First half was IN, second half will be OUT.

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freefrom

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First half was IN, second half will be OUT.
« on: May 30, 2021, 12:20:18 AM »
I'm not doing the second half of my life like this. I refuse.

I'm coming to terms that my mother probably has BPD and N. Our relationship has been strained for years, and I think an incident that happened the other day might've been the tipping point for me to really consider NC. I'm already LC with most of my toxic family and it's not getting better, it just inevitably gets worse the more boundaries you have to enforce.

My ex had BPD. I didn't know what it was until after we got married but soon found out as I started scouring google at two in the morning. Now it all makes sense and seems to have come full circle. I'm just still in awe how your family toxicity follows you, haunts you, no matter how hard you try to escape it.

I'm getting my exit plan in place though. This is a new level but I'm confident because I've had to make it on my own most of my life. Wish me well and well wishes to you all.

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Starboard Song

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Re: First half was IN, second half will be OUT.
« Reply #1 on: June 03, 2021, 09:57:26 AM »
I'm getting my exit plan in place though. This is a new level but I'm confident because I've had to make it on my own most of my life. Wish me well and well wishes to you all.

I am glad you are starting with an actual plan. Exits without plans often get delayed, go poorly, or are unsafe. I wish you so very well, and have confidence that you'll be in a better place three years from now than where you are today. Maybe sooner, sure. I hope so. But keep a long horizon, so you stay prepared for some hard work.

Good luck, and set aside time in that plan to do some self-healing and self-improvement. Injuries leave scars. You deserve to heal.
« Last Edit: June 14, 2021, 05:23:47 PM by Starboard Song »
Radical Acceptance, by Brach   |   Self-Compassion, by Neff    |   Mindfulness, by Williams   |   The Book of Joy, by the Dalai Lama and Tutu
Healing From Family Rifts, by Sichel   |  Stop Walking on Egshells, by Mason    |    Emotional Blackmail, by Susan Forward

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freefrom

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Re: First half was IN, second half will be OUT.
« Reply #2 on: June 10, 2021, 09:07:01 PM »
Thank you so much! My apologies for replying so late - I had the tab up here but they're amongst many others so it got lost in the daily shuffle.

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Exits with plans often get delayed, go poorly, or are unsafe.

Would you be able to elaborate on this?
Do you mean like opposed to "just run, and get out of there!" sudden decisions?

If I could I would leave right now (I don't have many, if any, attachments) but I'm trying to put in place some finance goals before I make the move.

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BeautifulCrazy

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Re: First half was IN, second half will be OUT.
« Reply #3 on: June 11, 2021, 05:05:16 PM »
Freefrom, I suspect that was just a mistake in Starboard's reply.

For me, having a plan was essential.
It was "the plan" that kept me focused and sane for many months while I made my preparations to leave. 
When the time came, the plan was what kept us physically safe, mentally grounded and in forward motion.  It didn't go perfectly. Covid delayed everything, especially financially. Then the timing had to be shifted by a couple of days at the last minute due to unforseen and unpredictable circumstances. But it was waaaay better than "just running out" and then trying to deal with an unreasonable person from within a chaotic situation. (That was the way it happened with my first exit. I do not recommend!!)
I wish you so much success with your escape plans and look forward to reading you on the boards!
~ BC

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freefrom

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Re: First half was IN, second half will be OUT.
« Reply #4 on: June 12, 2021, 05:38:11 PM »
Freefrom, I suspect that was just a mistake in Starboard's reply.

For me, having a plan was essential.
It was "the plan" that kept me focused and sane for many months while I made my preparations to leave. 
When the time came, the plan was what kept us physically safe, mentally grounded and in forward motion.  It didn't go perfectly. Covid delayed everything, especially financially. Then the timing had to be shifted by a couple of days at the last minute due to unforseen and unpredictable circumstances. But it was waaaay better than "just running out" and then trying to deal with an unreasonable person from within a chaotic situation. (That was the way it happened with my first exit. I do not recommend!!)
I wish you so much success with your escape plans and look forward to reading you on the boards!
~ BC

Ah got it. Thank you for the reply and thanks for sharing your story.

I can't operate in general without some sort of plan or to-do list so its just second nature to me.

I'm sorry you had to experience these unfortunate events by these disorderly people and I'm glad you made it OUT. I'm hoping my plan will go as smoothly as I envision but as you mentioned, there's always hiccups that are bound to happen.

Thank you so much for your well wishes and I wish you much continued success as well. Looking forward to running into you on the boards as well!

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Starboard Song

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Re: First half was IN, second half will be OUT.
« Reply #5 on: June 14, 2021, 05:22:35 PM »
Egads!

Yes, my comment was an enormous typo!

I meant to say that exits WITHOUT plans can be problematic. When we don't think through what we are trying to accomplish, we can be unsafe. And more commonly, we just never get the job done. So yes! Make a plan!

I am so sorry to have written something so strange and then step away for a few days.
Radical Acceptance, by Brach   |   Self-Compassion, by Neff    |   Mindfulness, by Williams   |   The Book of Joy, by the Dalai Lama and Tutu
Healing From Family Rifts, by Sichel   |  Stop Walking on Egshells, by Mason    |    Emotional Blackmail, by Susan Forward

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theonetoblame

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Re: First half was IN, second half will be OUT.
« Reply #6 on: June 15, 2021, 02:13:16 AM »
I'm just still in awe how your family toxicity follows you, haunts you, no matter how hard you try to escape it.

This is a really interesting statement to me and something I have been thinking about quite a bit lately. I study and work in the field of human cognition and something we often talk about is the difference between explicit and implicit memory. Explicit memories are the ones you can recall/declare using language and logic, implicit memories are more emotional and procedural based and not readily accessible to us consciously. There are many, many things in our lives that we remember implicitly and don't have genuine conscious access to.

Information we store in implicit memory often feels familiar even if it's wrong or inaccurate, this is born out when trying to teach people with explicit memory impairment new things. If they make an error, they don't remember the error is wrong only that it is familiar. Because it is familiar, when presented with the choice in the future they are more likely to chose the wrong response. I've been coming around to believing that this may be why we are drawn to unhealthy people and patterns -- because they are familiar and we don't have conscious access to the information about them being harmful. The word 'familiar' shares origins with 'family', interesting....?

Coming Out of the FOG is then, for me at least, about moving these implicit memories and responses into explicit, declarative verbal memory, reasoning and knowledge. Until we are able to move these 'familiar/family' memories into our explicit and conscious memory we may remain vulnerable to 'moth to the flame' behaviors i.e. being drawn to something we are attracted to because it is familiar even though it is actually dangerous and unhealthy for us... I went through this very situation quite recently, fortunately I was able to step back and think about a particular person using my explicit/declarative memory and logic. I soon realized that I was being implicitly drawn to the toxic elements of the person because the seem soooo very, very familiar... just like family!! YIKES :)

Perhaps a bit 'heady' for many here, but this developing idea makes increasing sense to me from a cognitive science perspective...

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freefrom

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Re: First half was IN, second half will be OUT.
« Reply #7 on: June 20, 2021, 12:21:00 PM »
Egads!

Yes, my comment was an enormous typo!

I meant to say that exits WITHOUT plans can be problematic. When we don't think through what we are trying to accomplish, we can be unsafe. And more commonly, we just never get the job done. So yes! Make a plan!

I am so sorry to have written something so strange and then step away for a few days.

Not a problem at all!

I was thinking for a sec there that I still have a lot to learn! :)

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freefrom

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Re: First half was IN, second half will be OUT.
« Reply #8 on: June 20, 2021, 12:48:02 PM »
I'm just still in awe how your family toxicity follows you, haunts you, no matter how hard you try to escape it.

This is a really interesting statement to me and something I have been thinking about quite a bit lately. I study and work in the field of human cognition and something we often talk about is the difference between explicit and implicit memory. Explicit memories are the ones you can recall/declare using language and logic, implicit memories are more emotional and procedural based and not readily accessible to us consciously. There are many, many things in our lives that we remember implicitly and don't have genuine conscious access to.

Information we store in implicit memory often feels familiar even if it's wrong or inaccurate, this is born out when trying to teach people with explicit memory impairment new things. If they make an error, they don't remember the error is wrong only that it is familiar. Because it is familiar, when presented with the choice in the future they are more likely to chose the wrong response. I've been coming around to believing that this may be why we are drawn to unhealthy people and patterns -- because they are familiar and we don't have conscious access to the information about them being harmful. The word 'familiar' shares origins with 'family', interesting....?

Coming Out of the FOG is then, for me at least, about moving these implicit memories and responses into explicit, declarative verbal memory, reasoning and knowledge. Until we are able to move these 'familiar/family' memories into our explicit and conscious memory we may remain vulnerable to 'moth to the flame' behaviors i.e. being drawn to something we are attracted to because it is familiar even though it is actually dangerous and unhealthy for us... I went through this very situation quite recently, fortunately I was able to step back and think about a particular person using my explicit/declarative memory and logic. I soon realized that I was being implicitly drawn to the toxic elements of the person because the seem soooo very, very familiar... just like family!! YIKES :)

Perhaps a bit 'heady' for many here, but this developing idea makes increasing sense to me from a cognitive science perspective...

I'm sorry for replying so late. I haven't checked in much this week.

This should be sticky'd on the frontpage of the forum, seriously.

It reminds me of Stockholm syndrome. The bond forms to the person in authority/control - whether a good or bad person, it still forms explicitly but definitely implicitly.

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Coming Out of the FOG is then, for me at least, about moving these implicit memories and responses into explicit, declarative verbal memory, reasoning and knowledge.

How is this done? I suppose through "talk" therapy? I was in therapy but it was marital therapy as a couple (I'm divorced now. I was on this site a couple years ago and it helped me tremendously). I've gone for myself but never really went for a prolonged period. I'm going to get back into it. Thank you for shining light on this. I have the tools but they're usually all in my head (I'm not talking them out) and I'm going at it alone. I need to work with someone in person to really solidify my transformation and freedom from patterns.

So many people are held captive by their family! There's good ones out there but it seems less and less the more I talk with people. I'm a firm believer that we need to get back to living in community and having healthy relationships around us, like intentional communities, co-housing etc. I think that helps to heal the pain and trauma when you have a group of people united for a common cause.

Thank you again my friend!