Catching PD behavior on video...

[rockandhardplace]

One of the books I'm reading or listening to (I can't remember which!) described how "discussions" go with someone with NPD. The thing that really struck me was not just how they deflect away from what you want to discuss to avoid taking any accountability for their own behaviors, or the accusations etc... but how they move on to a new topic / accusation  / interrogation before allowing you to respond to what they've already said. I watched a video I have of the NPD in my life and was actually shocked to see this in action. I assume this had happened in most of the conversations we had over the years that left me feeling confused and abused even before he started calling me names. He basically just rages on with weird complaints and throws out all these weird accusations in the form of questions but I never get to respond  to any of them because he keeps talking over me and layering new accusations on top. It's enlightening but also still so maddening to watch in action. Without having a video recording of the whole thing I'd come away just feeling confused. For so many years I really believed we just had communication issues.

I only have a few of these videos as I just started taking when he was yelling an inch from my face. He controls much of the overtly abusive behaviors but this way of speaking to me is just so normal to him he doesn't feel any need to change that for the camera. They're horrible to watch back but all of them have the same structure. He rants about some nonsense then talks over me when in a normal conversation it would be my turn to speak and then adds a new accusation phrased as a question that I never get to answer and then another. By the time I get to speak I've forgotten most of the accusations and try to respond to the most recent or the one that I'm really upset about. That's when he walks away with "boring" or some other nasty way of dismissing me.

This is helpful in solidifying in my mind that there is absolutely no point ever ever trying to have any type of conversation with him, ever. But it maddens me to think of all the years I was subjected to that without realising what was happening. I wish there was some way of educating the world about PD's so other people don't waste so much of their lives.

[bloomie]

rockandhardplace - videos and recordings can be very helpful in offering insights and identifying verbally abusive - and I would hazard to suggest from what you describe happening - at the least physically dominating and intimidating behaviors followed by belittling. All quite toxic and I am so sorry you have been subjected to this. 

[escapingman]

Recordings are extremely valuable if you question yourself. I hade hundreds of voice recordings of my uNPDxw and every time I questioned myself I either listened to one of them or read a couple of paragraphs in my journal. Without this I am not sure I would have kept the belief and carried on. 

[JR]

this is very interesting topic, I was going to start a thread about video recording or picture taking a Narc in full Rage mode to use it in a situation where the Police might have to be called or a court appearance over fighting with a Narc might be necessary. I did this with my severely NPD brother, he was raging at me for using his oil drain pan to do an oil change on my car without his permission to, i've been using it for years without an issue until I started catching on to his bad toxic behaviors and started to enforce boundaries on him and he did'nt like it of course, and this was his revenge on the evil doer(me). I caughtit in full rage with those Black eyeballs and Racoon eyes they get at full rage with all the expletives too, to use if the cops were to come by as evidence, because he would just deny it otherwise that it never happened and I was the one who freaked out on him, if anything he may have got the message that he wasn't dealing with a pushover anymore. I think that pictures and recordings would be good evidence in court or if police were involved.

[NBRiverGuy]

Recordings are extremely valuable if you question yourself. I hade hundreds of voice recordings of my uNPDxw and every time I questioned myself I either listened to one of them or read a couple of paragraphs in my journal. Without this I am not sure I would have kept the belief and carried on. 

I thought about it after the fact last weekend when my wife went off on me for hours. But, we live in a non-alimony state, we don't have children, and all of our friends and family already know that she has mental problems, so sharing audio/video evidence with anyone would just be for my own vindication which I don't need. Then, I thought, "What if I caught that on camera and showed it to her? What would her reaction be?" I know what it would be. She would fly into another rage and admonish me for recording her.

[firepoetry]

I used to make audio recordings of my ex narc, and did so of his mother (histrionic).

His mother was just overt, and so it was harder on my brain to be in a conversation with her. To boot, she paired with her husband (Nex's dad) and they would frequently switch sides. It's literally like the Dr. Scott Peck book of the two sets of narcissistic parents, each with a son. One set of parents had failed to understand why it was bad to give their son THE SUICIDE WEAPON GUN that his brother had used to kill himself. Both sets of parents had a changing dialogue that altered when confronted by power. In the example of the Gun parents, Dr. Scott Peck had mentioned that he recommended the son go live with an aunt that he expressed interest in living with. At first the parents were co-communicating about how that was a terrible idea and would never work. When Dr. Peck said something to the effect of, well, then I guess I'll make a recommendation that he go to juvenile detention. (Therapy was an alternative to juvenile detention because he stole cars, I believe). Without missing a beat, they changed their tone as if they had agreed that it was a good decision all along, to go live with his aunt.

I don't want to get all into the chaos that his parents were raining on me, but the more I listened to the conversations, the more I realized the manipulations, though it was hard for me to wrap my brain around it.

I have started recording conversations with Nex, and I was able to recognize, in the moment, his tactics of altering the conversation. When I confronted him, in this case, that he was trying to force our daughter to do meditation (long story) and that he threatened to cancel his visits with child if she didn't do it, and that he had told me the same, specifically stating to me, "Well, I can't take away a (friend) visit, so I'll take away my visit." Which is total manipulation, and he knows it.

When I confronted him, he totally changed the topic, and at many times tried to get me to respond. I have poker face, btw. But, not only that, he doesn't know what my triggers are anymore, and what he thought would trigger me and throw me off his trail, didn't. I kept at him with persisting with, you told me "Well, I can't take away a (friend) visit, so I'll take away my visit." Then he started blaming child and changed his story completely around (on the second take) stating that child had said, well fine, if you make me do meditation, then I will not come here anymore." And, his response was this long drawn out thing (after having time to think about it while I was defending myself on one of his accusations, giving himself time to come up with an answer. The problem, is I kept on, and stated, but you told me "Well, I can't take away a (friend) visit, so I'll take away my visit." And, he said, well, yes, after all of that, I said, fine I'll give you the choice to make that decision, and I figured that in the parenting theory of (Me) and (child's therapists) I felt I could make that kind of strong statement.

So, he totally didn't understand the point of my argument, because he never really listens. And, I have it all recorded so I can continue to untraumatize myself from his circular conversations.

[NBRiverGuy]

Recordings are extremely valuable if you question yourself. I hade hundreds of voice recordings of my uNPDxw and every time I questioned myself I either listened to one of them or read a couple of paragraphs in my journal. Without this I am not sure I would have kept the belief and carried on. 

I've been thinking about this since I initially responded. I said that the evidence would only be for my own vindication and I don't need that. However, I do find that there is a part of my brain that keeps asking the logical side, "Are you sure you're not exaggerating? Is it really that bad?" This is usually after the incident is over and everything has been peaceful for a few days. I keep on posting and reading my post on this forum so that I don't get lulled back into that trance.

[JR]

i recorded my brother in full rage fit over some nonsensical issue mostly because it would work as evidence in case police were involved or restraining him in a legal sense may be necessary, i still have this video on my cell and i really don't want to look at because its so disturbing makes me sick to watch it, this easily could have escalated to a knock down blow out psychical fight had it not been stopped by my sister(enabler/covert narc) and sent him running out the door(probably threatened to call the cops on him) and he was smart enough to realize i had the evidence of him in full rage fit, so it worked in a sense but also in a sense it would escalate this war with him to nuclear levels because i outsmarted the disordered creature, and you know they hate to lose the fight/argument, this cannot stand.