Secret Meetings

[Magnolia34]

I'm glad to see everyone survived (endured?) the holidays! We were spared any uncomfortable time with my UPBDMIL/BIL because they claimed to be concerned about Covid (we have been extremely careful as well). Until yesterday that is... after saying they would be keeping clear of my FIL who is living in a nursing home, and canceling all plans as a "safety precaution" my DH ran into both of them yesterday when he went to visit FIL. So as usual, it's all lies and excuses.
I don't know why I continue to be so disappointed in them. I suppose it's just because of DH. It's hard to see him being treated badly after everything I know he's tried to do for his family. I mentioned this in another thread but a few years ago, DH was asked by his father (who was becoming very ill) to take over their finances. It was a huge task as everything had been neglected for several years but he was able to change financial advisors, re invest, get the taxes caught up, etc. and things have been going well. Part of that meant cutting off UBPDBIL who IL's had been supporting for YEARS (he's quite a bit younger than us but MORE than capable to take care of himself). He's been really nasty ever since to include some pretty verbally abusive/aggressive text messages prior to Christmas. Anyway... DH just found out that UBPDMIL/BIL have scheduled a secret meeting with the financial advisors tomorrow. We're hoping they're just complaining about taxes (because FIL hadn't done anything and UBPDMIL is so disorganized, last year's taxes have had to be extended through this year... NOT a huge deal, people do it all the time and the accountant has assured everyone that everything is fine). But it's just ammunition for UBPDBIL to use with UBPDMIL in his campaign against DH.
Poor DH just seems defeated and done. It's starting to feel a little dangerous for him to continue to be involved with their finances. FIL trusts him but he's TOTALLY uninvolved at this point. UBPDMIL has NO clue how the world works, not to mention investing and finances... she admits she hasn't even looked at a bank statement in 25 years. But now that UBPDBIL has her ear, I'm pretty nervous about being involved in any of this as well. I guess we'll just have to see what the topic of conversation is at their meeting tomorrow (the financial advisors will fill DH in as he's the one in charge of the accounts) and go from there.
The triangulation, lying, blaming, it's just all too much. DH has told UBPDBIL that he would like to sit down with a 3rd party (therapist) to try to sort all of this out but BIL refuses. MIL acted like she might be open to it but we'll see. There has never been one medical/mental health  professional she's been happy with and the second she hears something critical she'll bail.  I have zero faith at this point but I think it's important for DH to try.
I have decided to go NC with both of them. I never had much interaction with BIL anyway but I have blocked his number to try to mitigate the anxiety his hateful texts have caused. I don't want to block MIL in case there's some kind of emergency but she has refused to keep me off of their text threads as I have politely asked, multiple times. I just continue to remove myself from the text group, which I'm sure looks bitchy, but I'm beyond caring.

[Cat of the Canals]

Poor DH just seems defeated and done. It's starting to feel a little dangerous for him to continue to be involved with their finances.

NC sounds like the right move for you. Does your husband have financial POA (or the equivalent depending on where you live)? If not, and he chooses to continue managing their finances, he might want to look into it. I don't think it's fair for him to be saddled with this responsibility but with no power to say "no" to BIL.

If he decides he wants out, he could consider hiring a professional fiduciary. It would probably be a relief to have a third party who is then responsible for telling BIL to "go kick rocks" when he comes around demanding a handout.

In any case, much strength to you both.

[Hilltop]

Magnolia I would not worry about looking bitchy about removing yourself from the text threads.  You have asked to be kept off which your MIL has ignored your request.  There is nothing wrong with simply removing yourself from them.  Keeping yourself off those text threads is not hurting anyone.  I think if that's what you want to do, there is no problem with removing yourself and not saying anything.  Good for you.

I wonder if FIL asked your DH to do the finances so he could be the bad guy and cut off BIL.  I wonder if MIL is having the secret meeting because FIL is now in a home and MIL wants to keep financing BIL.

It seems like it will turn into a drama with BIL, it's a lot of work for your DH.  I think you are right to remove yourself and simply be there to support your DH.

[Magnolia34]

DH does have durable power of attorney for FIL, but not for MIL. MIL also has POA for FIL. BIL has nothing but total manipulation of MIL. So it's pretty messy and confusing. They are currently working with fiduciaries, which up until now has been helpful and they've mostly been able to keep BIL and MIL in check. However, because of this campaign against DH I think the credibility of the financial advisor is tarnished because DH and I used this advisor prior to moving IL's accounts over and MIL and BIL know the advisors are communicating with DH also. If she wanted to, MIL could walk into the advisors office tomorrow and move everything to a different management company... everything except FIL's retirement which only DH has access to. DH's biggest concern is just making sure there is enough money (managed responsibly, there should be) to take care of FIL now, and MIL later. They're both still fairly young so there could be 10-15 years of this level of care still to go.

DH's plan is to first see what comes of the meeting today. If it's the worst case scenario and they're actively trying to kick DH out of everything, or move the accounts without talking to anyone, I think DH is going to be done. I think he feels like he has to tell FIL what's going on... up until now he hasn't said everything because he doesn't want to contribute to his already poor mental and physical health. But FIL asked DH to take over, so if he's going to step out he feels like he needs to have that conversation. This will put him in a tough spot because if FIL gets upset or, God forbid has some sort of decline, they'll blame DH. His other thought is to see about having an elder law attorney take over. We want to meet with a few, just to see what function they could serve... technically it's MIL's money but her judgement has been so terrible (probably some dementia but she's high functioning enough that no one would ever declare her incompetent) that the financial advisor has already said she shouldn't be the only one in charge. I don't know that an attorney could say "No, you can't give your house to BIL." We'll just have to see. If DH decides to step back hopefully he can just present an attorney as the only other option and MIL won't have a chance to argue. She has NO idea how any of this works so she may not question it. 

Hilltop... I don't know that pushing everything off on DH to then throw him under the bus with BIL was intentional, but they have consistently made decisions (or refused to make decisions) that DH has then had to go clean up. Initially, I just felt sorry for them and DH and I would just go do what we had to do to help... but now with BIL involved and seeing such blatant lying and manipulation from MIL and BIL, I think we're both just done. As an example... BIL currently has a HUGE sum of money (all given to him by MIL) just sitting, mostly in cash, in his accounts (we know this because of the financial advisors... it's kind of a "family" account so up until now everything has been pretty out in the open) BUT... DH just found out that MIL bought BIL a brand new computer. She continues to pay his car insurance, cell phone bill, health insurance but makes comments like "I'm not choosing a favorite son" and "What you do for one you have to do for the other." Or she'll just completely lie about what he's been given.

I'm a grown adult with a job who has been paying my own bills for close to 20 years... I'm not jealous of BIL. But it's so frustrating to see how hard DH is working to make sure his parents are taken care of and to have BIL actively taking advantage of them while ALSO working to essentially push DH out of the family.

Thank you both for your input and feedback. I'll report back once we know the topic of today's meeting.

[Hilltop]

It seems like FIL then knew MIL would be irresponsible with his retirement money if only DH has access to that account.  It will be interesting to see what comes up today, good luck.

Perhaps your DH can take care of FIL's money in his retirement account and make sure that is used wisely.  I would say the other 'family' account will be drained by BIL and MIL.  I would be thinking that BIL is trying to push DH out simply to get his hands on the cash.  If it's that difficult I would consider leaving MIL and BIL to themselves and if that account is drained by BIL, then MIL will have to take that up with him.

It really does sound like the money needs to be split between FIL and MIL and you need to take care of FIL's needs without any further interference by MIL.  Your FIL hasn't given your MIL access to his retirement savings and that to me speaks volumes.

[Magnolia34]

The financial advisors didn't say much about the meeting. Just that it "went fine." DH will probably get some more details but he's trying not to look crazy. Or maybe MIL told them they didn't have permission to relay anything to DH. Who knows.

Thanks, Hilltop. I think you're partly right. Mostly I think they were just so disorganized, and FIL became ill before he had a chance to really look at everything objectively and get things organized. I'm not sure they're THAT strategic, but maybe. I also think NO ONE could have predicted this conflict between BIL and DH. Even when DH was asked to look through BIL's bank accounts (because IL's were handing BIL a pretty big sum of money each month when NONE of them-including BIL-even knew what he was making or what his expenses were) DH realized that BIL had multiple gym memberships running that he wasn't using, there was a $1,500 fraudulent charge that was never mentioned... so he either didn't notice, or didn't care because he had more money than he knew what to do with. When DH brought all of this to IL's attention and indicated that at best, BIL was financially illiterate and irresponsible, or at worst was blatantly taking advantage of them, FIL scolded DH a little bit and told him not to "assume BIL's intent."

MIL has also begun to blame DH for things that happened when he was much younger. I may have already mentioned this but when DH was married to his uBPDXW she threatened to take his kids and leave if he didn't cut off contact with his family. So he went for several years without speaking to them. BIL was pretty young at this time and apparently MIL just quit doing anything and "took to her bed." She's recently dropped the line "Well... BIL is so immature because I couldn't parent him the way I needed to when DH was gone for those years." She is COMPLETELY unable to take responsibility for anything. Blaming DH has just been the final straw for me.

Another example of this frustration was one night when MIL was taken to the emergency room. BIL went with her and DH left his kids at home (with me) and went to stay with FIL who wasn't really able to be alone at that point. DH runs his owns business, has 50/50 custody of his children and has largely taken over financial and practical care of his parents. BIL does very little... so I was actually impressed that he took the initiative to go with MIL. I ran some clothes over to him at one point when he realized he was going to have to spend the night and the ENTIRE time I was there FIL was pacing around the house, wringing his hands talking about how late it was getting and that BIL really needed to get home so he could go to bed because he had to work the next day. WHAT ON EARTH DO THEY THINK DH DOES??? It's just astounding to me. They just expect it from him because he's always been there, OR they don't mind inconveniencing DH because at one point, when he was young and in a really hard, abusive marriage, he caused them a few years of upset and they handled it terribly.

All that to say, I think you're right. DH's hands are largely tied and MIL and BIL are probably going to make terrible decisions with her finances if DH is pushed out and there is no one there to reign them in. There's just nothing we can do but try to take care of FIL. DH always says "There are lots of things I can try to do to help my dad... but I can't un-marry him from my mom. He made that decision."