Parents telling not asking

[Orangecounty]

I've had sort of an ongoing issue with my dad for quite a few years. Some background, my dad was raised by an extreme narcissist. While I don't think my dad is a full blown narcissist the way his mom was, he definitely has some narcissistic traits. Everything revolves around him and his schedule, he doesn't bend for anyone, not even his own kids. Even though I'm 35 years old, I still find my dad fairly intimidating, when I've tried to bring up concerns in the past, he basically shuts down and once he's "injured", he'll ignore me, not call. Anyway, whenever he and my stepmom and half siblings go away on holidays, he expects us to take care of their garden and flowers. I don't mind helping out a bit, but he never asks, he just says "ok, so everyone is coming down for a week to water, so I'll show you were everything is...." This makes me feel like a child. Plus, I'm married, we have our own lives and like I said, while I don't mind helping out a bit, I don't have time to be driving to their place for several weeks taking care of their yard. I guess I'm just wondering how's the best way of approaching my dad about this subject without him shutting down? Or is that even possible?

[all4peace]

Your preference sounds very reasonable to me. But your question has a built-in problem. You want a boundary (approach your dad about not being available to help with his garden) AND you want to control his response (him not shutting down). If you can separate your wish for the 2 to happen simultaneously, then of course it is possible for you to have a boundary.

I think a lot of our struggles in life come in this kind of packaging. I want A.....but then I'm afraid B will happen.

Boundaries are about deciding about what you are willing for, who you are, where you stand. When you start acting, thinking or speaking your boundaries, plenty of people WILL be upset about it. Most healthy people will adjust, recalibrate and adapt to your boundaries since we generally understand that others are allowed to have boundaries even if they aren't where we would prefer they be. Often (based on my life experience and reading on this forum), unhealthy people do NOT adapt well, or ever. My T once told me that a person's response to our boundaries will often tell us how necessary the boundary was in the first place. Ie: If they freak out or shut down or show some really reactive response...then we really needed the boundary.

Your dad's behavior suits him well. But it's not reasonable and it doesn't suit you. You just have to decide what is more painful--continuing to be presumed to help when you don't have time, or dealing with your dad's reaction. Good luck!

[Cat of the Canals]

all4peace beat me to it... 

I think the simple answer is: boundaries. What are you willing to do? What are you NOT willing to do?

Example: If it were me, and I lived within about 30 minutes of my parents, I might be willing to check in on the house once a week. And by that, I mean, I'd do a quick run through the house to make sure there were no plumbing disasters or broken windows, etc. I certainly would not be willing to be saddled with ongoing house and yard work for someone else. Doing my own is a big enough PITA. 

This would also be somewhat contingent on their behavior. If I say, "Hey, I won't be able to manage the garden this time around. I can check in on the house once or twice, but that's all I'll have time for," and they throw a fit and tell me how ungrateful and selfish I am or give me the silent treatment, then my offer would be withdrawn.

Of course, if you aren't interested in doing ANY of it, then say so. "I'm just too busy at the moment" is a perfectly valid excuse even if "busy" means relaxing at home with your FOC.

The thing that makes this more complicated is that you can only control what you will do. You can't control his reaction. It sounds to me like he's likely to react pretty poorly to even the smallest boundary. (In my opinion, if they can afford to go on vacation, they can afford to hire a lawn service for the time they are away. And if they "can't," that certainly doesn't make it your problem or responsibility.)

[Orangecounty]

Thanks for your advice, I understand what you guys are saying. I guess I have to come to terms with my own uncomfortableness when it comes to my dad's reactions. I guess it's not so much that I want to control his reaction, it's that I want to have a conversation with him and that just doesn't happen. I've tried so many times over the years to talk to him and if it's ever an issue I have with something he's doing, he barely says anything and walks away.

[Cat of the Canals]

Oh, I can so empathize with that. I'd love to be able to have a mature, adult conversation with my mother. To disagree with her about something without her sulking, making passive-aggressive comments, or trying to bully me into changing my mind.

Even now, when I think I've come to terms with the fact that this is how things are and how they've always been, I still find myself trying to come up with ways to fix it. "Maybe if I said it *this* way..."

It feels like giving up to let go of that hope. But I can only change myself.

[all4peace]

"Control" was too loaded of a word and I shouldn't have used it. What I meant is that we want to have boundaries and we don't want the negative consequences. I think you nailed it--so much of this is changing our pattern and then learning to sit with the discomfort.

[WomanInterrupted]

Hi Orangecounty 

Both unBPD Didi and unNPD would tell me things, instead of *asking* - like normal human beings. 

"You don't mind stopping at the drug store on the way home."

"You don't mind taking me to the doctor this afternoon."

"I need you to come over  right now and look at my poop!"  (Seriously!)   

"You have to take me to the ER."

My response to ALL "tells" was NO - by voicing it or ignoring the phone message and erasing it.

If you can't *ask* - I can't DO.

The drug store was *every single time we drove by it* and the response was always the same, "I don't have time.  I've told you that you need to run it by me in advance, so I can clear my schedule." 

If I had a dime for every time I had to repeat that, I'd probably have a couple of hundred bucks.

Doctor - "I can't do that.  You'll need to make other arrangements." (That's even if I bothered answering the phone - if a message was left, I'd ignore it.) 

Look at her poop?  What I wanted to respond was, "Are you HIGH!?" - but what I said was, "I can't do that.  If you have concerns, you need to speak to your doctor." 

The ER - my response was *always, every single time,*  "Call an ambulance." 

When they'd whine that it wasn't THAT serious and start describing the problem, I'd cut them short and repeat, "Call an ambulance."   

Most times, it was for a bunch of hooey, but  ONE time it was a medical emergency (Ray needed a pacemaker put in, STAT), and the doctor told him to *listen to your daughter because she's the smart one* (in insisting he call an ambulance).

Any message left on the machine was met with *dead silence* on my part.  Often I'd get a message later that said, "Okay - I'll call an ambulance." 

And no, I would *not* answer calls to pick anybody up - they can take a cab or an Uber.

What I suggest you tell your dad is, "I can come over ONCE.  If your home needs more care than that, you're going to have to hire somebody, because I'm not going to be available."

Or even more simply, "I can't do that - you're going to have to hire somebody.  It's just not possible for me."

If asked why, be a broken record:  "I just told you, it's not possible." 

Will he get angry?  Probably.  But I got to the point that I really didn't care because I was just as angry at being TOLD what to do by another adult who presumed I had nothing better to do.   

So, if you want, take it out and give it a spin.  If you really don't want to - or just can't be arsed to take care of their house, tell him no, it just doesn't work for you - and if he gets angry or says anything other than, "Okay - no problem" - you *know* you needed that boundary.   

A4P - I ran what you said about  if they flip out and scream, then you really need the boundary to my DH and he said, "AMEN!" 

My MIL is big on screeching/shrieking/screaming in the face of "no" - we haven't seen her in over 20 years (NC), but we expect her to pop up in the future, "needing" something - and we're *both* prepared  for her.

I always told my DH I'd handle her, but I have a feeling he's itching to try out his boundaries - and it might do him quite a bit of good to tell her "NO" and be able to make it stick.

[illogical]

You have described a very passive-aggressive father. 

The next time he assumes your help-- says "ok, so everyone is coming down for a week to water, I'll show you where everything is"-- I would feign ignorance of his assuming your compliance and say something like,

You:  "So what exactly are you saying?" [This is KEY right here, because it forces him to state what he is asking, rather than passively and aggressively assuming you will do it]
Him:  "You need to come down and water my garden."
You:  "Are you asking me or telling me?"
Him:  "What's with the attitude?  You know I'm going on vacation.  I don't know why you can't water my garden."
You:  "I don't mind helping you out, dad, but I resent you giving me an order.  I can come down once a week, but if you need my help more than that, you'll have to get someone else, as that's all I can do right now."

At this point, he may huff and puff and tell you he won't ask you for your help anymore, since you obviously don't want to help him (even though you've said you would, just not on his terms).  I would be prepared for that.

Even if he huffs off and gives you The Silent Treatment, you have pushed back on his PA tactic of assuming you are under his command.  This behavior of his is going to continue until you push back.  He is used to being the authoritarian father and treating you like a child, as you have posted.  I grew up with an authoritarian father who was PA.  My NM was also PA.  Passive-aggressives don't ask for anything because they don't want to face a rejection.  As you've noted with your father, anything short of compliance-- even telling him "No" in a nice way-- is met with intimidation and silent treatment.

Trying to get your father to "see" you as an adult, rather than a child may not happen.  Coupled with his PA behavior is a high level of narcissistic traits, and Ns don't like to be crossed.  All you can do is change your behavior toward him-- i.e., respond to him as an adult, not an obedient child-- and let the chips fall where they may.   

[all4peace]

  That is fantastic!