I feel so much guilt.

[timothyhayes]

How about you come up with a small task and try to go through with it and then write to us here about it? Something that would be liberating for you. It doesn't have to be something big, even something like 'my mum tried to pick a fight with me about my girlfriend and I left the room, closed the door behind me and refused to engage'. Maybe a small victory would make you feel more optimistic about the future.

Thank you for this. I'm trying to document and journal this experience, so I believe this is a good approach for me. My current "small step" is telling my parents tomorrow that I'm heading out to visit my partner for a day. I've been reading "Silently Seduced" which has shown me, without a shadow of a doubt, the dysfunction I grew up in. It has shown me that I am riddled with guilt over any decision of my own, because I'm unsure of how it will affect my mother. I'm struggling to break free. I can see how difficult it will be for me to stand up, cement a boundary and go be happy with my partner, but I'm finding it hard to stick to my guns. I want to buckle, end my relationship and not have to deal with the stress. But the more I think about discarding a 3 year relationship so I don't have to deal with my mother's tantrum... I know I will regret this for the rest of my life.

[Rebel13]

Good luck timothy! We're all rooting for you. Let us know how it goes.

[walking on broken glass]

My current "small step" is telling my parents tomorrow that I'm heading out to visit my partner for a day.

That's a great step! It will be so liberating for you. And standing up against your mum in small ways will become easier in time.

I am glad you realise that breaking up with your girlfriend just to appease your mum is not a solution. It will lift the pressure off you temporarily because you will be 'a good son' again but you will very much be in the same prison and you will have given up a part of your life that made you happy.

I recently read the book Educated that resonated a lot with me. I don't mean that my parents belonged to a religious cult and tried to keep me away from the world, but I did recognise the coercion, lack of empathy, and refusal to listen and accept a different point of view, and the feeling of sadness and loneliness that comes with those. It may be helpful for you. It is a true story too which makes it even more chilling.

[moglow]

I hope you can find courage to make those small steps and keep moving forward to independence. I know you do it out of habit and as a courtesy but telling her where you're going just opens a door to objections and "discussions" (read: meltdowns) about any plans you have. You really can make your plans and as a courtesy let them know "I should be home by ..." No discussion, no justifications or explanation. You're a grown person trying to live a life separate from your parents - just like they did once upon a time.

[Danie]

When I was younger and dealing with my mom I used these 2 mantras to help me: 1. God wants me to be happy! If I don't choose my own happiness I am going against his will for me. 2. I have 2 choices, one is "insanity" and the other is "my own life & happiness".

Those helped me a lot when I felt torn and confused. You can create your own and add it to your toolbox.

My mom is now 86 and hasn't changed. I cannot believe she is still acting this way to her kids. I tell you this so you see it can go on for a lifetime.

My mom actually abandoned her 3 kids (I was 14) and it was hard, but now looking back it may have been easier than staying with her. She came back after 11 years of traveling around (in a camper) with her artist husband and tried to reconnect and it's been difficult as h_ _ _.

[bloomie]

timothyhayes - this thread began with you sharing your mother got riled up over the gift bag you put her gift in as you were taking her to take pictures of her dog. You also shared you spend time with her every single day. 😳

It may be time to make some adjustments to your thinking that you could have a heart to heart with a woman who seems so lacking in gratitude and appreciation and seems so filled with entitlement and arrogance. I sincerely doubt it is possible to ever have a respectful, reasonable conversation where you reset the boundaries and make some agreements with what seems like such a rigid, imperious mother who has a death grip on your life.

Thank you NarcKiddo & Danie. I appreciate the bluntness--I need it.

If I wanted to, I could move out on my own or with my girlfriend. But I am finding this to be so difficult and I'm so frustrated that I can't seem to grow some balls and just do this. I told my girlfriend I'll come up tomorrow and stay the weekend, but I still haven't brought it up to my parents, specifically my mother. That hold right there is insane. I don't believe I can just walk out the door and head to my partner. I know my mother would immediately begin questioning me and if I hinted at my girlfriend, she'd blow her lid.

I am frustrated with myself. I value my mother's feelings more than my own and especially my partner. I need to stand up, but I don't want to feel that twang of pain my parents seem to inflict when I do something they don't agree with.

I say this ever so gently, but there is something important in that last sentence. It is sometimes very difficult to grasp that what is underneath the disempowered, enmeshed behaviors you describe in yourself is an unwillingness to be uncomfortable.

It is uncomfortable to grow into the fullness of adulthood and establish ourselves as separate human beings in general, but even more so with parents who are determined to keep us cobbled to them. It is uncomfortable to move out of our parents' home and establish our own. What if we fail? What if we get lonely? What if the girlfriend thing doesn't work out?

It is uncomfortable to realize that some of us (I certainly did) have allowed ourselves to believe - and make big decisions from that belief - that we are, on some level, not okay without our parents and family of origin. And then to challenge ourselves to overcome that untrue belief about ourselves and our chances in life.

It is uncomfortable when begin to do the deep inner work that recognizes our value and worth. Our accomplishments and abilities.

My friend, it is time to build resilience into your life by making choices and living from your own priorities and purpose, your own values and dreams. Only you know what steps you need to take to do this, but at this point... think about refusing to accommodate your mother's displeasure and embrace that reality that if she literally... gets mad over a paper bag.. there is most likely zero chance she will ever be satisfied and that is 100% on her. Your mother's emotions, and how she does, or does not cope with them, are not your business or yours to manage.

Accept what you cannot change, change what you can, and use wisdom to know the difference. We are cheering you on!!!!

[walking on broken glass]

It is uncomfortable to realize that some of us (I certainly did) have allowed ourselves to believe - and make big decisions from that belief - that we are, on some level, not okay without our parents and family of origin. And then to challenge ourselves to overcome that untrue belief about ourselves and our chances in life.

 

In one of the many fights I had with my parents, I remember thinking that maybe they know me better than I do, maybe they can help me, maybe I cannot establish an independent path and I am just deluded.
It is the pain of separation and adulting, which becomes all the more difficult when your parents don't want to let you go. You end up questioning yourself and thinking that you do need them. Because it's always been like that, it feels familiar, whereas separation is uncharted territory and therefore scary. It is the only way though.

[Rebel13]

Hi again timothy, everyone is giving you such great support! I don't know if you like music, or this style, but these two songs by Carrie Newcomer (not to mention her other music) helped me a lot when I was going through a hard scary thing last year:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYAtWQB25JY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRGnftH_g4I

Wishing you all the best. You are not alone on this path even when it feels like it.

[timothyhayes]

Thank you so much for the advice and support! And a special shoutout to you, Rebel13, for the fantastic music recommendations—they're much appreciated!

I have some good news to share. I told my parents I was going to see my girlfriend, and I didn't let them have a say in the matter. To my surprise, my mother's reaction wasn't as explosive as I had feared. She yelled, of course, and tried to guilt me with Bible verses, even pulling out the classic line: "If you choose that girl, you're breaking apart the family—we don't support this." It hurt to hear, but I stayed calm and kept a poker face. I never raised my voice and just stuck to repeating the same blunt, steady responses:

•    "Yes."
•    "Nope."
•    "I'm trying to communicate better with you."
•    "Okay."

And guess what? It worked. Crazy, right? It wasn't easy, though—I had to fight the urge to explain myself at every turn. Then my mom hit me with the weirdest thing I've ever heard. As I was leaving, she said, "I knew it. I had a dream the other night about you and that girl. I was trying to talk to you, but she grabbed you by the wrist, pulled you away, and said, 'We're married, he's mine!' And she was pregnant!" I swear, I'm not making this up.

Despite all that, the trip was a massive step forward for me. It helped my relationship with my girlfriend tremendously and even shifted something in me—I just don't care enough to lie to my parents anymore. I've realized my mother will only react positively if I view the world through her lens, and frankly, I'm done doing that. While I was driving home, she called me three times while I was already on another call. When I didn't immediately answer, she texted things like, "I guess you're preoccupied" and "WTH?" It took everything in me not to snap, but I managed to keep my cool and replied: "Give me a second."

I still have a long way to go, but I feel happier than I have in a while. That said, my mother is still raging now that I'm home, bombarding me with questions like:

•    "You're going to let this girl break up your family when she can't even show us respect?"
•    "Your grandmother was the anchor of this family, and now that she's gone, I have to take on that role."

That last one really stood out to me. My grandmother was a narcissist who physically and emotionally abused my mother, all while enabling her father to beat her and lust after her during her teenage years. My mom has told me about this for as long as I can remember. By the time I was in my early teens, I even knew that my grandfather—who lived with us—had looked at her inappropriately while blasting hardcore porn in the background. It's been... a lot to process.

Honestly, I wasn't expecting to unpack all of this, but it feels like I just unearthed a whole core of memories, lmao. Thanks for letting me vent—it really helps.

[walking on broken glass]

      

This is such good news! Well done, Timothy! Isn't the feeling of relief and freedom overwhelming, when you do something like this? And the knowledge that you were able to do it and nothing bad happened is so precious. I am so happy for you. This internal change is so important, when you feel something shifting inside you and you know that there is no going back.

I am so sorry to hear about your family history. It is so sad that the generational trauma has been passed down and your mother has herself turned from a victim into the perpetrator. It is really messed up but it is not your baggage to carry.

[NarcKiddo]

That's really great news.I am glad you had a nice visit with your girlfriend and even more glad you have now notched up an experience of standing up to your mother. These horrible situations are rarely quite as bad as we build them up to be in our minds but there is no way to find that out until we actually do what we need to. So well done, indeed, on being brave enough to do what you needed to.

Of course she will now pull out every weapon in her armoury, which could include her suddenly being nice to you. So beware of that. Poker face and standard non-committal responses are the way to go.

[Rebel13]

Great news! I am so happy for you. It sounds like you handled yourself and the situation just great, and you got some new knowledge. What a great foundation for you to build on.

[bloomie]

timothyhayes - you did yourself proud! And we are cheering you on! Well done!

Your mother's terrible experiences at the hands of her parents are heartbreaking and I am so sorry to hear this. My sincere hope is she will turn to others who can support her through her own healing journey and that you will be able to distance yourself from serving as any kind of a sounding board around this kind of thing.

You took a very big step forward!