Advice for counter-parenting?

[gfuertes]

I've been puzzling over my 14-y-o HS freshman son's progression from *choosing* to sign up for challenging honors and AP classes, to pursue his school's Honors diploma (he was an honors student, and skipped a grade in math, during middle school)... to saying he wants to defer college until after a career in the military, or trades... to a complete, hostile aversion to any college, ever - even a trade school or associate degree. I'm fine with the military or a trade, but he refuses to even meet with a member of the military, or a person in a trade he likes, to hear *from them* whether any education past HS would benefit him. It's illogical, and he's a pretty logical person.

His dad is a diagnosed sociopath who went to prison 4 yrs ago for business-related fraud that involved seducing his older sons - both of whom dropped out of college - into working for him, then involving them in crimes (without their knowledge,) such as by laundering money through an account in one of their names, asking them to collect and distribute ill-gotten money for him, to/from "friends/clients", and forging other family members' signatures on federal documents. He spent his entire adult life telling everyone he graduated from the Air Force Academy, until it came out at trial that he never went to college, which was named as part of his fraud (convincing people to invest money in his company based in part on false representations of his credentials.) Since prison, he's managed to land two good jobs but was fired from both after a year or less.

So one of two things is true:
- He continued lying about his credentials to get those jobs, but was discovered and fired. (That he lied about college is an easy fact to discover - without looking for it - by Googling him. It's mentioned in a brief, online summary of his case at the Federal Appellate level.)
- And/or it's true that a person like him will always have trouble following rules and getting along with others enough to maintain stable employment...*and should not be a young man's main/sole source of advice about his own future career path.*

Our son does not know what a scary roller-coaster finances were, during our marriage, because of his dad; nor the extent to which his dad was responsible for our dire financial circumstances after he went to prison. Son does not appreciate that I have steadily but slowly built a stable small business with long-term clients and primarily word-of-mouth advertising from happy customers, that supports us; and that I don't brag about things like saving for a boat because my financial goals are long-term, responsible, and (for now) focus on Son. Son mainly resents when I say something's too expensive, and takes it for granted when I manage to come up with money for what I consider important. His dad makes pie-in-the-sky promises, but hasn't been back in the picture long enough for Son to realize how infrequently he follows through, and what things get sacrificed when he does splurge.

Last night, my son volunteered that his increasing disinterest in college is largely or solely due to his dad bragging to him about how he's had a great career and made lots of money, and didn't need college to do it. Part of that presentation included showing Son Dad's routine big deposits in an account where he's allegedly saving for a yacht.

My thoughts - most of which I realize it would be inappropriate to share with Son - include all the obvious ones, as well as:

- Rage, honestly.  My ex hid large sums of money from me (including my entire, modest life savings, which he transferred to his own account without my knowledge, and then emptied, back when I still trusted him,) both during the marriage, and during our divorce. He refused to submit his financials, or show up to testify. And he lied about quitting his job right before our final, so child support would be based on guesswork. Then the day the Income Withholding Order was delivered to his employer, he *actually* quit his job, and claims to be unemployed even while his excuses for periodically missing his parenting time are that he's working.  With all that, he's bragging to our son about his big income, and boat savings plan?!

- Grave concern (based on numerous, subtle things, and Ex's history with his older sons {my step-sons}) that Ex intends to lure our son into working for him after HS. The less education Son pursues, the narrower his prospects will be, so the easier it will be for him to accept what sounds like a good offer from his dad. My ex is pumping our son full of anti-government political rhetoric to subtly suggest that Ex didn't commit any actual crime anyone should be concerned about; instead, the corrupt FBI, federal prosecutors and judge conspired to victimize Ex. You might think Son - when he's older - would be skeptical about working for a dad who spent part of Son's childhood in prison for fraud, but Ex is giving Son an alternate object for his mistrust.

- I want to tell Son he hasn't seen Ex's résumè, and has no idea whether Ex got his jobs since prison *despite* not having a degree, or whether he lied and said he did have one; and that he lied on every job application, for decades before he went to prison. So his life has hardly happened in spite of a college degree. It's happened because of a degree he didn't actually bother to earn.  Again, Son doesn't have to go to college. But he shouldn't decide based on a grossly distorted representation of his father as some big success story.

Last night I just wanted to pull my own hair out, and spent a good deal of time crying in my car (in the driveway) after Son went to bed.

What is it OK to tell my son, and how could I phrase it?

[Penny Lane]

Oh yikes this is really alarming!

I am normally strongly in favor of not volunteering information that makes the PD look bad. Let the kids figure it out on their own.

However, in this case I think you do need to tell him. 1. Your son has no idea his dad is lying to him and 2. He's making really serious life choices based on those lies.

If it were me, I think I would sit him down, once, and tell him as little as possible that still gets across the point.

I think the main thing your son needs to know is that his dad isn't making all this money in spite of the fact he didn't go to college; to your knowledge, he has listed on his resume that he graduated from college to get all his previous jobs. If your son asks why he would do that if he doesn't have a college degree, you can just say, I'm not sure, and it's certainly something I would do.

I think it makes sense to delicately warn him that his father went to prison for financial related crimes, and you're concerned about the idea of him following in his dad's footsteps. This requires a very light touch, and he will probably get mad, but maybe it'll sink in.

I don't think your son needs to know how much his dad screwed you financially. Not that your ex deserves the protection from you. Just, your son is having to process a lot of information about his dad and you don't need to add more, especially since it's not directly relevant to your goal.

This conversation will be tough, he won't like it, BUT I think he deserves to know. After one conversation you can drop it, he has the information and it needs some time to percolate.

I also think when he's older you might consider telling him what his dad did to his older brothers. I think there's a high likelihood that his dad will try to do it to him too, and at least he'll be going in with more open eyes.

Longer term - and I think in many ways this is more important - I think you can send some positive messages to counteract his dad's lies.

Involve him more in your finances. Not like amounts. But talk about why you bought this, why you didn't buy that. When you're saving up for something, make sure your son knows when you buy it what went into the saving. Even things like, why you buy insurance and what insurance is used for. Basically talk through how to be a financially responsible person. He might say he's not listening, but some of it will get through.

Talk about your feelings too, how good it feels to have a stable income, how much less stress there is when you know you can count on your paycheck coming in. That you are glad you put the work into your career, and good decisions you made earlier on that set you up for success.

Talk about college and what you enjoyed about it and what you see as the pros and cons to getting a degree. How would your life be if you had chosen differently? If you went to college, did you like it?

When he's feeling less defensive, ask him what he sees himself doing? What are his goals in life? What is he interested in? Does he want a career that's a passion or one that will make a lot of money? Why is or isn't money important to him? Asking him to look inside himself, and beyond just the surface, can get him thinking beyond what his dad is saying. You can also share with him what you see as his strengths, things he could capitalize on to have long term success (however he defines that). And not just academically but personality and emotionally, is he driven? Resilient? Perceptive? Kind? Let him know that you SEE him.

This is not easy, and it will take a lot of time to counteract his dad. But the good news is you have a lot of time. I really do think one big conversation, plus months or years of presenting a positive alternative to his dad's worldview, will put him back on the right course (aka anything that doesn't involve him getting scammed by his dad).

[hhaw]

I've seen other PD parent's try to talk their children out of university and higher education. 

My oldest dd's best friend was even more committed to university bc of her unPD mother's relentless snide remarks and opinions about educated people.