Double bind over visiting

[WombatOpera]

I don't know where to post this.  I am next of kin for an adult who has an intellectual disability and more than one influential uNPD person in their family.  My person no longer wants to see me and they have become dishonest about various aspects of their daily life.  It's not socially acceptable for me not to visit and keep an eye on this person, and have dialogue with their caregivers and the day place they go to, but my person is able enough to make that difficult or impossible.

Has anyone had an experience like this?

[bloomie]

WombatOpera - oh goodness, yes. This is a hard one for sure. Are you able to do the oversight you need to primarily by phone or email making in person visits more infrequent? I guess what I am asking is are you able to bypass a difficult person who is attempting to act as gatekeeper at least some of the time?

[WombatOpera]

bloomie thank you, unfortunately that is not an option as my person does not answer phone calls, texts, or emails.
I guess you could say the real difficulty is that they will not come out and say they don't want contact, even to tell someone else, so it looks as if I am neglecting them.

 

[SonofThunder]

Hello WombatOpera,

Are you able to directly communicate your concerns about the wellbeing of the adult, with the caregivers at the day-place, and alert them that for some unknown reason, your communication with the adult, is being hindered?  This explanation is purely describing the truth of your own experiences and so therefore the concern you have for the adult. Your shared experiences are not about the PD's who may be manipulating, but only what you are experiencing and the confusion you may be having as a result.

In my experience, PD's enjoy controlling and manipulation of people in close relationship circles, as the PD is able to hide the reality behind a carefully projected facade wall. Relationships that are not as close, only see the pretty side of the wall. The day-place caregivers may be outside the wall so they are unaware that your communication has been cut off, but are familiar enough with you, to know that communication was running smooth prior to now.

Imo, alerting the caregivers to the communication change that occurred to you, is not for your own wellbeing or social standing, but strictly for the wellbeing of the adult that needs care, therefore your private chat with the caregivers is fully in the best interest of the adult that needs care. 

Other than the benefit of alerting a caregiver of your concern for the wellbeing of this adult, the residual benefit you may experience is that the covert shutdown of communication you are experiencing behind the facade wall, will now be outside the facade, as it reaches the caregivers. In my experiences, when PD's find out the truth is now outside the facade, they may drop their motive to avoid exposure of the manipulation. Imo, motive is everything for PD's. Your motive is purely the wellbeing of the adult in need, so no matter what dust you may stir up by communicating true concern, your motive is clearly not neglect. 

Wishing you and the adult in need, the best.

SoT

[WombatOpera]

SonofThunder your reply is very helpful thank you, I need to tell the caregivers what is happening but stick
to the facts.  I was interested in what you said about how they often give it up once it is out in the open.
It makes me think of some advice I was given for family troubles: keep in touch without trying to fix anything.
I was always told to keep in touch, but the last half of the instruction is where the power lies and without
it, it's just more and more drama.  Maybe it applies to caregivers as well, I will find out over the next year or two.

Thank you again, I will make a time to talk to the staff face to face

[SonofThunder]

WombatOpera,

You are welcome and I surely hope you are able to resolve the situation so that the adult is cared for in the most beneficial way possible, without also straining your ability or desires for care.  I agree with you that sticking only to the facts, which from your description, is your loss of communication and concern for the adult. Imo, doing so will assist the true motive you have for proper care of this adult and open communication, which includes your desire for no abuse to be occurring to this adult behind the facade. 

My two PD's work very hard to keep their motives hidden, the facade up and well maintained.  They will fabricate, twist, situationally manipulate, withhold and all the other traits that PD's do to accomplish their motive goals behind the wall, while all others see only the well maintained side of the facade.

I believe there are 5 circles of relationship. My opinion of these circles has been bolstered by experiences with two different types of PD's (my father and also my wife) and also from the teachings of Dr. Ramani. Imo, circle 1 and 2 are behind the facade wall.  Circle 3 is on the outside of the wall, but may experience very odd behavior if the PD is cornered emotionally or situationally.  Circles 4 and 5 are outside the wall and know a completely different PD person than circles 1 and 2 experience in private. 

My guess from your post is that you are in circle 3, even though you are next of kin, due to the adult being intellectually disabled, and you having formed a close caregiving relationship with the disabled adult, who is living within a circle 1 or 2 type relationship with the PD's.  You may be interacting in close care with this disabled adult enough that you are now aware of some of the PD behaviors occurring within the inner protected circles.  Therefore, the PD's are manipulating communication to get you back on your proper side of the facade wall, so their control motives may continue without exposure. 

Below is my opinion of the circles that exist.  I share this because it has been helpful for me understand circle roles of people in my life, therefore the dynamics that may/may-not be known by certain people, which helps me make proper decisions that are both effective and self-protective. 

Circle 1: Spouse

Circle 2: Children

Circle 3: Siblings, Parents/Grandparents, Extremely Close Friends.

Circle 4: Frequent/Deep Acquaintances (Non-FOO family members, service provider such as a doctor, neighbor, coworker, group such as church or club member, etc)

Circle 5: Infrequent/Shallow Acquaintances (grocery clerk, postal carrier, pharmacist, etc)

SoT

[SonofThunder]

WombatOpera,

My apologies for any confusion. I was thinking again about my circle descriptions. I probably should not assign my opinions of relationship titles in the circles, as each of us may have different people/titles to the circles but rather just say that I believe the facade wall is between circles 2 and 3. Imo, circles 2 and 3 are where the PD's public reputation risks being exposed.

Many people here on Out of the FOG, including me, have a parent and/or sibling who operate covertly behind the facade wall, as the relationships are close enough to do so effectively. I have both a PDf and PDw.

In my experience, the extreme privacy of circle 1 and the legal contract union that exists in a spouse, creates the most covert adult manipulation I have ever experienced. I was also heavily manipulated and controlled by my father in my childhood, but not as intensely covert as my spouse relationship. Once I was a legal adult and moved away from my parents, the abuse from my father was less frequent and in different ways where connection and/or control was still present, but still attempted to be behind the wall.   

I don't desire to hijack your thread, but only discussing my opinion on circles as it helps me understand where I am in relation to the facade wall, therefore sharing with you as some circle hierarchy could possibly exist with your adult intellectually disabled relative. That disabled adult is possibly in a closer circle to the PD than you, therefore you may be experiencing communication shutout to get you back on the prettier side of the facade wall.

Relationship circle correction to my last post: (these are my experiences only)

Circle 1: Spouse

Circle 2: Children, siblings, parents

—- FACADE WALL —-

Circle 3: Grandparents, extremely close friends, some additional close family members, employer, close-coworker

Circle 4: Frequent closer acquaintances, service provider such as a doctor, neighbor, church or club member, etc

Circle 5: Infrequent shallower acquaintances (grocery clerk, postal carrier, pharmacist, etc)

I hope your communication improves,

SoT

[WombatOpera]

Thank you SonofThunder, that is correct.  I read your update as I was writing my reply, which asked what happens if the two people occupy different circles in each other's lives, that is, I am close to you, but you are not close to me.
But you have tidied it up.

I think you are right, my relative will have had a phone call or other interaction with one of the PDs and it has made them go numb.  They aren't angry so much as unconscious. It's what I feared. What will happen next is that my relative will have a surge of emotion, in a week or maybe 6 months, and then I will not know what to do with this emotional wrecking ball. When people don't like what they see, they say "but they are disabled!" and "but they are an adult!" over and over again.

I'm sorry about your repeated PD experience, I see this pattern everywhere and often the sufferer has no idea of the origins.  For a long time I wanted a separation between my relative and the PD person, but then I realised, if not them, they would just find someone else identical, because that is how things are set up. And so it has proved to be.

[SonofThunder]

For a long time I wanted a separation between my relative and the PD person, but then I realised, if not them, they would just find someone else identical, because that is how things are set up. And so it has proved to be.

I agree and its a sad truth.  At the same time, I commend you for being a loving person in the life of this adult and for potentially reaching out to the daytime caregiving persons who are detached and outside the facade wall.

Those caregivers may ask questions of the intellectually disabled adult and/or influencing PD's and that will alert the PD's that their actions behind the facade wall are being noticed.

You are a caring and inquisitive person WombatOpera, and the world needs more of your kind. 

SoT

[WombatOpera]

SoT that is very kind and I can sure use the moral support at the moment