in trouble. It only
eased up when my parents were happy and/or my mom started speaking to me again. I'd get the feeling when I was blamed over my siblings for being a troublemaker in the family. If my dad was angry or my mom was angry or sad...another sucker punch.

So I know when it started, but it has extended for decades and into other areas of life, friends, neighbors, acquaintances, cashiers, call center workers. If I get a whiff that someone is unhappy or disappointed with me...stomach knots that last for ages even when I give a proper and mature response. It takes so long to come down off of the "I'm bad" and "how can I fix it?" feelings. Really it feels like impending doom.

Just a few minutes ago, I was talking to my dad on the phone. My nephew, who I'm estranged from because of difficulties with my sibling entered the room. I told him to tell nephew that I said, "Hi and Happy Birthday". At first he (dad) talked over me and ignored me...sucker punch.  I repeated and he said "ok, I will"...sucker punch. I was firm until he told him. Then he tells me that he said, "thank you". I thanked him and we ended the call with the topic we were on before nephew's presence.

I haven't done anything wrong. But I feel the knots right now. I'm trying to figure out the thoughts behind this reaction and how to correct the thoughts so that I can correct the feelings.

I hope someone understands this and has some tips.

[Poison Ivy]

Anxiety can cause "gut-wrenching physical reactions." Often, although not always, when I become anxious or worried or nervous about something, the feelings go almost immediately from my head to my gut. One thing you could do is to look up "panic attacks" and determine whether the symptoms seem to match what you're experiencing.

[bunnie]

Mine goes from my gut to my head; head started pounding as I wrote up this thread. It is definitely an anxiety response. I'm trying to connect the subconscious thought behind the anxiety and how to calm it. I actually feel stuck or paralyzed when this happens. I will research panic attacks. Thank you.

[SonofThunder]

Hi Bunnie,

Im so sorry you experience this feeling.  I could imagine these types of reactions can be associated with traumas and therefore deeply embedded.  In the observation from reading your post, you wrote:

" whenever my parents argued.."
" If my dad was angry or my mom was angry or sad"
" that someone is unhappy or disappointed..."
" he (dad) talked over me and ignored me..."

None of those above are your actions/reactions, but your reactions to other people's actions/reactions (real or assumed).  So is it safe to assume that your actions/reactions (by themselves) don't cause these similar feelings in yourself, but only other people's actions/reactions to you (real or assumed)? 

Is it also safe to assume that you do not get those feelings if that same other person (your father for example) has the exact action/reaction toward someone else (you are definitely not the subject of any focus? 

There is another member here on Out of the FOG, who has adopted the phrase "I am enough".  Its true!  Bunnie, YOU alone are ENOUGH.  You are a self-sustainable human being, and that is a powerful human being.  My opinion is that the answer to any proactive work on reducing this feeling over time, is growing your "I am enough" seeds into a thriving, tall, strong flower garden, so that they gradually overgrow the potential mind-weeds of what others think of you. Im not sure how that is most effective for you to accomplish for yourself, but as your Out of the FOG comrade, I encourage you to start diminishing weeds by growing the overtaking flowers. 

You-are-enough Bunnie!  ☺️

SoT

[bunnie]

Hi Bunnie,

Im so sorry you experience this feeling. - Thank you, SonofThunder.

None of those above are your actions/reactions, but your reactions to other people's actions/reactions (real or assumed).  So is it safe to assume that your actions/reactions (by themselves) don't cause these similar feelings in yourself, but only other people's actions/reactions to you (real or assumed)?  - Yes, I react to the reactions of others. Their moods, their tone of voice, etc. I do know my anxious feelings are irrational. And I hold my own in the moment. But I am sick inside and the after effects are a cascade of stomach knots, headaches, and a type of paralysis that I can't quite explain. Maybe frozen, but still going about my day. Confusion, maybe? I just know it's awful.

Is it also safe to assume that you do not get those feelings if that same other person (your father for example) has the exact action/reaction toward someone else (you are definitely not the subject of any focus?  - Yes, pretty much. When my parents would fight or argue, I felt this way. If my mother was upset or hurt by someone, I felt this way. Overall, though, if anyone else is the subject I can see the situation clearly and assess it properly.

There is another member here on Out of the FOG, who has adopted the phrase "I am enough".  Its true!  Bunnie, YOU alone are ENOUGH.  You are a self-sustainable human being, and that is a powerful human being.  My opinion is that the answer to any proactive work on reducing this feeling over time, is growing your "I am enough" seeds into a thriving, tall, strong flower garden, so that they gradually overgrow the potential mind-weeds of what others think of you. Im not sure how that is most effective for you to accomplish for yourself, but as your Out of the FOG comrade, I encourage you to start diminishing weeds by growing the overtaking flowers.  Thank you for this. That is a great starting point.

You-are-enough Bunnie!  ☺️ - 

[Blueberry Pancakes]

Hi bunnie,
I think you have received great insight already. What comes to mind for me is something regarding a trauma response, and perhaps a freeze / fawn aspect. It is kind of like registering a discrepancy between what you know in your head to be true or good, but expect some result of the opposite.

As you (we) await the resulting actions from others to give evidence validating your own belief it is excruciating. It is like time stands still and you cannot really focus on what you are doing because nothing feels quite safe. It can feel like you are on needles and pins going through the motions until you get the clear signal that everything is alright, and you can come out again. It can be hard to concentrate. You can feel out of body. If any of that sounds familiar, I think it can be something related to trauma.

I am no expert though. This is only one opinion. I do believe a way forward can have something to do with a feeling of "enough-ness" and feeling worthy. Connecting to your own inner wisdom and guidance can provide the stable ride and the safety in the storm, even if things or people around you are turbulent.

[NarcKiddo]

It sounds like it could be an inner child reaction. You got it when you were a child and literally had no power over your situation so you just had to wait in dread for what was going to happen next.

Now, your adult, logical brain can make you react outwardly rationally but the physiological effects still happen because that is what you are conditioned to. Your emotional brain is (at least in part) stuck in that child mode. In your position I would research inner child work and experiment with ways adult you can reassure child you that there is nothing to fear. I haven't done a great deal of this (yet) but what I have done has helped. I used to get a feeling of dread and worry every time I would have to visit my mother. After starting therapy I worked on trying to reassure child me all was OK. When walking up to the house I would say to myself (out loud if nobody was around) "It's OK, Little NarcKiddo. You don't have worry. I've got this, and she won't hurt you. I will protect you." I know it sounds a bit weird but I found it very effective.

[bunnie]

Blueberry Pancakes and NarcKiddo,
Thank you both for sharing your thoughts and perspectives.
Both of your posts resonate and make sense.
I definitely need to practice supporting and validating myself. I've struggled with  this since childhood.  It's awful and I have to fix it. I will get to work researching what you've suggested.

[notrightinthehead]

I agree with the other posters. To me it sounds a lot like when I have a trauma response. Also that it takes so long to calm down- for me that is a sign that I have gone into a panic  state of mind. My response is much more intense and longer than it would be for a normal person who has been slighted.  As I become aware of this state I increase my physical activity, write my fears and anger down and throw that paper away when I am done,  clean something up....
I don't focus much on the triggers because it is impossible for me to avoid them. I focus on how to speed up my snapping out of the trauma response and quickly return to a calm and clear thinking state of mind.

[Sheppane]

Also relate to this and know exactly what it feels like.

I have struggled for a long time with trying to identify what was driving it. I used to find it so physically overwhelming.

In my case I realised it was a combination of a) anxiety but probably more so b) an inner child/ trauma/ fear based response. It used to feel so intense I almost felt I would need to " cut " it out to be rid of it, if that makes sense.

It had a lot of fear in it I think. A part of me primed by hypervigilance and fear of threat that would start screeching at me to watch out. I used to talk to it and say " it's OK,  we got this " as someone else also said. I used to remind the small part of me that I am grown up now and can take care of myself- because part of it was a disabling fear that somehow I couldn't do that. My inner child terrified and forgetting that I am now an adult who can take care of her. And that I have my own power - often it was the feeling that someone else had all the power and I felt terrified and helpless.
It still happens and when it does I still hate it but I think I understand it better. It felt like the place that geld a lot of my trauma.
I hope that helps.

[JollyJazz]

Hi Bunnie,

I'm sorry to hear that you've experienced that!

You are in the right place here!

It does sound like a trauma response.

First up... Is it possible to limit your exposure to PDs in your life? I know this isn't always possible! It does affect our whole nervous system.

Reading Complex PTSD 'from surviving to thriving' by Pete Walker, and 'the Body keeps the score' by Bessell Van DER Kolk really helped me.

Pete Walker has a checklist for dealing with emotional flashbacks:
http://www.pete-walker.com/13StepsManageFlashbacks.htm

One tool that helps me after being triggered is meditation - I learned Vipassana meditation, which involves body scanning.

I also use the 'daily practice' from the wonderful 'crappy childhood fairy', Anna Runkle, and yes, like us, she also had a crappy childhood!
This is her technique:
https://youtu.be/n2lu88X5LH0

A very important thing is to have a 'safe place ', a quiet, peaceful place that you can go to, to do these exercises.

Other things that help me - vigorous exercise, or any exercise really (especially in nature), swimming, anything that involves being in the moment - dance, rock climbing, surfing etc., laughter, yoga etc.
And being around genuinely good people!

One thing I am considering is that I'm a very peaceful person, kind, nice etc. I was never able to express anger, so one of the recommended tactics is to take up kick boxing or something similar as a healthy release for this natural emotion.
:-)

Best wishes!

[bunnie]

notrightinthehead - I think the triggers are so ingrained that focusing on getting out of the trigger response as soon as possible is a great place to put my energy.

Sheppane - I am hypervigilant and it is exhausting. It feels automatic. I think that hypervigilance and feeling like I can't control the outcome is what creates that paralyzed feeling. I have to do more self talk.

Jollyjazz - I agree it affects the whole nervous system. I think I will start to implement more vigorous exercise.

Thank you guys for your sharing and offering some additional tools to help me cope.

[JollyJazz]

Hi Bunnie,

No problem at all. We understand here. I hope the resources help. Emotional flashbacks (those waves of anxiety or shame) are really common with cptsd, which probably most of us long term PD abuse survivors experience. There are some great tools for healing and grounding. Best wishes for your healing journey.

[walking on broken glass]

Hello Bunnie and everyone,

I just read this thread and so much has resonated with me. I am just now recovering from such an emotional reaction to an incident with my sister. I know exactly what you mean, Bunnie, and I experience the same symptoms and the same feeling of impending doom, when I am standing up against someone, and especially my BPD sister. Other people don't understand why I can't just seem to brush these feelings off _ they say just ignore her or you know what she is like or don't get so upset, but they have healthy reactions to conflict and we don't. I grew up with a sister that systematically bullied and terrorized me, and made me feel I should be there for her every need, and that I don't matter. You end up believing you should do everything to please people and that your feelings don't matter. You now know this is true, your brain tells you so, but you body and mind still remember the childhood sensations, the feeling of being trapped, and they can't easily catch up with the logical part of your thinking (I am obviously no expert so excuse the rudimentary language!). I am also looking for tips to get over this as I find it very hard to focus on the now and to remind myself I am safe.

[bunnie]

walking on broken glass,

I'm sorry that I'm just now seeing your reply.
It is so comforting to have so many who understand what we're going through. It can feel like such a lonely road because those we deal with
on a day-to-day basis (even extended family) don't fully understand the effect the dysfunction had on us. I agree that the platitudes do nothing to comfort or help the
situation.
Good luck, best wishes, and prayers on finding healing.

Thanks again, JollyJazz sorry for the late reply to you as well. 

[Phoenix_NL]

I think I know how that feels... Could some of your reaction be caused by suppressed anger? When you write "sucker punch" it would be natural for you to feel lile you are being treated unjustly, and your body wants to speak up for you and tell your dad to stop. But you choke that impulse and ask him calmly and diplomatically to act normal instead - and you're left with a body full of stress-hormones that didn't get any outlet. Just a thought 🙂