Dad inviting himself for Christmas

[nanotech]

My dad has been sort of shunning me for months. He didn't want me to go visit. Other siblings/ nieces, post restrictions, were getting to see him. But we were only invited if we could take him out. Then the trip out was cancelled by him, mobility reasons( sciatica) but no, we couldn't come to his home.
I hadn't set physical eyes on him for two years. This was due to lockdowns, and when the visits were allowed, dad didn't want them.
Back to the recent unpleasantness. He'd said in January that due to the high levels of COVID, he didn't want to be taken out for his birthday. Cue Unpdniece who tried to arrange a family party, pressuring me and my family to attend. Big fat no. Big fat no from my dad also, apparently, but then she found a way to get round him. Or did he always want that?  Anyhoo, she gave him another reason for attending on his birthday. Then lo and behold, she posted pics of them eating out together at a restaurant. Just her and him.
I've got her blocked on fb ( massive fm)  but my cousin saw it- and was puzzled as to where everyone else was on my dad's special day!  He'd told everyone else he wasn't going out. 
Then he wouldn't let me visit at all.
I felt frustrated and rejected by my dad, not for the first time.
In the end, I had to dig my heels in, and just insist that we visit him at his home at least that week, even if just to give him his present over the doorstep. I pointed out how other family members were granted this. I reminded him that  I hadn't been in his house for two years.
This heralded a change in approach from me. 

I had spoken to my cousin on it, confiding in her, and she helped me  realise that I wasn't being assertive enough with him.
I was letting him get away with treating family unequally by constantly moving goalposts, then gaslighting.

Last year, dad was supposed to come to our home for Christmas Dinner. In the end he was ill, and was unable to travel. We'd done this before with dad- but the whole day was dominated by it.
My  husband was saying he was okay  to do a four hour round trip to facilitate this visit. As hubby was also cooking the Christmas dinner( I'm lucky I know) it began to dawn on me that it had been a complete blessing that it had been cancelled. It was far too much for my husband to do. I had asked too much of him.
Such was the need to please my father. 
Plus it was a lot of travelling for my Ndad too. Hey, I do think about him.
So, getting back to his birthday, we finally got to visit my dad at his house - and as soon as we got in there, just sat down, he straight up invites himself for Christmas 2022! 
The reason? He can't stand UNPD GC BRother's   in-laws. Apparently 'they only talk about themselves,! So I have to solve the problem of him having to put up with them on a Christmas Day. They are pretty horrendous, and have been quite malicious in the past.
My response was to burst out laughing( he didn't join in)  and to tell him he was VERY early with his plans! We were sensible enough not to say yes, but I think he's assuming it!  It's not my fault he doesn't like his son's wife's parents. Probably has to share the attention too, which he hates. But it's not my responsibility to fix that for him.
Honestly, the way he just blurted it out, with eyes firmly on my husband for a great big yes!

[SunnyMeadow]

he straight up invites himself for Christmas 2022! 
The reason? He can't stand UNPD GC BRother's   in-laws. Apparently 'they only talk about themselves,! So I have to solve the problem of him having to put up with them on a Christmas Day.

So he's been shunning you for months and doesn't want you to go visit but now you're good enough to visit at Christmas?!  The fun never ends, does it? I like your reply that he's very early with his plans (he sure is!). At least you have 9 months to make other arrangements. 

[GentleSoul]

The audacity and entitlement is shocking! 

Very good work on not agreeing to it in the shock and heat of the moment. 

[moglow]

I'm guessing "hahahahaha No." and quick change of subject isn't considered an appropriate response?

[Hazy111]

  It isnt even Easter and hes planning (his) Xmas !   You have to admire that ruthless self preservation sometimes. 

Reminds me a bit of my father planning his own birthday party and phoning me to invite me on my birthday  . He never mentioned it and i didnt remind him. (i didnt go btw). 

People who dont understand PD say "well hes old and forgetful and that. You should forgive etc"  "So why didnt he forget his own birthday and why did he feel the need to have a party? " i ask and thats where you get the fumbling and the pausing and the " well hes got other things on his mind obviously. Im sure he would have.." etc . Theres always an excuse but never a proper answer.  But if hes narcissistic everything falls into place.  It all makes sense.

Once you see you cant unsee.

[Sneezy]

Christmas???  Seriously???  Good for you for not committing to anything at this point.  The holidays are tough enough with elderly and PD parents in the mix.  But getting worked up about a holiday 9 months in advance is a bit much.  And it's typical PD behavior.  My mom likes to know exactly what we will be eating for the holidays weeks, if not months, in advance.  And my MIL used to call about six months after a major holiday to complain about how someone didn't ask her if she wanted a cup of coffee or some other minor thing that was major in her mind.  But asking about Christmas 9 months in advance is pretty amazing!  I am shaking my head.

[nanotech]

Thanks for these replies- yes it's shun shun shun then when I pushed for a visit , eventually he agreed, but there was a price to be had for that very reasonable request. Thing is, my seeing  my dad in his home for a couple of hours, doesn't in any way benefit him. He wants to be taken out somewhere of his choosing and treated, but  only when HE decides to go. Sometimes when he's made demands over dates, I've wondered if he thinks I've got a fireman's pole to slide down at a moment's  notice.  He used to be very fond of saying,
" I know when I ring you you'll drop everything and come."

So if I've pushed, then in his view, his push back has to be greater. There's a need to save face somehow, and to gain ground. It's all about feeling and looking like Top Dog.
He decided that the home visit entitled to him inviting himself for Christmas!

He actually said in a loaded voice,

' I'm inviting myself now, for Christmas!' 

His face said, ' Don't dare argue!'

Omg yes I did laugh!  So glad I did now- thank God for spontaneity!

He is so transactional. This has happened before. Everything's a negotiation. It smacks of ruthlessness and feels very far away from genuine family love and respect.
I was brought up with this whole transactional culture. My parents both advocated this kind of approach to life. Get what you can from other people, and be like this with family too. It was always about what we 'deserved', what we'd 'earned', or not. Nothing was unconditional. If we strayed from the script we were discarded and  scapegoated. Only  UNPDGCbrother could act like he wanted to. And he did! That's why dad doesn't want to go to his house. He still can't stand up to him, or overrule him. He never could. He was the youngest child but he was challenging.  My mum took a decision to ' just give him love'  which  actually meant he was permitted by mum to  from the tender age of four to control the house and all who lived in it. This actually happened.  Even my dad went along with this. So my brother can literally do no wrong, as can his appalling wife. So of course  he has no control over how long he has to be subjected to the in laws on Christmas Day. It's a very odd dynamic. My brother mustn't be upset, ever, or have his life disrupted, so dad will have to put up with whatever while there.

Sigh. On my visit, Dad pulled a grumpy face for the photos, and then went on to pick his present to pieces. A few days later  he rang and telling me how much he liked it, and how ' very pleased' he was with me and what a 'lovely daughter'I was ( all in a surprised tone!)
Intermittent positive rewards no doubt, to convince me once again that I come from a happy family. He'll probably play this role for a while, to secure his Christmas invitation. Nope.

The last time we invited him, he was okay on the day. He had a lovely time. Luckily we had a houseful here( pre pandemic) and that served to dilute him. Yet a few days later he rang with sarcastic tones restored once more. I can always tell when he's been talking to my GCbrother, Nsister and PDniece and nephew.  A week after Christmas there was no afterglow of the day for my dad. Just zero.

[nanotech]

he straight up invites himself for Christmas 2022! 
The reason? He can't stand UNPD GC BRother's   in-laws. Apparently 'they only talk about themselves,! So I have to solve the problem of him having to put up with them on a Christmas Day.

So he's been shunning you for months and doesn't want you to go visit but now you're good enough to visit at Christmas?!  The fun never ends, does it? I like your reply that he's very early with his plans (he sure is!). At least you have 9 months to make other arrangements. 

Thanks Sunny Meadow. You put it in a nutshell for me. I'm starting to see it more and more, but I'm still work in progress . This helps me see it, remember it, not to get sucked back in.

[nanotech]

I'm guessing "hahahahaha No." and quick change of subject isn't considered an appropriate response?

Thanks moglow I was half way there, I laughed! Need to work on the NO

[nanotech]

The audacity and entitlement is shocking! 

Very good work on not agreeing to it in the shock and heat of the moment.

Thanks gentle soul, I think he was relying on catching me off guard! His mistake was to blurt it as soon as we sat down! He's losing his touch. He used to butter me up relentlessly before he threw the fireworks. However, I've been onto that too for the past few years. On a meal out with us, he was being lovely and I was starting to feel warm n fuzzy,  and then he suddenly dropped in a request to bring NSIS with him  ( omg not two narcs in one visit!) next time he came! It was so slick,  my husband was beginning to nod, but I was shaking my head!

[nanotech]

It isnt even Easter and hes planning (his) Xmas !   You have to admire that ruthless self preservation sometimes. 

Reminds me a bit of my father planning his own birthday party and phoning me to invite me on my birthday  . He never mentioned it and i didnt remind him. (i didnt go btw). 

People who dont understand PD say "well hes old and forgetful and that. You should forgive etc"  "So why didnt he forget his own birthday and why did he feel the need to have a party? " i ask and thats where you get the fumbling and the pausing and the " well hes got other things on his mind obviously. Im sure he would have.." etc . Theres always an excuse but never a proper answer.  But if hes narcissistic everything falls into place.  It all makes sense.

Once you see you cant unsee.

Crikey Hazy. That's something my dad would do. He once arranged for me to take him on a 30 mile drive for a hospital appointment, all on my birthday. It was a special one too. All arranged without my say so. I think that big birthday made him all the more keen to remind me of my place, which was to serve him. They like to keep thinking of us as children, under their thumb.He got a big fat no to that one, and promptly changed the appointment date ( just in case I might invite him round to treat him on MY birthday! )  No.
Meh.
He wants a summer party too, a proper event. I won't be attending that. It took me a long time to realise that I can still see him ( just about) but I don't have to play these crazy toxic games with my siblings. His 80th was a hubbub of toxicity. Not doing that any more.
Yep, once you can see, you really can't unsee. In my case, even though I see it and feel it, I can still react to type.  I can sometimes still fall back into old patterns of behaviour. So I'm working on me!

[nanotech]

Christmas???  Seriously???  Good for you for not committing to anything at this point.  The holidays are tough enough with elderly and PD parents in the mix.  But getting worked up about a holiday 9 months in advance is a bit much.  And it's typical PD behavior.  My mom likes to know exactly what we will be eating for the holidays weeks, if not months, in advance.  And my MIL used to call about six months after a major holiday to complain about how someone didn't ask her if she wanted a cup of coffee or some other minor thing that was major in her mind.  But asking about Christmas 9 months in advance is pretty amazing!  I am shaking my head.

Thanks Sneezy! Yes it really is typical PD behaviour. Your MIL sounds like my dad.  He will definitely analyse to criticise! My dad complained about not being able to get a cup of coffee from the bar at my daughter's  wedding, at 1 am in the morning! They'd been serving it but the event finished at 1. He was staying in the adjoining hotel which had 24 hour room service and facilities for tea/ coffee also. I'd long gone to sleep in the hotel, with my 2 year old granddaughter, so my  daughter and her hubby could carry on dancing and having fun. My dad was 81- why was he still up getting grumpy at the bar? I think he expected me to be there, making sure he got his coffee!

[p123]

Nano - so he treats you like crap then invites himself for xmas?

Wow thats nuts. I've got a real thing about people inviting themselves.....

Your Dad and mine are very similar I think. Both seem to do things as  a "test" sometimes to make it as awkward as possible just so you know you're place.

[nanotech]

Nano - so he treats you like crap then invites himself for xmas?

Wow thats nuts. I've got a real thing about people inviting themselves.....

Your Dad and mine are very similar I think. Both seem to do things as  a "test" sometimes to make it as awkward as possible just so you know you're place.

Yes, P123, I reckon that's true. He also seems to be getting more blatant as he gets older! Or perhaps I'm just seeing it more quickly now. The main thing is, I don't have the strong immediate reactions of fear, obligation and guilt that I used have several years ago. I see you doing this too, saying no early.
I'm so pleased I actually laughed!  He didn't, of course. He just got more intense, insisting on how much he dislikes having to see, and socialise with, my GCNBrother's in-laws.  Despite favouring my brother in every way possible-both parents did- a big part of that favouring is that my brother has become the power base for the FOO.  I know, it's really messed up. It's something my BPD mum started. Mum used to be the power base, and the Nbrother used to triangulate through her. Once she passed, my dad paid homage to mum by totally deferring to him. But brother can't get to me through mum any more, so he now tries to manipulate me through a niece, or sometimes through dad. It doesn't work as well.
So he moved to social media. 


But I'm not on there with him any more.
 
My dad doesn't dare challenge him on anything. He can't possibly upset him by sharing his negative reactions on sister in law's ( also narcissistic) parents. The pretence must continue, and Nbrother and his choices must not be challenged. He's the Golden Child.
So instead, I am to ' fix it' and  provide him with a polite excuse not to attend Nbrother's home on Christmas Day. Plus he knows will be well fed and well looked after by us, of course! This is how we've been for years. Discarded, then rolled out to provide a gold standard  service, then discarded again. Days after we'd done this three years ago, I rang him, and dad was back to his old sarky, dismissive arrogance. He'd got his way and now he didn't need us for the present moment.
But Dad keeps forgetting, I don't take this abuse any more. 

The trouble is, if I categorically say no now, he's going to ask my daughter to invite him! He mentioned her too. I think it was intentional. ( If you don't say yes, I'll bother your child!).
Blackmail really. 
He was invited once to my daughter's for Christmas,and it was really hard work. We were there too. He kept telling the children to be quiet. One was just a baby at the time! I could go on. There was a lot of stuff - I don't want to go through it again.
My daughter is kind, and she  hasn't been brought up by him. She's aware of what I've been through with my family, but sometimes her kindness is all, and she only sees a waify 90 year old man looking for Christmas cheer. He might get round her. This could be problematic.
If he does go there, we won't. We  will see her on a different day. That might be enough to put him off going. It's me he's after- plus our catering, which he knows he'd get if we were going.  ( we do most of the food) .He can't really be micro aggressive with my daughter, at least not in the same ways he can be with me.
Sigh.They enjoy it. They need it. They especially feel entitled to do it during holiday times.
I'm going to say no nearer the time. If he's gobsmacked, iI will remind him that I hadn't said yes to begin with. A big fat no with no jading. 
Just realised when writing this. Before it even existed, my BPD mum used to actually BE my GCNbrother's social media. No wonder PDs adore Facebook.

[moglow]

URGH!! Try and keep reminding yourself [and him if needed] it's MARCH. You haven't even decided what, if anything, you're doing for Easter or Fourth of July yet. Give it a rest already! AND who knows, y'all just might decide to do something crazy and new and travel for the holidays!! If your daughter gets guilted into inviting him, that's her choice. Not something you can or should manage for her, and you're also not responsible for any fallout from him.

All this said, I've declined and/or essentially blanked the past 10-12 Christmases/holiday seasons with mine. She had an epic meltdown one Christmas day and dragged three of her four children into, later blamed it all on people who weren't even with her at the time - no one has bothered with her during holidays since. [Since that day, back when she asked: I'm busy, thanks. Have plans, thanks. Hope you have a good day. Thanks. Now it's never mentioned other than the most basic holiday greetings, and I'm okay with that.] Yes, she's 80+ and by herself, and you know what? She chose that. That's one I've not backed down on. Show your ass for no good reason and turn a holiday into a massacre, I'm not going back for another round.

Good luck really! Hang in there and do what's best for YOU.

[nanotech]

URGH!! Try and keep reminding yourself [and him if needed] it's MARCH. You haven't even decided what, if anything, you're doing for Easter or Fourth of July yet. Give it a rest already! AND who knows, y'all just might decide to do something crazy and new and travel for the holidays!! If your daughter gets guilted into inviting him, that's her choice. Not something you can or should manage for her, and you're also not responsible for any fallout from him.

All this said, I've declined and/or essentially blanked the past 10-12 Christmases/holiday seasons with mine. She had an epic meltdown one Christmas day and dragged three of her four children into, later blamed it all on people who weren't even with her at the time - no one has bothered with her during holidays since. [Since that day, back when she asked: I'm busy, thanks. Have plans, thanks. Hope you have a good day. Thanks. Now it's never mentioned other than the most basic holiday greetings, and I'm okay with that.] Yes, she's 80+ and by herself, and you know what? She chose that. That's one I've not backed down on. Show your ass for no good reason and turn a holiday into a massacre, I'm not going back for another round.

Good luck really! Hang in there and do what's best for YOU.

Thanks so much Moglow.
This thread has been such a great help. It's helped to clarify what to do, and what not to do. Thanks for the validation, the reflection and the superb advice! 
Moglow, I've thought about saying 'We'll be away'. Then hubby said, why  don't we actually book somewhere, and let's really have a break- we can see our own family over the holiday, as in our kids and grandkids, but also take a break, just us!

[p123]

Nano - so he treats you like crap then invites himself for xmas?

Wow thats nuts. I've got a real thing about people inviting themselves.....

Your Dad and mine are very similar I think. Both seem to do things as  a "test" sometimes to make it as awkward as possible just so you know you're place.

Yes, P123, I reckon that's true. He also seems to be getting more blatant as he gets older! Or perhaps I'm just seeing it more quickly now. The main thing is, I don't have the strong immediate reactions of fear, obligation and guilt that I used have several years ago. I see you doing this too, saying no early.
I'm so pleased I actually laughed!  He didn't, of course. He just got more intense, insisting on how much he dislikes having to see, and socialise with, my GCNBrother's in-laws.  Despite favouring my brother in every way possible-both parents did- a big part of that favouring is that my brother has become the power base for the FOO.  I know, it's really messed up. It's something my BPD mum started. Mum used to be the power base, and the Nbrother used to triangulate through her. Once she passed, my dad paid homage to mum by totally deferring to him. But brother can't get to me through mum any more, so he now tries to manipulate me through a niece, or sometimes through dad. It doesn't work as well.
So he moved to social media. 


But I'm not on there with him any more.
 
My dad doesn't dare challenge him on anything. He can't possibly upset him by sharing his negative reactions on sister in law's ( also narcissistic) parents. The pretence must continue, and Nbrother and his choices must not be challenged. He's the Golden Child.
So instead, I am to ' fix it' and  provide him with a polite excuse not to attend Nbrother's home on Christmas Day. Plus he knows will be well fed and well looked after by us, of course! This is how we've been for years. Discarded, then rolled out to provide a gold standard  service, then discarded again. Days after we'd done this three years ago, I rang him, and dad was back to his old sarky, dismissive arrogance. He'd got his way and now he didn't need us for the present moment.
But Dad keeps forgetting, I don't take this abuse any more. 

The trouble is, if I categorically say no now, he's going to ask my daughter to invite him! He mentioned her too. I think it was intentional. ( If you don't say yes, I'll bother your child!).
Blackmail really. 
He was invited once to my daughter's for Christmas,and it was really hard work. We were there too. He kept telling the children to be quiet. One was just a baby at the time! I could go on. There was a lot of stuff - I don't want to go through it again.
My daughter is kind, and she  hasn't been brought up by him. She's aware of what I've been through with my family, but sometimes her kindness is all, and she only sees a waify 90 year old man looking for Christmas cheer. He might get round her. This could be problematic.
If he does go there, we won't. We  will see her on a different day. That might be enough to put him off going. It's me he's after- plus our catering, which he knows he'd get if we were going.  ( we do most of the food) .He can't really be micro aggressive with my daughter, at least not in the same ways he can be with me.
Sigh.They enjoy it. They need it. They especially feel entitled to do it during holiday times.
I'm going to say no nearer the time. If he's gobsmacked, iI will remind him that I hadn't said yes to begin with. A big fat no with no jading. 
Just realised when writing this. Before it even existed, my BPD mum used to actually BE my GCNbrother's social media. No wonder PDs adore Facebook.

Good for you nano - its an awful situation there.....

I'll be rooting for you nearer xmas!

I do cheat a bit at xmas. Wifes a nurse so I tell him shes working. I shouldnt JADE but it shuts him up.

[moglow]

Do it! You've got plenty of time to get reservations and travel plans in place, and don't have to detail any of that for him. No explanations or excuses, you're adults and made your own plans as you should. MAYBE your plan is to staycation and just enjoy the peace together!!

[p123]

URGH!! Try and keep reminding yourself [and him if needed] it's MARCH. You haven't even decided what, if anything, you're doing for Easter or Fourth of July yet. Give it a rest already! AND who knows, y'all just might decide to do something crazy and new and travel for the holidays!! If your daughter gets guilted into inviting him, that's her choice. Not something you can or should manage for her, and you're also not responsible for any fallout from him.

All this said, I've declined and/or essentially blanked the past 10-12 Christmases/holiday seasons with mine. She had an epic meltdown one Christmas day and dragged three of her four children into, later blamed it all on people who weren't even with her at the time - no one has bothered with her during holidays since. [Since that day, back when she asked: I'm busy, thanks. Have plans, thanks. Hope you have a good day. Thanks. Now it's never mentioned other than the most basic holiday greetings, and I'm okay with that.] Yes, she's 80+ and by herself, and you know what? She chose that. That's one I've not backed down on. Show your ass for no good reason and turn a holiday into a massacre, I'm not going back for another round.

Good luck really! Hang in there and do what's best for YOU.

Wish I could be more like you MoGlow!!!!

Like I said I JADE by making excuses that wife is working. I shouldnt.
Last year was the 1st year he spent alone - I was proud of that - like you said, they do it to themselves.

After having Dad EVERY xmas for 15 years (and his behaviour getting worse and worse), brother had him for one year (remember he lives a mile away and has no kids, I live 20+ miles) and now wont have him. He tries every trick in the book - this year it was "we're having greek food, Dad won't like it, you'll have to have him". I dont speak to brother but he passed this message via Dad. I replied "Wife working, we're not having xmas dinner, I'll be there Boxing Day".

[moglow]

P123 it was a heavy price to pay - md was invited to brother's that Christmas, first time in several years we were all meeting there. At "lunchtime" she called and said she had car trouble and wasn't going to be able to make it. That made no sense, I'd talked to brother who was driving her earlier that day, he said they should be able to make it in plenty of time.

Turned out they'd been driving around our town since 930am. She turned a lunch invitation into "let's leave really early, it'll be fine." Then she didn't knock on the door, ring the doorbell, nothing but a call from the driveway that wasn't answered because brother was in the shower and didn't hear his phone.I still remember the look on brother/host's face and the way he said "this will never happen again" after he got off the phone with her.

Yet she was mad at US, that no one knew she was in town or greeting her in the driveway some four hours early. Went completely sideways in her own mind, decimating everything in her path for months on that one. To this day I have no idea what set her off or why she was unable to just apologize for the way she melted down all over everyone and move on. Her version of events that I've heard from others since is somewhat different from reality ... she was attacked. She was mistreated. She was ostracized.