"You were a difficult child"

[WipeOfftheFog]

Hi everyone,

I have been LC with my dad and NC with my uBPD mom for 7 years now. I speak with my dad through text and have been able to sustain somewhat of a supportive relationship this way. Earlier this week, my dad called me (he never does this). Against my better judgement, I decided to call back. He told me that he and my mom are moving to Florida to a senior community and they would like to invite me to visit because "there is a second bedroom and kids and grandkids are allowed to visit." For context, my sister is NC with both of them and same with their only grandson. Immediate red flag- they don't want to see ME, they just want to have any visitor so as not to be the odd person out at the old folks home.

I was honest with my dad and said thank you for inviting me but I don't feel emotionally safe around mom. Has anything changed? (i.e. do you admit there is a problem). That's when the flood gates opened.  He told me that the verbal abuse never happened. That it was normal for parents to call their kids "spoiled brat, miserable, ungrateful, bitch, etc." What REALLY hurt me what this comment "I hate to tell you this but you were a difficult kid to raise. You were oppositional" As a people pleaser who got straight As went to church every Sunday, never even smoked pot and didn't drink until college, I know cognitively this is not true. Yet it still hurts.

Other gems from my dad "Don't blame us that your life didn't turn out the way you wanted it to." I am single but I never said I am unhappy with my life! AND "You wouldn't be as successful as you are without our money." I haven't been dependent on them since my early 20s. Somehow all the good things are to their credit and everything bad is my fault.

I felt abused from this conversation all over again. I could hear my mom screaming in the background, giving away the fact that I was on speaker the whole time without my consent. My dad was cruel and like a different person than when we speak over text. He was parroting things from my mom (I know because she used to accuse me of being "oppositional defiant" as a kid).  Yeah sure as a 3 year old I didn't always want to brush my teeth and as an adult I have different political views than them. Guess that makes me "difficult".

It's so hurtful to see that it's not only that my dad won't intervene to protect his kids- he is actually carrying out the abuse on behalf of my mom. When I look back, its always been that way. He would hit us on her command.

Not sure what I hope to gain by posting here. Maybe some of you will relate. I guess I'm looking for validation after feeling very hurt and gaslit.

[moglow]

I completely understand your hurt and disappointment. To think that after all this time he still doesn't have your back. That he called presumably at her demand and seemingly to put you in your place (the one she chose!) via speakerphone. A double whammy.


I get it - he's married to her and does what he must to keep the peace. But at the price of his children?? Perhaps "don't blame me when she's gone and you realize your children are too" is a nice inner response.


Welcome, friend. I'm sorry you need us - and glad you found us.

[Cat of the Canals]

As a people pleaser who got straight As went to church every Sunday, never even smoked pot and didn't drink until college, I know cognitively this is not true. Yet it still hurts.

I was the same people-pleasing goodie-two-shoes, minus church, and my mother still loves to cackle and tell me it's a good thing I'm self-employed because I'm "unemployable." (I've had employers BEG me to stay when I put in my two weeks.) She asks when I got "so ornery." (Ornery = not following The Queen's orders.) And waxes about how I was such a good BABY, and she "doesn't know what happened." (Me being independent = bad) Until I came Out of the FOG, I thought these were jokes. Only recently have I remembered that jokes are supposed to be funny.

I can't imagine how painful that phone call was for you. One crappy parent is bad enough, but to have the other play the role of their minion cuts even deeper. But I'm glad you saw the gaslighting for what it was.

[Call Me Cordelia]

Wow, classic DARVO right there.

Has anything changed?

Deny: The verbal abuse never happened. The names we called you? Totally normal.

Attack: You were a miserable, difficult kid. You wouldn't be where you are today without our money. (Interesting how it's all about money and appearances.)

Reverse Victim and Offender: You were oppositional. Don't blame us that your life didn't turn out the way you wanted it to.

Oh, brother. 

Of course it's easy for me to give this the eyeroll from across the internet. I do know full well that it really, really hurts.  You've managed this relationship with your dad with super boundaries for seven years now. Which is truly absolutely an amazing feat, major kudos to you! But this, the first time you've actually spoken in how long? This is the best he can do. Zero empathy. Right back to abuse and being your mother's minion. Guilt tripping you and making it very clear that it isn't you they care about at all, but the opinions of their new neighbors!  If he had any self-awareness at all he'd be feeling very, very ashamed right now.

I too have been on the receiving end of similar tactics. I too was a straight-A church kid who was inexplicably so DIFFICULT. I too have been accused of blaming my parents for everything wrong with my life, and when they couldn't point to terrible things in my life that I was supposed to assign them blame for, they just went right ahead and made shit up! And then they used that shit to explain why I would go NC with them. So much easier to believe that I had postpartum depression and severe marital problems and they were showing me "tough love" by refusing to fly to my rescue and give in to my silent treatment. Yep. DARVO. It explains a lot.

https://beyondbetrayal.community/darvo-what-it-is-and-how-to-get-out/

I'm really sorry. You have really clear insight into what was going on here and you are well placed to handle it. So glad you are here.

[MIB]

Hello WipeOfftheFog,

I'm raising my hand here...I experienced similar things with my father (who I believe was a narc and 100% enabled my uBPD mother).

Anything bad that they did? Well they didn't, but if they did I deserved it!

Anything bad (aka not aligned to them) that I did? I'm "a total f$&!ing disappointment"! (And I was a consistent honour student, had a university scholarship, got a masters degree, good job, am entirely self sufficient and happily married...yeah, totally disappointing  ).

Anything good I accomplished? I wouldn't have done it without them and "I owe them"!

For your sanity, you have to let this stuff roll off, and stay as far away from the crazy as possible.

And always, ALWAYS consider the source. PDs have a mental illness. Don't attach your self worth to the rants of a mentally ill person. Instead, be sure to love and treat yourself kindly yourself because you deserve it - no matter what you're told ❤️

Big hugs

[lkdrymom]

If anything, you just had reinforcement as to why you will not be visiting.

[sunshine702]

I get it.  It extra hurts when the slightly less abusive parent plays flying monkey.  I remind myself A LOT that adults get to make decisions for themselves in their best interest.  As a kid you have to survive but as an adult you have every right not to EVER visit.  What?  For more of that.  Yeah no thanks.  It's about power.  How YOU are wrong because it is showing that no one comes to visit. 

[Mathilda]

Yup, can relate.
Funny how they are all the same. Like Cat of the Canals, my mother (who now lives in a nursing home and is in an advanced stage of Alzheimer's) also complained that I was such a sweet baby, but now I was "never nice to her". I was nicer to my cat than I was to her etc. In my Baby Memory Book there's a page where she literally wrote "Your such a sweet baby, but how long will you stay like that?" (I'm sorry mom, but definitely not forever). A few pages further she wrote that I was mean, because I played with my brother's toys but got angry when he took them back.

While we grew up, brother turned into a real problem child. Dropped out of school, got wrong friends, carried weapons. He chased me with a dagger once - mother told me all siblings argue sometimes.
I was a "good girl", went to school, didn't drink, didn't smoke, my biggest hobby was astronomy. I went to college, I work, I pay my bills. Brother has lived on benefits and my parents' pocket for more than 30 years.

I suspect my father has narcissistic traits, but he was mainly her enabler and her parrot. He has a mild cognitive disability, mother on the other hand was an intelligent woman and after some years she decided that the marriage hadn't worked out as she had expected, but instead of divorcing him, he got his own bedroom and weekly pocket money. He completely depended on my mother and did everything she said.

Well, yesterday my father's neighbour came to me because she hadn't seen him for almost a week, the curtains were closed and the mailbox was full. She had rung the doorbell, but he didn't open the door. She wondered if something happened or perhaps she should call the police.

I called my uncle, I don't know him very well but we spoke a few times over the phone last year when I told him lots of things that had happened between my parents, my brother and me, the fysical and emotional abuse that had taken place, which ultimately led me to go NC. He wanted to help my dad now my mom had gone to a nursing home, but he also seemed to understand why I wanted to stay NC. He seemed very nice and I thought he had my back. So I called him and asked if he had spoken my dad recently and if he knew why nobody had seen him for almost a week.

He did. My father is on a holiday and will be back on Friday. And, he added, you would have known if you talked to your dad. The rest of the conversation was a giant attack and guilt trip. I should go to my parents and tell them how much I love them before it's too late. By the way he sneered, you will probably be completely alone when you die (I'm 57, also single and no kids, but I'm perfectly fine with that).The worst thing he said was that my dad had told him so many negative things about me, he couldn't help feeling an aversion to me. Although, he had to admit, he didn't really know me well and knew there were many, many things wrong between my parents and me. But, he thought I lacked persuasiveness, being an adult woman I should be able to persuade my parents into listening to me and help them making the right decisions. It was my own lack of persuasiveness that made things impossible.

At one point I interrupted him without letting him finish his sentence, which I regret and for which I apologized, but he got furious, and told me he could imagine me doing the same when I talk to my parents and he could understand why they have so many problems with me.

I finished the conversation as politely as I could, but I felt like an awfull human being and the worst daughter you could ever imagine..

But I agree with MIB "that you have to let this stuff roll off and stay as far away from the crazy as possible". A few years ago a conversation like this would have knocked me off of my feet for 2 weeks and lead to serious selfdoubt. Although excruciating and insulting, I find that one day later, thanks to this board, I feel mostly recovered from the attack. Will never call uncle again, but that goes without saying.

The board has helped me a lot in dealing with this stuff. You're at the right place!

[Spring Butterfly]

That call verified your decision to keep distance and you are not emotional sage is correct. At the same time it ripped open the wound.

Not sure what I hope to gain by posting here. Maybe some of you will relate. I guess I'm looking for validation after feeling very hurt and gaslit.

You are seen. You are heard. You are validated. We get it and travel our healing journey alongside you.

[sunshine702]

Not Persuasive Enough?!  You would have KNOWN if you spoke to your parent's more?!  Oh wow this is really abusive gaslighting.  When I get attacks like this they hurt like heck while it is happening but often later I can see it as what it is PROJECTING ANGER.  This has much more to do with him than you.  Know that

[Cat of the Canals]

Not Persuasive Enough?!  You would have KNOWN if you spoke to your parent's more?!  Oh wow this is really abusive gaslighting. 

 

I have to say, the whole "you weren't persuasive enough" thing is one of the most bizarre things I've ever heard. Truly grasping at straws, methinks.

[Mathilda]

Not Persuasive Enough?!  You would have KNOWN if you spoke to your parent's more?!  Oh wow this is really abusive gaslighting.  When I get attacks like this they hurt like heck while it is happening but often later I can see it as what it is PROJECTING ANGER.  This has much more to do with him than you.  Know that

I know. Since that conversation I have no doubt my uncle is pretty narcissistic too. When I asked if he was still in contact with my dad (last year he said he had stopped calling him) he said "Yes, I am, but I don't know if the other siblings of your father are!". Which sounded weird. It appeared that he's also visited my mom a few times in the nursing home, last year we spoke about going there together, because I wanted to see her, but not without someone who would support me. He knew, but still he went to my mom without ever telling me.

It feels like he's only helping my dad because it feeds his ego. He wants to be the special one, the "good" sibling, something like that. Good luck with that 
At first I was really hurt, but now I'm only angry for the way he treated me. Will never call him again, and I immediately blocked his number so he can also never call me.

[Mathilda]

Not Persuasive Enough?!  You would have KNOWN if you spoke to your parent's more?!  Oh wow this is really abusive gaslighting. 

 

I have to say, the whole "you weren't persuasive enough" thing is one of the most bizarre things I've ever heard. Truly grasping at straws, methinks.

I agree, it's totally bizarre. That man has a very creative mind.

[monamurre]

Sorry you got the "you were a difficult child" nonsense. That was one of my mom's favorite ways to cut me down to size.

I used to hear story after story about what a hard kid I was to raise. I used to totally buy these stories and still struggle with feeling like there is something fundamentally bad about me. The thing is many of these stories were about me under the age of 5 or so....So, with a little distance and more clarity I can also see the absurdity of blaming a toddler for wandering off, or a 3 year old for being oppositional.

What did they think parenting was going to be, a fucking walk in the park?!

I think the thing that pisses me off more than the hyper-focus on anything considered "bad" behavior (even if the standards were absurd) was the lack of acknowledging the good behavior. I achieved far more than either of my parents expected of me. Their response to all of those accomplishments, crickets. It really reinforced their narrative that I was bad, and it was really damaging. I imagine we both could have used a lot more praise and kudos along the way.

I hope you can box up that nonsense and leave it outside the door. Your parents perceptions of you are likely not at all accurate.

[blacksheep7]

You were a difficult child   

They all (pds) speak the same language.