Today's emergency - underwear

Sneezy · August 14, 2022, 04:32:51 PM

This is getting ridiculous. Mom just keeps throwing things at the wall to see what sticks. A couple weeks ago it was a picture that she needed me to come over and re-hang for her right away. I did not make a special trip to re-hang her picture, but when I went over to see her today, I took care of that for her. Five minutes later, she threw the next "need" at me. She needs me to set aside an hour and take her to the mall because she needs underwear. I hate shopping and I really hate the mall. And when mom says "an hour" she is not counting my travel time to her apartment, travel time to the mall, lunch after shopping, travel time back, me carrying all her purchases up to her apartment, etc. So her "one hour" is really four to five hours of my time.

So, being smart, and remembering all the tactics and tools from this page, I sweetly (sort of) offered to help her log in to her favorite store and order underwear. I mean, she's been buying the same underwear in the same size from the same store for years. But oh no, that won't do - she must see the underwear before purchasing it. I simply said no, I didn't have time to go to the mall this week. Then the pouting started. And worse, now I'm sitting at home stewing about it. Because I must be the worst daughter in the world for not taking my mother to the mall to buy underwear. How awful of me to let an old lady suffer without underwear. A good daughter would cancel meetings, drop other commitments, and do something she really dislikes if her mother needed underwear, right?

How does she keep doing this to me? No, wait - the better question is why do I keep doing this to myself? Why am I sitting her feeling guilty about my mother's underwear dilemma? I offered several times to order underwear for her. That's enough, right? And she has several options to get herself to the mall if that's really what she wants to do. Ugh!!! This is not about underwear, of course. It's about manipulation and guilt and mom wanting to snap her fingers and have me do something I dislike just because she demands it. Oh, and I'll bet if I checked her dresser, she doesn't really need underwear. I need to make this stop.

Poison Ivy · August 14, 2022, 05:12:52 PM

Two steps forward, one step back. You're doing well, Sneezy. Keep it up, and it will become easier.

moglow · August 14, 2022, 06:14:37 PM

As you said, it wouldn't be setting aside an hour. It would be a large chunk out of your otherwise productive day. If she needs, that can be met in other ways - online ordering is quick and simple, drop shipped right to her door. A want isnt quite the same thing.

I understand she's lonely and bored. As we'vesaid before, that's the life she built. Actions have consequences.

Cat of the Canals · August 14, 2022, 07:44:03 PM

What Poison Ivy said. You've come so far, but it's not a particularly pleasant journey. Actually, it sucks, frankly! But it does get easier the more you do it.

I just read a book about boundaries, and the author said: when you first start telling people "no," you are going to feel bad and want to take it back. She says to wait 48 hours and see how you feel then. If the boundary was a healthy one, you'll almost always have moved past the regret and come to see the boundary as necessary.

SunnyMeadow · August 15, 2022, 08:30:26 AM

What Cat wrote about the boundaries book and waiting 48 hours makes a lot of sense. I had huge guilt for the first few days after setting a boundary with my mother. I would rehash it over and over to the point of making me wonder if I had lost my marbles. I wasn't supposed to tell my mom no!

Sneezy, you're 100% right about this not being a quick trip to the mall. It would be a long drawn out afternoon and you'd be captive in the car, the store, the restaurant. Ugh, I can feel the anxiety from here. The thing is you offered a very efficient solution to her NEEDING more underwear. It's fuel efficient, time efficient and effort efficient!

Too bad she doesn't see it that way.

Sneezy · August 15, 2022, 10:07:22 AM

I almost didn't post this because it seemed so trivial. But I'm glad I did, because you all have led me to the answer and the lightbulb has gone on

It's not the shopping or even the overly-dramatic "need" for underwear. It's the time that I would be captive to her negativity and complaints. It would be four to five hours of mom dumping all her bad feelings on me. No wonder my chest was tight and my stomach was in knots just thinking about it.

If I decide to spend a longer chunk of time with my mom, we have to be doing something (movie, concert, speaker, etc.) where she can't dump on me non-stop the whole time. That's the real problem, although the time itself can also be a problem when I'm busy at work and mom doesn't respect my time. And mom and I are very different when it comes to shopping - she likes to meander and I am more of a "get in and get out" kind of shopper.

The last time I took mom shopping was six months ago and it was awful. I can't go off and do my own shopping. She uses a walker and so I end up following her around and holding things for her and waiting outside the dressing room in case she needs help. I am her captive servant the entire time. And the whole time, all she does is complain and say nasty things about everybody and everything. It's mentally exhausting to be her dumping ground for even 20 minutes, much less hours at a time. That's what I need to be aware of and that's where I need to draw my boundaries.

lkdrymom · August 15, 2022, 06:00:37 PM

Wow, it sounds like you were taking my grandmother out shopping. The old 'just an hour'... because what monster would deny their parent an hour, right?

When my father lived on his own he'd want me to go to lunch with him. I was a government worker and only got 30 minutes for lunch so I would have to use vacation time for these long lunches my father wanted and I dreaded. My mom died of cancer so every conversation with my father started "I think I have cancer..." Seriously it was a running joke, cancer of the month club....what cancer will he come up with this month? I would time him to see how long it took him to bring up the subject...his personal best was 45 seconds. Just when you think it couldn't get worse, it does. 10 years of cancer discussions finally ended when he found a new subject....bowel movements. How I wish we went back to the happy cancer talks. You can't imagine how many times I snapped at him that bowel movements was not an acceptable discussion in the middle of a restaurant. It got to a point where I had to take my father shopping every other week. Pure torture. Then he'd make me feel guilty for not wanting to take him out to dinner afterward. I could barely survive the shopping trips, I didn't want to add another 90 minutes for dinner (and this is after I worked all day).

After he moved to AL he would try and get me to take him shopping. It was just too much. He could barely walk. Had to strap him in the car myself, then collapse his walker and fit that in my car. I was always worried he'd fall in some parking lot (and if that happened I had plans to use that as an excuse to never take him out again). Then I would have to put him back in the car and get him safely back to AL and to his apartment while lugging the 5 gallons of ice cream he wanted. He'd want me to go and get him several fleet enemas...you know that conversation. I finally realized Amanzon was my friend and I would order things for him rather than have me run all over the place.

My suggestion....order her a pack of underwear and call it a day.

p123 · August 16, 2022, 03:49:26 AM

yeh OP been there done that. As you know its a scam just to get you there...

Dad does it with food shopping "I've got no food in the house". He refuses to get it delivered "Oh I dont want a stranger knocking my door".
All sorts of stupid excuses.

bloomie · August 16, 2022, 09:05:53 AM

First of all you all are cracking me up with these stories!!! And you are so right, Sneezy it most certainly is not about the underwear.

I wanted to back up to the discomfort that you feel when you say no to your mom. I know that feeling all too well. For me, I had to recognize that I need to strengthen my ability to live with the uncomfortable feelings that come up when I set a boundary with someone (especially an elderly parent) that they do not like or attempt to circumvent.

The choice is.. spend most of a day doing something you could accomplish (or your mother could accomplish) with a few clicks that is not a productive use of your time and that is fairly miserable for you, or save the investment of time spent with her doing something together that is in a setting that allows you to not be so drained afterwards.

Your mother may not value your time, but you do. Your mother may enjoy browsing and shopping, but you do not. It is truly not more complicated than two people whose priorities do not align and there is no moral or obligatory value in that. It is simply a kind 'no" and here are your options to get your needs met, mom... kind of interaction that people who were raised in good enough homes by reasonably healthy people navigate every single day without angst.

We can get there as well. That is what we are here to do together.

nanotech · August 16, 2022, 09:52:56 AM

Quote from: Cat of the Canals on August 14, 2022, 07:44:03 PM
What Poison Ivy said. You've come so far, but it's not a particularly pleasant journey. Actually, it sucks, frankly! But it does get easier the more you do it.

I just read a book about boundaries, and the author said: when you first start telling people "no," you are going to feel bad and want to take it back. She says to wait 48 hours and see how you feel then. If the boundary was a healthy one, you'll almost always have moved past the regret and come to see the boundary as necessary.

Lots of good advice on here. Cat's comments on boundaries- yes to the waiting 48 hours then looking again to see if it was a healthy one- usually is.
The reason why we say yes so much is to avoid that initial stab of guilt and feel good about saying yes. We feel approved of in that moment. But hey if it isn't just setting us up for a far more difficult time, with a lot more stress and disapproval coming our way.
Well done for standing firm! Plenty of knickers on the internet!

moglow · August 16, 2022, 10:36:41 AM

The challenge for me was seeing the "needs" for what they were up front, and learning to back away from my initial gut reaction. Sitting on it, not responding either yea or nay until I've had a chance to think it through [and 48 hours seems perfectly reasonable about 95% of the time], and it seemed more often than not that "need" was dropped. At least for then. When I reacted and immediately shot off all the reasons I couldn't or wasn't available until xyz or even politely said No, I gave her something to chew on, debate, negotiate or argue.

I had to learn to not give her any ammo, because she would use it every time. Even as minute as putting her off because "right now" or the day she requested I was doing [insert reason here] and I'd get a barrage of What about now? Can you do it now? What about this weekend? Can we plan on...? I'd offer alternatives when I had them available and if she shot them down, oh well. I guess it's not needed.

You're not on call 24/7, not a hotline or an emergency room. You don't have to state it to her but you may want to reinforce that within yourself. LIVE your boundaries! [I'm deeply attached to do not disturb and silent/no notifications on my cell phone - has saved me many a time!]