Any reason we were born to a Narcissistic family or purpose it serves to us?

Blueberry Pancakes · August 21, 2020, 09:09:56 AM

I have wondered why were any of us born into a narcissistic family? Is there something about our soul's journey that needs these conditions in order to grow? Were we the abuser in a past lifetime and this is our karma? Or, were we always a victim of it and never healed from it, so we are now here to finally put it behind us?

I read somewhere that the purpose is to acknowledge it and not treat others the way you were treated. Basically, the purpose is to end the cycle. Of course, it does not mean that if you grew up in a narcissistic family and you end the cycle that your siblings are not continuing it elsewhere. It might continue in the family line, but just not on your side. If that is true, then I have met the purpose and am not continuing it. It just seems kind of a small impact to such a huge dynamic.

Any thoughts on "why" we specifically experienced this?

Call Me Cordelia · August 21, 2020, 10:35:24 AM

I don't believe we will see an answer to "why" in this life. Or that there is one pat answer like the purpose is to break the cycle. The answer at a natural level is well you have their DNA so you couldn't have existed otherwise. I know that's not what you're asking, but sometimes the obvious answer is a good starting place. I've been thinking about this a lot and I think the good that each of us can bring forth from our pain is a very personal journey.

I was thinking of asking a similar question. I was listening to a podcast about our ability to teach our children at home and the guest said something like, "God chose you to be the parent for your child! He planned for you to be together! You are the right parent for your kids and He will equip you!"

Encouragement for homeschooling. And yet, I put myself in the child's place. That means my parents were and are the "right" parents for me whatever that means. That God did that to me. I guess He equipped me to survive being raised by those "God-given" parents. I get angry. But my anger isn't really directed at God but at those who refused to cooperate with Him. I've seen enough of His mercy in my own life to know for a fact that it is available to anyone. My parents certainly could have been better. It is NOT fair that we had the parents we did. It is sort of a paradox that God both permitted injustice and yet is perfectly just. I do believe He can and will more than make it right. One of the promises I fall back on all the time is from the Prophet Joel, where the Lord says, "I will redeem the years the locust has eaten." All the years of our painful childhoods, the years of grief, all restored. It's chapter 2, very comforting.

I don't believe in reincarnation, although I see the appeal as a way of making the world seem more fair somehow. I do believe that the world will be unjust until the end of time. However, don't discount the impact of your breaking the cycle in your piece of the line! The truth is you simply don't know what impact the good you do has. Directly to subsequent generations, but also on your peers and maybe even people you never meet.

And even if the only impact you have is for yourself, that is still worthwhile, because you are worthwhile!!!

GettingOOTF · August 21, 2020, 11:12:22 AM

I read somewhere about an aboriginal legend that says there are some babies that are so excited to get a family that they jump out of the basket they're being carried in too soon and end up with the wrong family.

This more than anything else I've read made me feel better about my upbringing. I wish I could find the story again.

I don't believe there is a "why", at least not if you follow a Judeo-Christian religion. It makes more sense from the perspective of religions that believe in reincarnation and that we are where we are in this life is based on behaviors in a previous life.

A lot of my difficulty with my religion today stems from the home I was raised in. It is hard for me to reconcile a loving God with one who would purposely put an innocent baby into the home I was born in to. It's hard for me to see how I can love and trust a God who thought so much less of me than He did of those babies he gave to loving homes. I don't believe I was born more undeserving of a safe and loving home than anyone else.

I also battle with the concept of karma but that's likely that I look at it through more Western eyes. When someone is wronged they say that karma will "get" the person who wronged them but there's no acknowledgement that if that's the case the wrong doing is in fact their very own karma.

I also wonder how much impact my breaking the cycle has as I don't have kids.

Andeza · August 21, 2020, 02:25:48 PM

There's another way to look at this from the "there is a God" standpoint. That being that His perfect will and choice would be for these pwPDs not to have children at all, or if they do, that seeing this helpless child in their care would spur them to change their status quo.

I'm adopted. My parents were denied natural conception. I believe that was intentional. I also fully believe it was the selfish desires of my uBPDm for a baby (to be her mirror, her dress-up doll, her scapegoat) that led ultimately to my adoption. She bypassed nature (nothing wrong with adoption, not what I'm trying to say) to get what she wanted.

Let's contrast her statement of "I want a baby" with what my DH and I said when he decided to have a child. We said "We have enough love to share." It wasn't about what we wanted, it was about what we could give. God is also all about what He can give.

Additionally, God operates from that place of "My grace is sufficient for thee." So with that in mind, and all the other promises he makes us, I can look back and say the only reason I survived my uBPDm is because He made me strong enough to get through it. Yes, it was a bad situation growing up. It sucked, majorly. I didn't choose it, and I don't think God wanted me to be in that situation. For all I know, He may have preferred that I be raised by my biological parents and yet their desire for freedom from children at that time trumped His perfect will. But that's just guesswork.

In a perfect world, the kind He would prefer exist, there wouldn't be pwPDs. But there are, because we don't live in a perfect world sadly. And some of them selfishly choose to have children. So I believe that despite them doing this, He does His best to help us get through it. It's not that any of us deserved this situation. We didn't choose it, somebody else chose it for us. But what I'm trying to say is that God probably didn't actively choose it for us either.

At least, that's what I believe.

Blueberry Pancakes · August 22, 2020, 10:15:24 AM

Thank you Call Me Cordelia, GettingOOTF, and Andeza. You offer great insight. When my mind starts pondering the "why" of it all, I try to pull back from going too far down that rabbit hole and bring my thoughts back to the knowledge that I am enough just the way I am. I try to think of the gratitude I have for new found skills in how to respond in situations that I recognize as dysfunctional. I feel like I am in a happier place than ever, and really hope I am getting it right. It helps having others like you share your thoughts.

Blueberry Pancakes · August 22, 2020, 10:38:47 AM

Quote from: GettingOOTF on August 21, 2020, 11:12:22 AM

I also wonder how much impact my breaking the cycle has as I don't have kids.

GettingOOTF - just wanted to say I believe you are having a great positive impact. Maybe it is like that movie "It's A Wonderful Life" and perhaps we can never really know? But, I just think that significant others, neighbors, friends and colleagues have to be impacted. Those on this forum are too. Oddly, one of the highlights I used to have when we could work in offices was chatting to the lady in the checkout line in the cafeteria. Something about her and the way she smiled or chatted made me feel acknowledged and not invisible. She could never have known what she did for me, but I think those who have a balanced feeling about themselves radiate it outward and others feel it. I certainly am glad you are here.

Associate of Daniel · August 22, 2020, 05:05:24 PM

I remember not long after uNPD H left I asked a friend of mine who is a minister, why did God allow us to marry? What was the point?

His reply was that God needed our ds to be born.

That statement was profound. On so many levels it made no sense. On so many levels it hurt. But over the years (almost 8 years now since uNPD H left) that statement has carried me through.

While I still often cry "At what cost, Lord? Why do that to a child?", I also often see the truth of that statement.

One person impacts hundreds, if not thousands through their lifetime. Some few impact millions and for many generations after their death. If I look at the bigger picture it helps me to accept the pd difficulties of the seed, if that makes sense.

My ds, now nearly 14, is an incredible young man. He blows me away with his maturity. I learn from him. He is a good support to his friends.

Yes, he has difficulties with his uNPD father and uNPD smother. But the impact he has on those around him is beautiful. He is an incredible blessing to us all and that blessing will extend to so many others throughout his lifetime.

And the effects my pds have had on me? Much as I hate the pain they cause me, I believe they have contributed to the shape of my character.

I am stronger, more compassionate, more patient, more discerning of others' characters etc. (At least I think I am!) That then leads me to a position of being able to help others.

I believe that God has a plan and purpose for each of us. And He is with us every step of the often painful way to that purpose.

AOD

Call Me Cordelia · August 22, 2020, 08:13:47 PM

That's beautiful, AOD. So well said that God allows suffering that he may bring even greater good out of it.

Lillith65 · August 23, 2020, 11:54:09 AM

" Prophet Joel, where the Lord says, "I will redeem the years the locust has eaten." All the years of our painful childhoods, the years of grief, all restored. It's chapter 2, very comforting."

I really like this verse. Thank you

hhaw · August 23, 2020, 04:22:23 PM

Matt Kahn has an interesting video called WHERE HEALING & REALIZATION MEET.

I hope it rings a bell, somehow, for someone.

It's long, and I have to listen to it a second time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QLugPHjJ54c

It struck me as relevant to this thread.

Free2Bme · August 24, 2020, 11:29:58 AM

Here's a excerpt from Spurgeon's commentary on Joel 2...

d. I will restore to you the years that the swarming locust has eaten: When the locusts did their work, it looked complete and final,
i. "It will strike you at once that the locusts did not eat the years: the locusts ate the fruits of the years' labor, the harvests of the fields; so that the meaning of the restoration of the years must be the restoration of those fruits and of those harvests which the locusts consumed. You cannot have back your time; but there is a strange and wonderful way in which God can give back to you the wasted blessings, the unripened fruits of years over which you mourned. The fruits of wasted years may yet be yours." (Spurgeon)

The context of this passage (I believe) is about repentance, trust, and dependency. Like the familiar analogy of the tapestry, we are only seeing the back side, jumbled threads and knots (my life for sure). God sees the end result, the finished product. It is not fair to be the target of abuse, but we live in a fallen world, one day it will all be made right. I must trust that all of this is somehow working together for ultimate good for myself and others concerned. Meanwhile, we grow in our trials, not when life is easy.

I find it interesting that this verse popped up here on this site. When I was married, I often referenced this passage and fantasized that God would work a miracle to redeem my marriage. I wanted all that I had suffered with PD husband to count for something greater. When I ended my marriage, I thought it was an end to this dream as well. I was so narrow and small in my thinking, restoration is not limited and remains a promise.

BB pancakes, The fact that you have stopped the cycle is the "huge dynamic" and requires more strength than allowing it to continue. Perseverance in the face of adversity is always remarkable.

Jolie40 · October 02, 2020, 12:51:39 AM

Blueberry pancakes
have wondered this, also

took me many years to forgive parents but eventually I did
was this the lesson I needed to learn? to forgive?

after forgiveness, it seemed that I had a new start on life
free to be a good parent & enjoy parenthood

DM178 · November 14, 2020, 06:05:34 AM

Hello;

just wanted to say I found this strand, and it really helped me today...so many wonderful and "spot on" contributions....that provided me comfort to the question "why me?"....thank you to all who contributed to it.

Free2Bme · November 16, 2020, 11:46:59 PM

^^^

So glad you are here DM178

Boat Babe · November 17, 2020, 04:56:59 AM

Heya everyone. I have come across the idea that you choose your parents in New Age circles and I find it deeply repugnant. People who say this have no idea about child abuse or they are enablers.

As to how we square being born into our families with Christian theology takes us right to the question "Why does God allows bad things to happen?" Still stumped for an answer I'm afraid.

Adria · December 22, 2020, 11:43:40 AM

I've often wondered in the bible where God talks about how he separates us unto himself, if this is what He meant. The stats say that 25% of people are sociopathic. From what I've come across in nearly 60 years of being on this earth is more like 25% of people are not sociopathic, and closer to 75% are. Maybe it's just the times we are living in, but it seems we are constantly having to protect ourselves from problematic people.

God gives people free will, and will eventually turn them over to a reprobate mind if they practice their evil ways long enough and do not turn around and repent. Our families chose how they wanted to live their life, and it is by the grace of God that we are still standing. But, in the end, He, in one way or another separates us from them and draws us unto himself. As, He says, "When your father and mother forsake you, I will lift you up." And he says, "I will be a father to the fatherless."

I know that God is on our side. As a little girl, my parents always told me I was crazy. I couldn't escape their craziness. But, I would ride my bike to the end of the driveway, look up into the sky and talk to God. He was all I had. In a gentle voice, He spoke peace to my spirit. It is God who kept my sanity through it all. And I believe what Jesus says in the bible "To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne." Revelation 3:21. As people, we are not exempt from suffering in many ways as Christ has suffered. It is part of the human journey.

We cannot grow but through trials and tribulation. Paul says to count it all joy. Being stranded on an island is where Paul did his best work. Very hard to do. But, look where we are, as hard as it is, compared to where many of our family members are. The are in a very dark place, and we see the light. Because of that, we are charged to learn and grown and do better and become better people through our trials. Most of our rewards will probably be in heaven. God knows the score, so we don't have to keep score. He knows how hard we have tried even through all our hurts and failures.

He is a good God in a fallen world. We were never promised an easy ride, but our debt is paid if we believe on Him. The verse that got me through most of the horrors of my life is, 28" Isaiah 40:31 "They That Wait Upon The Lord, Shall Renew Their Strength, They Shall Mount Up with Wings of Eagles, They Shall Run and Not Be Weary Walk Faint. I used to claim that every day as my trials were so overbearing.

We are better people for what we have lived. We are stronger, quieter, kinder, more humble, more empathetic, all the qualities of Christ. Had we not come out the other side, we might have succumbed to bitterness and hate. (Albeit some days are better than others, LOL).

It is easy to forget that we are here for God's purposes, not that He is here for ours.
We do not have all the answers here on this earth, but we can trust that God is sovereign over all, and everything works out for His glory. Also, nothing can touch us without God's consent. So, that leaves us with He knows best and can see the beginning from the end. If not knowing these truths and promises in the bible, I would never have survived. Because, the horrors most of us have lived cannot be understood by most psychologists and counselors, ministers and friends, no matter how much we try to explain. God has drawn me close through all of this. So, the biggest blessings for me are that I have a far greater relationship with God than I would have had being brought up in a kinder more caring family. And, I have been able (by the grace of God) to turn my mess into a message and help others as many of you are doing here. In my mind, it helps to make some of the wrongs right, and knowing I can help others, in many ways, makes it worth it or at the very least okay.

My life has been very lonely and many times sad, but God promises to turn mourning into joy. For the first time in thirty years for me wandering through the dessert with no family, I am now able to move and be with my kids and grandkids. I feel, God is telling me, "This is your time." I am so excited! He is turning my mourning into joy. Just wondered why it has taken so long.

So many times, this life can seem hopeless, crazy, senseless, and grief stricken . . . but God.

Associate of Daniel · December 22, 2020, 03:32:44 PM

So well said, Adria.

What a wonderful God we have.

AOD

Hilltop · December 23, 2020, 05:39:32 AM

I agree with Adria that God gives you free will. The way I see it is that He has not planned out your life for you, it is yours to live, your choice how you choose to live it. What He gave you was your life, life itself, what you do with it is your free will. He has set out principles to lead you to a happier and more fulfilled life however ultimately its up to you to find your own path in life. That's just how I see it as we don't have the answers.

So why did we end up in a family with this dynamic, because there are so many hurt people in the world, so, so many. The cycle continues on for generation after generation. I honestly feel like there are a lot more hurt people than there are emotionally healthy people out there. The chance of being born into a family with issues is far greater than being born into a really emotionally healthy family. The fact that you have broken that cycle for your children is huge, in my opinion that is massive. It will impact the lives of your children and all the generations after. The ripples of those changes may impact your nieces and nephews who look at your family and see that something is different.

Life to me isn't about never ending happiness, as Free2Bme wrote "we grow in our trials, not when life is easy". Adria wrote the same. I have found this to be so true. We do not strive to learn when everything is great. It's when things are tough that we try to learn, to teach ourselves and to be better. What are we learning here, to be kinder, to be more compassionate not only to others but to ourselves. You are then teaching your children this.

Jesus suffered in this world. We suffer as well, it is unavoidable. What is important is what you do about suffering, do you fall down into hatred and bitterness or follow the light and find compassion in your heart. The question is not "why" were you born into your family but "what" will you do about it. What choice and path will you forge for your own life? We have a chance to learn and grow from that suffering. I consider us the lucky ones, who are here and are changing and will be better off for it. Most people don't take the time to learn or change as it is hard.

Adria · December 23, 2020, 08:28:52 AM

Hilltop,

QuoteI consider us the lucky ones, who are here and are changing and will be better off for it. Most people don't take the time to learn or change as it is hard.

That is a great point, Hilltop. Hard as it is, and although many times it doesn't feel this way, I agree, we are the lucky ones. We can see truth and light and we have the strength and courage to fight for it. Unfortunately, many in our families cannot, and do not, and have succumbed to a life of darkness, bitterness and hatred. So, yes, if we can look at it from that point of view, we are truly the lucky ones.

Hilltop · December 23, 2020, 08:30:32 PM

Adria I suppose I am not saying we are lucky to be suffering from this, only that we are trying to learn. They way I see it, if we didn't suffer from this then there would be some other form of suffering to deal with. I look around me and I don't see many people who lead charmed lives with nothing to worry about. People may have financial difficulties, sick children, children with special needs, infidelity in their marriage, infertility etc etc.

Most of my family are still living with the same type of dysfunctional behaviour, continuing it with their own children, so I think Bluecake Pancakes is amazing to have changed that dynamic for her family. I don't see it as something small, and Blucake's children are very lucky indeed.