The cycle goes on

[escapingman]

I have had a feeling, this calm can't continue. I was right..... Almost 2 years NC/VLC, 1 year divorced and 8 months since last financial tie broke.

I am calm. I have been healing. I have listened to tons of books, watched videos, moved my focus from her to me. Doing meditation, following Eckart Toll and watch a couple of videos a day, Alan Watts videos, practising being in the present moment, being authentic, being conscious. Not perfect, still get triggered but nothing like before.

So she made an almighty verbal attack on DD for no other reason than that she could, and needed to. She tried to get through to me but DD just about stopped her from entering the house, I didn't know what was going on. Know she messages me abuse from DD2's phone pretending to be DD2.

Somethings never change.......

[square]

I'm sorry, the crazy continues.

I both applaud DD for her ability to push back, and also feel so bad she's in that position.

When this stuff happens, does DD pull back from contact for a while?

Does guilt or obligation pull her back in?

[escapingman]

When this stuff happens, does DD pull back from contact for a while?

Does guilt or obligation pull her back in?

DD pulls back, but this is the worst so far so I imagine this will be a long no contact from DD. I think uNPDxw might stonewall DD as well so might be mutual. uNPDxw is after me, she wants a reaction from me, that is quite clear to me. But she might go for DD again if she struggles for supply from me.

I don't think guilt or obligation will drag DD back in. The reason she got into the last episode is that uNPDxw used DD2 as a bait and made it clear we wouldnt see her unless DD came to her car to see her, if not she would enter the house (I was upstairs unaware what exactly was going on). uNPDxw later on demanded me to come out and also for DD to apologise (for nothing). My gut feeling is that uNPDxw is after me now, she is in a cycle and I have seen it before, DD recorded some of it and listening to it I recognised it.

[square]

What a mess.

Your DD and mine are similar in both being difficult to get them to do things they don't want to do. A curse in some ways but also a giant blessing. Your DD has already developed a strong set of boundaries, and she may tighten them up with her mom after this.

[escapingman]

DD has been given freedom following the separation between me and her mum and she is embracing it. Her mum still tries to control her and DD doesn't like it. She has seen the light and she ain't going back.

[escapingman]

Ok this escalated fast, some fast lies from DD2 and uNPDxw and now social is involved. Watch the space, I have my oxygen mask firmly on this time.

[square]

Good grief.

I wonder what triggered this latest gambit.

[escapingman]

I wonder what triggered this latest gambit.

I think it's a combination of needing supply and control. DD has been changing plans with her on a regular basis lately and that has most likely triggered her to feel a loss of control. This loss of control has most likely also left her with low supply and what better than cause a big new drama where big bad EM is no longer going to see DD2 UNLESS he comply to the new rules invented.

[escapingman]

I really struggle with what to do, this latest drama involves direct lies by DD2 which has raised safe guarding concerns and in the end is risking my custody over DD. I have quite a few recordings from before separation if when DD2 and uNPDxw verbally abuse me and DD that I have not shared with anyone of respect for DD2. I am not getting to the point I feel the time has come to release the whole truth, it will obviously anger DD2 but I am running out of options. The question is, do I share this with school as they now think I am an abusive alcoholic? Or do I wait until social services are involved, if it goes to that? Or do I make a threat to DD2 or uNPDxw that unless the accusations are withdrawn I will release the tapes? I feel they backed me in to a corner and I have no other option than war.

[square]

EM, I'm sorry, this sounds awful.

I gave this some thought, and from where I'm sitting I'm leaning toward you going to the school and clearing this right the hell up.

I understand your desire to protect DD2, but apparently your XW will not stop and DD2 will just get deeper into this mess.

Threatening will just show your cards and give another opportunity for XW to make another move.

Leaving it until social services is involved seems like a total non option to me.

There are no scenarios where DD2 is unscathed. The best of all lousy outcomes for her is at least to not learn that this crap works.

A call to your solictor may be in order.

[square]

And don't forget, DD's safety and security is on the line, don't just let it sit - is my way of thinking based on how I read your post.

[escapingman]

Thanks for your input square. I have given it a lot of thought over the last couple of days and I will reveal the truth to school. I am constructing an email where I am explaining the back ground, in case they have forgotten, and mentioning the recordings. At the moment I am planning to attach a couple to the email, but not decided if I should ask to come in to school and play them there. I am quite concerned that they won't take me seriously and just fob be off as if I am just trying to blame, the same as during the divorce with the social worker and judge. There is another issue in all this and it is school holiday next week and I am not sure if the relevant people are working or not, and I also don't know if they have reported this to social services yet or not. I was promised a call from school to explain what was going on, but that never happened before the weekend.

[Rose1]

This is a very difficult one. I agree with square that you can't let this appear to work otherwise you will get variations on the theme ad infinitum. Plus the risk to DD and custody is an issue. Is dd old enough to make her own decisions who she lives with?  That might be a factor.

A suggestion since I think from memory both girls attend the school? Explain your deep concern for your dd2 that she should feel compelled to say this stuff that's  patently untrue. That you don't want to drag dd into it but anyone that knows you knows it isnt true. Maybe agree that dd2 might need to be reported as needing counselling?? And some support to find out what is behind the fabrication and you would support her getting counselling.(Fabrication is such a good word -not as confronting to schools as lies)

Make it from the point of view of concern for the girls and the stress dd2 must be going through  rather than divorce drama and crazy ex.

Without knowing what has been spread I don't know about the tapes. It will damage dd2 for sure. Exw will probably teflon her way out of them. Maybe throw dd2 under the bus as well. Decide if you need to show them but I wouldn't let control of them out of your hands. Ie show but don't email.

We found that people discount 50% of what you tell them as made up. And since most of the time we tone down what is really going on, they only believe about 25% of reality. It's also confronting to people I believe and their minds switch off. This makes it hard .

[square]

I would lean toward asking for a meeting asap. Either they can wait a week or the relevant people can come in.

I lean toward you sending a brief response including that you have proof.

Then making a bullet list for yourself about how you would present this.

There is really an advantage to doing this in person if possible, except for those who have social difficulties but I assume you don't and will come off well.

[escapingman]

Thanks for your input, my freeze response really are kicking in and I just want to go to bed and cry. My heart is dying having my children being used as pawns in a sick persons games. I am so scared of not being believed again and I can't really face going through another batch of accusations with people judging and blaming me. I really don't know how much I can manage if I am not believed. This whole thing is not helped by the fact that DD really doesn't grasp the situation and continue pushing me to my limits to get her way.

Anyway, I will follow your advice and not send the recordings but suggest I have them. I will try to build a case around why DD2 is fabricating things where it comes from. I will try to explain what really happened and suggest I have evidence. I will also ask for her to see a counsellor to dry to dig out the truth, and not just listen to and believe her fabrications (not sure how to formulate that though).

I understand that schools must take children's safety concerns seriously, but there must be some kind of limit to how much they can believe to be true without questioning it. I am quite astonished that school decided they were going to raise this with social without even talking to me about my side of the story, DD had already told school what DD2 said was not true and there were no safety concerns what so ever. The latest is so far fetched so I am hoping it will be obvious that it is a lie. The funny (not really) thing is that the lie has just started being told and was never mentioned during the divorce or when spoken to social services in the past and relates to before separation.

[square]

I understand your freeze response; I'm a freezer and formerly a flee-er.

What I want you to do, EM, is put on a suit of self righteousness, button it up, feel your spine straightening as you tie your tie, dust off your shoulders as you square them.

You are more than a match for your ex.

You have the receipts. You're smart. You're reasonable. You have communication skills and 100% of the truth on your side.

Yes, mention that this never came up before despite all the occasions any reasonable party would have brought it up - during divorce proceedings, during previous social services interviews, previous school complaints, etc. It's one of several pieces of evidence.

I do actually understand the school just referring to social services rather than starting with you. Imagine a child, not yours, disclosing abuse. The school calls the parent and invites them to explain. Parent comes rolling in there and sweet talks the school. School is dazzled. Kid learns to never disclose again.

Better for the school to leave it to the folks whose job it is to figure this out. And we know they screw it up too, but better them than the school.

You have a lot of evidence going for you.

You got this.

[escapingman]

Thanks Square, that's a very uplifting message.

I have written a short email that is straight to the point and is requesting a meeting and please can they let me know a suitable time. Quite proud of myself to not ask if I can have a meeting but when we are having it. I also mentioned, in 2 sentences what the truth is and that I have evidence. I will leave the email unsent until I have slept on it and see if it needs tweaking tomorrow or if it ready to send.

[square]

YEAH.

That sounds GREAT.

[escapingman]

Forgot to reply on the age Rose. They are both in their young teens, their "wishes" was taken into account in the custody proceedings.

[Rose1]

That's a very good response. I understand the freeze and run stuff. But I found that when your kids are involved it sure helps you find the inner strength. Good for you.

It's good DD has already said it's a lie. It's also unfortunately the thing with teens that they don't get the consequences.
Some teen behaviour is very pd.anyway. after all we're talking about immature brain function in a pd so it's not surprising that some behaviours are similar. Although your ex has a degree of viciousness that most teens do not exhibit.

Your dd has also witnessed a lifetime of watching "how to get your own way" and has to unlearn. It's difficult coming on top of your own  trauma and it sounds like you are doing a terrific job. Hopefully she will at some point respond to some therapy as well if she isn't already. It's hard on your own and DD no doubt does not understand how normal works. But good for her for telling the truth.

Be calm, dress for success and go in there without much expectation. As square said, it's probably not their job and they probably do not know how to handle this. But you're on the record and that's important.

I had to discuss some stuff with the school head on theft of my dds glasses years ago. I went in full corporate with shoulder pads on my suit and of course some red. It actually helped. I felt better and I believe it made them sit up and take notice because they weren't in the mood to take it seriously. 😀