What would you guys do?? Dilemma over property

[MarriedFroggy88]

Let's say my NPDfather groomed me into becoming an exact replica of himself.
I studied what he wanted, I worked for him 7 years, and during that time he used me to sign papers for him, to use my bank account to avoid taxes, and tricked me into signing for a property, claiming it was my inheritance (when in reality he just wanted to avoid taxes again).
Well, cue some years later, his company goes bankrupt (because surprise, he mismanaged it and used company money for personal use, etc), gets sued by his workers and asks me to kindly sell the land and give him all the money to pay his debts.

Up to this point I was still enmeshed and agreed to it.
However, my DH and his family, who has been very kind to me, told me to stand up for myself and keep the money, since it was my land and it was not my responsibility to fix his mess. But I was in the FOG, and still wanted to help him.
I decided to pay a fraction of his debts with the money and keep the rest, because I knew that if I gave him everything, he would just spend it and go on trips with my also NPDmother, to whom I was already NC with.

Well, my flying monkey sister who I suspect is also NPD, berated me, saying that money is not mine, that I'm betraying the family and am stealing from my poor elderly parents (who are still young, btw 67 and 52 y/o). She said pretty hurtful things and for a moment I felt FOG again, feeling terribly guilty and miserable. But once I recovered, I realized that it's my right to stand up for myself.

My PDfamily made me feel terrible during the last years I stayed with them. They insulted my DH, insulted me, made me cry countless times. I can't help but want a little bit of justice. The money wouldn't be put to any good in their hands. And it hurts that I could even get a home with that money. In this economy I could not afford to get property of my own even with years of savings. It's just so unfair.

What would you guys do?
Stand your ground and cut ties with them all, while being the bad guy?
or take it back, suck it up and give them all the money in order to regain your peace?

[moglow]

I'm gonna be the one:

A. This is not your sister's stuff and she needs to butt out. I get the "but we're faaaaaamily" but you're betraying and stealing from no.one. AND they aren't elderly.
B. Did sis front him any money, pay any of his debts, etc? Just because she may have, doesn't mean you have to. If she didn't, still not yours to carry.
C. His choices put him in this position. He's damned lucky he put property in your name AND that you shared any of sale proceeds with him. So he's capable of planning ahead and his lawlessness backed him into this corner. Not your stuff.
This isn't about fair or retribution or revenge etc. How long was property in your name- did you pay taxes on it? Were there taxes from the sale? Who paid those - guessing not him.

You do what you need for your own peace of mind and tell them all to go pee up a rope beyond that. Seriously consider setting that money aside for downpayment on your own place. Even if there's not enough to pay outright for it, a hefty down payment will help you get in a place with lower mortgage and debt.


You're absolutely within your rights to refuse to discuss this further, with any of them, anytime you choose.

[Srcyu]

What peace would you regain? The role of being used and pushed around could be about to end.

It's easy for other people to claim that they would keep the money, but I can still remember the younger me who would do as they were told by the family. I think paying him some and keeping a fair bit for yourself is a good compromise.

Like moglow said -  your sister should butt out.


milly

[MarriedFroggy88]

His choices put him in this position. He's damned lucky he put property in your name AND that you shared any of sale proceeds with him. So he's capable of planning ahead and his lawlessness backed him into this corner. Not your stuff.

Exactly my thoughts!

This isn't about fair or retribution or revenge etc. How long was property in your name- did you pay taxes on it? Were there taxes from the sale? Who paid those - guessing not him.

Yup. I will, actually.

You do what you need for your own peace of mind and tell them all to go pee up a rope beyond that. Seriously consider setting that money aside for downpayment on your own place. Even if there's not enough to pay outright for it, a hefty down payment will help you get in a place with lower mortgage and debt.

That's what I was thinking, actually! I was really looking forward to put a downpayment on a piece of land.
Thank you so much for the encouragement! It's sooo easy to fall back into the fog, every bit of empowerment can go down the drain in a second with these people.
I feel better now. I will only give him enough to pay his debt and I'll keep the rest.

[MarriedFroggy88]

What peace would you regain? The role of being used and pushed around could be about to end.

It's easy for other people to claim that they would keep the money, but I can still remember the younger me who would do as they were told by the family. I think paying him some and keeping a fair bit for yourself is a good compromise.

Like moglow said -  your sister should butt out.


milly

Thank you, Milly. You are right. That's what I will compromise with him.
My sister, understandably, is also scared at the thought of having to support them financially, which is why she's so angry at me for keeping the rest of the money.
I keep telling her that it's not her responsibility, but she's so enmeshed with them, it's impossible to make her understand.
But honestly, if she was in my position I bet she would do the same given the chance.

[moglow]

I think the big issue for me is, going into business with someone trying to pull the wool over for taxes doesn't mean they won't hesitate to do the same to me if backed into a corner. That just transferred responsibility for taxes to me, while I had no right to the property I'm now responsible for? I respect that you helped him by putting it in your name, and he took a risk by addressing it as your inheritance. Yes, technically that wasn't his ultimate intention but that's not the point. It's gone now. The money is STILL your inheritance, if you want to look at it that way. If you want to share more, do. If not, don't think you have to apologize.

He can't bamboozle everyone all his life thinking it won't eventually catch up. It's no one else's responsibility to bail him out when it's done anyway.

[NarcKiddo]

I would never tell somebody not to do what they deem necessary to have their own peace of mind and a clear conscience.

BUT

First you have to work out what, precisely, that looks like.

Windmill has already asked what peace you would regain. That is a good question and worth consideration from all angles. If you keep the money will they leave you in peace? If you hand it all over, will that be the end of it? If you keep part, will that compromise be accepted? My gut feeling is that the answer to all of these questions is probably "no" at least to some degree. You may well have to live with being the bad guy at some point whatever you do.

I would suggest you consider carefully what your actual obligations are (if any) vs what your FOO say or think your obligations are. Your father knows how to push your buttons - he installed them. That does not mean that the reactions you have to his pressing them are proportionate or even right. By all means have a clear conscience but make sure it is YOUR conscience.

[MarriedFroggy88]

Windmill has already asked what peace you would regain. That is a good question and worth consideration from all angles. If you keep the money will they leave you in peace? If you hand it all over, will that be the end of it? If you keep part, will that compromise be accepted? My gut feeling is that the answer to all of these questions is probably "no" at least to some degree. You may well have to live with being the bad guy at some point whatever you do.

You're right. If I gave them all the money they will just ask for more when it's over. And I tried negotiating a compromise, but they wouldn't concede, so I just decided to be the bad guy and take the money.
They called me names and said horrible things, but whatever. What's done is done.
Now I'll go NC with everyone and try to heal. I know they will never understand so I just have to find peace with myself.

Thank you all for your advice!

[moglow]

FWIW, if it were mine, she'd call me names and say horrible things as she accepted the money. She had no middle ground, couldn't find and wouldn't give any if it appeared. At some point we all get to take a straight look at those around us and see who they are, sometimes it takes several looks before we say No. That's not how I want to live my life.

[Cat of the Canals]

What would you guys do?
Stand your ground and cut ties with them all, while being the bad guy?
or take it back, suck it up and give them all the money in order to regain your peace?

I'd like a little of A and a little of B.

Be the bad guy AND regain your peace. And by that, I mean that you have probably already been maligned and smeared, and it will continue whether you give them the money or not. So embrace being "the bad daughter/son."

This is an idea I got from Jerry Wise's video here: https://youtu.be/uNWOfXPRNEs
The first 7 minutes are so spot on.

Them: You're selfish!
Me: Yep, I guess so.
Them: You're a terrible daughter.
Me: So terrible. Just the worst.

Give it a whirl. It's amazing how freeing it is to embrace the labels we have been so afraid of "becoming."

[MarriedFroggy88]

FWIW, if it were mine, she'd call me names and say horrible things as she accepted the money. She had no middle ground, couldn't find and wouldn't give any if it appeared. At some point we all get to take a straight look at those around us and see who they are, sometimes it takes several looks before we say No. That's not how I want to live my life.

It's funny cuz she just DEMANDED the money while calling me horrible things. I asked her to apologize and then I would give her the money, but she refused, so... it's her loss. It's so sad to finally see who she really is. She even victim-shamed me and told me to go to therapy to stop feeling sorry for myself. At this point I just blocked her, because as you said, I don't need this in my life.

[MarriedFroggy88]

I'd like a little of A and a little of B.

Be the bad guy AND regain your peace. And by that, I mean that you have probably already been maligned and smeared, and it will continue whether you give them the money or not. So embrace being "the bad daughter/son."

Give it a whirl. It's amazing how freeing it is to embrace the labels we have been so afraid of "becoming."

I saw the video and you're right. Guess I'll embrace being the terrible daughter.
It's really powerful what you said in that last sentence. Right now, I feel a mix of guilt and empowerment. I need to stop feeling guilty and start feeling freedom. Now that I've become what I feared most, there's no looking back. I became a bad daughter. So what!

[Cat of the Canals]

I saw the video and you're right. Guess I'll embrace being the terrible daughter.
It's really powerful what you said in that last sentence. Right now, I feel a mix of guilt and empowerment. I need to stop feeling guilty and start feeling freedom. Now that I've become what I feared most, there's no looking back. I became a bad daughter. So what!

Welcome to the So What Club!