Depression vs. BPD?

InvisibleSchmuck · February 15, 2024, 09:42:56 AM

In 2013 I met my current wife, my third one.

In 2020, my wife told me she was coming to the realization she was not a heterosexual woman. She told me she was grey asexual and nonbinary. As a cis male, I've done my best to respect that despite occasional feelings of resentment. Since the announcement, I have been going to therapy and have been told I suffer from depression and anxiety. Most of my therapy sessions are me complaining about my wife who has now also realized she is autistic and potentially BP (I don't believe this,) and not focusing on myself and my needs.

Because of my depression and anxiety and her bi-weekly blow-ups, I either go to work to hide from home life or distract myself with TV or video games. This has led to me not being as involved with home life as I probably should be. I'm here physically but I'm not mentally present within the family as many depressed males are.

Today we had an argument where she was looking for some batteries she had bought. I told her I didn't remember her buying any. She then told me "You need to be present enough to know where things are located in the home." My response was "Then why don't you remember where the batteries are?" That didn't go well for me.

I later asked her what she fell in love with when she met me. She responded that she was a broken person then, she isn't now, and that I need to "catch up."

I love her and don't want the relationship to end. Because I am the only person in the family with a job I can't throw her out or leave and we both don't have any family to move in with. I want to go to couples therapy but she refuses. Things never get fully resolved between us. We have a child together and because of her PD and autism, she isn't going to find work. So the only answer is we live like uncomfortable roommates for the rest of our lives and get screamed at and insulted twice a month which isn't doing my depression and anxiety any favors.

I've never felt suicidal but I feel the weight of hopelessness. I feel like my family would be better off without me. It's become apparent I'm not good with relationships and just hurt the people I claim to love. I can't be there for them like they deserve until I can love myself. But how can I ever love myself with someone in my life reminding me of the reasons I shouldn't?

Rebel13 · February 15, 2024, 11:08:51 AM

It sounds like you are in a very difficult situation. I'm so sorry. At times I have found it very hard to pull my focus back from what another person is saying and doing, onto myself and what I want. It sounds like you think that is your situation in therapy right now. Is it possible you could try to use even part of a session to shift the focus onto yourself? Maybe your therapist could help you watch the time and spend only a certain amount of time expressing your frustration with your wife?

One time I was struggling with what to do about something, and my therapist asked me, "If you didn't have to worry about what someone else would say or do, what would YOU choose to do?" It felt kind of shocking in the moment because I realized how I hardly ever thought about things from my own perspective! But also because, once I did, I knew exactly what I wanted! Things seemed so much clearer to me with my own wishes present in my mind. Even if I thought I couldn't GET what I wanted, or didn't feel ready to try, knowing my own desires made me feel stronger. I've used that technique many times since, when I've gotten caught up in venting about how others have behaved badly, or in trying to please everyone -- just stopping and asking myself, What do I want in this moment/this situation? Ultimately I can't change anyone else. I can only figure out what I want, think about how to ask for it or work towards it, and plan what I might do if I don't get it.

I love that you pointed out the illogic of your wife blaming you for not knowing where something was, when she had JUST asked you where it was! Those are the kinds of things I usually only think of saying days after the fact. It sounds to me like you are paying attention and sticking up for yourself!

Some of the things I've tried, to help myself feel better, are to write lists of my accomplishments or what I like and value about myself, and re-read them frequently when I am feeling worthless. When someone criticizes me, I kind of shrug to myself and think, "Well, that's your opinion." When I am feeling better I can try to figure out whether/how much I agree with someone's assessment of me. Sometimes there's valuable information in criticism, and sometimes people are just wrong!

Lately I have been recovering from surgery and haven't been able to do as much around the house as I would like. My partner reminds me that my income enables us to have a good life, that I provide health insurance for both of us by working, etc. Supporting a household is not nothing!

I wish you the best and I hope you are able to find ways to help yourself feel better.

bloomie · February 15, 2024, 11:11:59 AM

Hello and welcome! Thank you for giving us a bit of background on what brings you to this supportive community.

It sure seems like things are complicated and lonely at home. I am really sorry and am thankful you reached out.

It makes perfect sense, from the tiny bit you shared, that you would be depressed and as far as BPD... no one here is qualified to diagnose that, but we can support you on your journey to health and healing.

The very best thoughts I have is to begin to shift your focus to yourself. To what you can control and change - and that is always only us. You have made a great start by reaching out here, but I encourage you to continue with your therapist (T) focusing on you.

Escaping and disengaging is understandable, but with a child in the mix, I imagine you would rather not heap the regret of emotional distance between you on yourself or your child. That is a place to start to find motivation to reengage with your life and your family.

Building a support system around yourself takes time, but for me anyway, I needed several spokes on the wheel to get my arms around where my life had drifted/gone and the limitations within my marriage. I am thankful for this community, a great T, books and resources and eventually mentors and friends who have encouraged and challenged me along the way. I wish the very same for you!

There are great resources at the drop down menus above - the toolbox has good insights and suggestions for how best to handle traits and behaviors that are hard to live with in a loved one. We also have book recommendations and other online resources.

You have this one life. Finding your way to a reasonable level of contentment and mental health is worth the journey! Look around and settle in. We're glad you are here.

InvisibleSchmuck · February 15, 2024, 11:43:56 AM

Quote from: Rebel13 on February 15, 2024, 11:08:51 AMIt sounds like you are in a very difficult situation. I'm so sorry. At times I have found it very hard to pull my focus back from what another person is saying and doing, onto myself and what I want. It sounds like you think that is your situation in therapy right now. Is it possible you could try to use even part of a session to shift the focus onto yourself? Maybe your therapist could help you watch the time and spend only a certain amount of time expressing your frustration with your wife?

I love that you pointed out the illogic of your wife blaming you for not knowing where something was, when she had JUST asked you where it was! Those are the kinds of things I usually only think of saying days after the fact. It sounds to me like you are paying attention and sticking up for yourself!

My therapist and I talked at length about how much time I talk about my wife's actions and she agrees that there needs to be some focus on myself but she also identified that living with the source of most of my stress contributes to my depression and anxiety. We talk about ways to navigate in my household.

I typically don't stand up for myself. I would rather deal with the insults than an explosive reaction for trying to hang in there during the argument. After the one-sided verbal abuse, I walk away calmly and I get some sort of apology later but it does nothing for my self-esteem and many of her hurtful comments have stuck with me over the years.

InvisibleSchmuck · February 15, 2024, 12:01:15 PM

Quote from: bloomie on February 15, 2024, 11:11:59 AMEscaping and disengaging is understandable, but with a child in the mix, I imagine you would rather not heap the regret of emotional distance between you on yourself or your child. That is a place to start to find motivation to reengage with your life and your family.

Our child is another difficult element in this situation. I've already identified abusive behavior from her directed toward me that mimics my wife's behavior. This had caused a disconnect between us at times and I don't feel as close with her as I'd like.

Thank you for pointing out the resources this site provides. From what I've been researching all morning, I believe much of the problem is me and my depression and my lack of ability to just switch it off. Not trying to apologize for her comments or verbal abuse but I can see where I am frustrating to deal with.

square · February 15, 2024, 04:02:53 PM

Regarding focus on self:

I think the goal isn't "stop talking about your wife in therapy."

Once you have figured out there is a problem and started naming some issues and then felt heard and validated - which I assume is the place you're in right now - next comes a shift away from simply venting (useful in the early days but then becomes a rut) and toward figuring out how you will handle things.

You've told your wife (in various ways) that certain thngs are not working, and you've asked her, however overtly or subtly, to change. She has declined to change, at least to the degree that you need.

Since you can't change her, only yourself, you turn to thinking how you will handle such events in the future.

So therapy isn't going to be about ignoring the elephant in the room, but shifting away from "she did this and said this" and toward "okay, how will I handle this situation from now on?"

square · February 15, 2024, 04:12:24 PM

Regarding your handling of verbal abuse:

QuoteI typically don't stand up for myself. I would rather deal with the insults than an explosive reaction for trying to hang in there during the argument. After the one-sided verbal abuse, I walk away calmly and I get some sort of apology later but it does nothing for my self-esteem and many of her hurtful comments have stuck with me over the years.

Yeah, I have it very similar.

I bolded the word "after" above.

This suggests to me that you stay and take the abuse.

My suggestion is that you "walk away calmly" a lot earlier.

square · February 15, 2024, 04:21:28 PM

Regarding your child:

My strongest suggestion is that you put in the effort to have maximum one on one time with your child, away from the influence of your wife.

Take her with you when you run errands. Be the person (or split the duties) to take her to her extracuricular activities. Have a bedtime ritual, no matter her age. Whatever it may be, to spend time.

I totally get the impulse to pull away. If your relationship can be salvaged, it can only be salvaged with more interaction, not less. She may behave better away from the chaos and stress and influence of your wife. It likely won't carry through to times when you're all together, but having the two-of-you foundation counts for a lot.

InvisibleSchmuck · February 15, 2024, 04:27:39 PM

Quote from: square on February 15, 2024, 04:21:28 PMRegarding your child:

My strongest suggestion is that you put in the effort to have maximum one on one time with your child, away from the influence of your wife.

Take her with you when you run errands. Be the person (or split the duties) to take her to her extracuricular activities. Have a bedtime ritual, no matter her age. Whatever it may be, to spend time.

I totally get the impulse to pull away. If your relationship can be salvaged, it can only be salvaged with more interaction, not less. She may behave better away from the chaos and stress and influence of your wife. It likely won't carry through to times when you're all together, but having the two-of-you foundation counts for a lot.

This is good advice that I plan on following in the upcoming days. Thank you.

bloomie · February 16, 2024, 09:59:32 AM

IS - regarding the one sided verbal abuse and the disrespect from your child... seems like it is time for a family meeting where you establish that in your home you all treat and speak each other with respect as a foundational tenet of living together.

Question... does you wife verbally abuse anyone else? Your daughter, her extended family members, the grocery store clerk?

Another question... does your daughter speak or behave in a disrespectful manner toward your wife, teachers, friends, coaches?

I am wondering if this behavior is mostly happening in your home toward you.

Fundmentally, teaching and exemplifying good manners and how to have respectful communication - even when we disagree - is part of our responsibility as parents and our responsibility toward one another in a family system where young lives are developing.

Quote from: InvisibleSchmuck on February 15, 2024, 12:01:15 PMI believe much of the problem is me and my depression and my lack of ability to just switch it off. Not trying to apologize for her comments or verbal abuse but I can see where I am frustrating to deal with.

If there were a switch to turn off depression the world would want to know that. Depression is a chemical and medical condition that isn't something we can just switch off at will. Expecting that of yourself is not fair!

And you know what.. for many years I was told I was too... too emotional, too sensitive, too much or too little. I believed that problem was me and how hard I was or how I was 'a lot'. I tried to make myself smaller or more neutral so I wouldn't stand out in any way, or bigger and more confident and none of it changed what I was allowing in my marriage. It just ended up in me losing parts of myself that I miss to this day.

Working to know yourself, your strengths and weaknesses, your areas of struggle and your areas of beauty and then from that real place of self awareness and acknowledgment begin to build a core value system that you live from.

Stop negotiating your worth with anyone else. Especially someone who would berate or verbally abuse you and continue doing so in spite of bearing witness to the emotional struggle you are having.

From our unique and personal core values come boundaries and limits that we begin to live in and live out. Strategies for how to assert those come as we begin to research and learn from others who have walked this same path.

There are so many great resources out there, but one I recently found that I like a lot because it is practical advice on what to say, or not say, when faced with difficult interactions (and the vids are short and sweet) it is found here:

https://www.youtube.com/@jeffersonfisher

More in depth breakdowns of behaviors we encounter that are hurting us in a loved on can be found in the work and vids of Dr. Ramani: https://www.youtube.com/@DoctorRamani

And we have great book resources for dealing with people here: https://outofthefog.website/books
And other good online resources here: https://www.outofthefog.net/forum/index.php?board=45.0

I also ever so gently want to suggest something.. that you change your forum name to reflect the truth that you are not invisible and you are not a schmuck. You are a valuable human being who has the human right to not be abused. We see you. We are here and we are with you as you move forward through this difficult time.