Healthy friendships

[JollyJazz]

Hi All,

One thing I want is to broaden my friendship circle, and make sure those friendships are healthy ones.

I've been developing some good ones, but I've also noticed there are some somewhat unhealthy patterns in existing ones.

I was wondering whether anyone knows of a checklist or even a book on healthy friendship!

Friends are so important for health and happiness, Western cultures often focus so much on romantic love, but apparently the ancient Greeks were more focused on 'Phillia' - the (platonic) love between friends!

[Lookin 2 B Free]

I don't know of one, JollyJazz, but what a good idea for a publication!  Friendships are my rock, my anchor.

I'm recently reassessing an old friendship that started feeling wrong -- like a subtle version of something familiar from my FOO.  And an unspoken threat that if I addressed it kindly but honestly, the friendship would be over.  (I did finally do that addressing and so far have not heard from the person other than "give me time to process" which is fine.)

I am fortunate to have some very close long-time friends I can talk to about anything, and they me.  And if some disappointment or annoyance occurs, no one has to worry about spiteful action or triangulation.  There's honesty, confidentiality, absence of vengefulness, absence of role playing (like you have to be a rescuer for me, or vice versa), respectful, reciprocal - each person taking responsibility for themselves and their needs and feelings while there's also mutual love and support.  I once saw a graphic for relationships which was a wheel with many spokes I don't remember, but the hub was "equality."

I'd be interested in yours or others ideas of bottom lines for intimate friendships.  I guess at this point I rely on my gut for feedback about what's safe and healthy as it tends to alert me before I have conceptual ideas about it.

[Rebel13]

JollyJazz, let me know if you find this book! I have had so much trouble making and sustaining healthy friendships throughout my life. In my younger decades, I repeatedly picked, or got picked by, self-absorbed people attracted to my tendency to provide self-effacing attention and support, and after a while I'd get super furious at them for not paying attention to me and ditch the relationship. Rinse and repeat!

About six years ago, I also felt a desire to increase my circle, and I made a conscious decision to connect with a few people at work who I thought were kind, calm people who had similar personalities to myself. The key was, I purposely didn't pick anyone to whom I felt that "charged" attraction which for me usually indicates the love-bombing of a self-absorbed person. My plan was moderately successful. I had a lot of lunch dates; some of them fizzled out, some of them became interesting acquaintances, and a couple of them I am still moderately good friends with! There have been bumps with all of them, which has given me a chance to work on some of my "stuff" particularly using the work of Pete Walker and others on emotional flashbacks. It's not perfect, and I'm lucky to also have one or two longer-standing moderately good friendships and one really deep "chosen family" kind of friend. But I'd still love to hear about any insights you have or any materials you find on the topic.

[Catothecat]

I agree that it would be nice if someone knew of a book they could recommend (I much prefer books to youtube or anything like that).  Making your own checklist based on personal experience isn't ideal as it means you're making this list based on all the times you thought someone was a friend only to be let down and it would be nice to have a type of warning system in place beforehand.  Otherwise it's all part of the school of hard knocks and that gets tiresome after a while.

I suppose the one "check" I keep upfront when it comes to evaluating a friendship is how I feel after being with the person. Some people, no matter how much you like them, make you feel bad afterwards.  Maybe not "bad" in the sense of being depressed or down (although that can certainly happen) but more like an uneasy, negative feeling that you take away from the encounter, a feeling you didn't have before being with the person and not always while you're with them.  Often it's not explainable or anything you can point a finger at.  It's just there at the gut level.  And it's not the same as their having a personal issue that they involve you in.  That can make you feel bad, but the bad is for them.  It's part of your empathy.  This is, rather, a feeling that something unspoken is going on.  But since you can't quite pinpoint it, it can be easy to dismiss.  Or blame yourself for being negative or whatever. 

When someone seems to be a friend but consistently makes me feel uneasy after being with them, I realize it's time to place them in the casual category and keep contact on a superficial level.  It's discouraging to be disappointed once again, but a whole lot better than letting the person more fully into my life only to realize they're taking advantage of me or being fair-weather. 

[walking on broken glass]

I suppose the one "check" I keep upfront when it comes to evaluating a friendship is how I feel after being with the person. Some people, no matter how much you like them, make you feel bad afterwards.  Maybe not "bad" in the sense of being depressed or down (although that can certainly happen) but more like an uneasy, negative feeling that you take away from the encounter, a feeling you didn't have before being with the person and not always while you're with them.  Often it's not explainable or anything you can point a finger at.  It's just there at the gut level.  And it's not the same as their having a personal issue that they involve you in.

I love this!
It describes my bad experiences with friends very accurately. You are so right that you get this feeling that there is something sinister going on without being able to put your finger on it.

[Rebel13]

When someone seems to be a friend but consistently makes me feel uneasy after being with them, I realize it's time to place them in the casual category and keep contact on a superficial level.  It's discouraging to be disappointed once again, but a whole lot better than letting the person more fully into my life only to realize they're taking advantage of me or being fair-weather. 

Also agree!  This is a great point.

[JollyJazz]

Hello, thanks so much for all your thoughts!

For the record I have built some healthy relationships.

I've also gotten myself away from some toxic ones in the past few years. As I've been doing more and more personal growth, I've started to also notice some old friendships that are not so healthy in more subtle ways.

I'm starting to look for other friendships as well. Thanks for all your thoughts everyone!

[treesgrowslowly]

Hi JollyJazz,

Great question! I've learned that healthy friendships are with healthy people.

I totally agree with Catothecat about keeping people in the casual category if they make us uneasy.

Trees

[chowder]

Catothecat,

You are so spot on.  Recently I had a visit with a friend who is now in the casual category.  Yes, there have been fun moments and laughs, but there is definitely something that doesn't feel right.  I actually made a note to myself for the next time I'm tempted to get together, perhaps not to jump to do it so often (and it's a long drive, with the cost of an overnight hotel).  Perhaps it feels one-way, that could be part of it. 

This note to self says those exact words - yes, it has its fun moments, but remember how you feel afterwards.  Can't exactly put a finger on it, but it is definitely unfulfilling on some levels and not what I had hoped the friendship/encounter would be.

Thank you for that validation.  It always comes back to, follow your gut.

[Breadroll]

Recently reflecting on my friendships too- and this thread helpful. I set some boundaries a while ago which has been positive, although I have to remind myself to stay in the boundaries- no unnecessary disclosures- nothing really personal- with certain friends.
I had a small revelation when considering uneasy feelings - it seems to be with «  competitive people ». The sort that jostle for «  social standing » or work success if just being sporty and fit ( nothing wrong with that, just the type that talk about it a lot).  They are friends- but this is where I need boundaries most.


  Whereas feeling at ease. Is with people who are not competitive in these ways- quieter, comfortable. Regardless of where they are in life.
How on earth did it take me so long to get to this conclusion.

[walking on broken glass]

This resonates with me, @breadroll. I realized that the people from which I gradually distanced myself were competitive with me, even though I wasn't interested in any form of competition with them, and sometimes it was about really silly things. My first thoughts were to blame myself instinctively, and I was trying to think whether I did something to provoke that kind of competition. This comes from my family background, where I always had to make myself small and unobtrusive so as not rub my sister the wrong way. As soon as I realise that I adopt the same behaviour with friends, I know something is wrong. Friends should allow you to shine and be happy for your successes. When uneasy feelings are involved, the friendship is just not right. And this comes from my part too: I have caught myself being resentful with these friends and not fully supportive because of how petty and competitive they have been with me in the past. The problem is that they are never just competitive or petty; the behaviour comes with positive sides too which makes you feel bad or that you are overreacting (insert internal monologue here 'maybe they are not so bad, see, they can be nice and empathetic'). People are complicated. But when you don't like how they make you feel about yourself, that's a good sign to walk away!