Wife vs. son: I am the man in the middle (again)

[IsleOfSong]

I am once again struggling to navigate the gulf between my wife and our 17-year-old son, who has one more year of high school before he goes off to university. It's always been tense between them (he's her scapegoat child while our daughter is her golden child), but the latest issue between them is the SAT test — he absolutely does not want to take it, whereas she's pushing him to do it. Mind you, the test is no longer required at ANY of the schools he's interested in applying to, but some kids submit SAT scores anyway, particularly if they've done well.

My son, who is very intelligent, has not fared well on standardized tests in the past and has an understandable fear of not doing well again. My wife is convinced that if our son doesn't do the test, he'll be at some sort of disadvantage when it comes to admissions because other kids will submit them optionally. She's a "sky is falling" type of worrier, whereas I'm more laid-back and tend to think that things will work out in the long run. She has set him up with an SAT tutor, but he's confided in me that it's something he absolutely doesn't want to do, nor does he see the value in it.

As for me, I'm walking the tightrope as usual, listening to his well-reasoned venting on why he shouldn't have to take the test if it's of no relevance to his applications, and her insistence that "with a little coaching" he could do well on the test. The stress on me is tremendous, and I am honestly not sure how to proceed. I would like our son to present a clear argument to us both on why he shouldn't have to take the test, including the stress it will put on him, but I also don't want to endure a blowup if/when his mom pushes back on his reasoning.

Ugh.

[notrightinthehead]

This is complicated. I understand your wife's position - he can take the test now, when everybody does it, and maybe it will be useful to him later. Maybe he will never need it. Maybe with a little coaching he can overcome his exam anxiety.
I can understand your son's position - he doesn't do well in tests, he doesn't need the result, he wants to stand up to his mother, and he wants you to be on his side.

What is your position? Do you think he should sit for the test? Do you want to encourage him to stand up to his mother or do want him to give in and keep his head down?

If I were in your position, I would give my opinion, just as the other two do, and then I would take a stand and declare either that I feel my son is old enough to make such decisions, concerning his own life only, for himself. And I respect and support his decision. Or that I feel that sitting for the SAT does no harm and could turn out as useful later, and he should do it. But whatever he does, I am fully behind him and will support his decision.

Remember - you are responsible for your own behaviour only. If the other two want to fight, they will.

[Defiantdaughter1]

He could take the test much later. It doesn't have to happen now.

I wasn't a good test-taker myself.

Some students have an enormous amount of anxiety about these things. It's usually the result of too much pressure.

Often, part of the problem is comparing kids to their siblings. 

[IsleOfSong]

What is your position? Do you think he should sit for the test? Do you want to encourage him to stand up to his mother or do want him to give in and keep his head down?

Honestly, I see the logic in him not taking it. From what I see on the admissions pages of the schools he's interested in, an SAT score is truly not necessary. It can be useful if the student does extremely well on the test, which honestly is very unlikely given what he says is his weakness in math, and his overall desire not to take the test to begin with.

His mental health matters as well. And while his self-confidence is fairly low overall (likely the result of having a narcissistic, controlling parent who's never satisfied), I don't see the point of stressing him out with test prep over the next few months, and then the test itself, when it's not needed and he's got a very strong academic record to begin with.

The problem boils down to me (and him) having to deal with his mother. I guess he and I need to get comfortable dealing with the worst-case scenario, which is her saying he's making a huge mistake and will never amount to much, and me being told I'm too soft on him and "undermining" her. It's the fear of that inevitable blow-up that's stressing me and my son out.

[IsleOfSong]

Also, there's a part of me that wishes he'd just suck it up and take the test, relieving the pressure on both of us — and results be damned. If they suck, he doesn't have to do a thing with them.

[IsleOfSong]

Some students have an enormous amount of anxiety about these things. It's usually the result of too much pressure.

Often, part of the problem is comparing kids to their siblings. 

True. On a related note, his older sister did extremely well on the SAT and is at one of the best universities in the country. So there may be that pressure, even though neither I nor his mother expect him to follow in his sister's footsteps at all. He may be putting that comparison-driven pressure on himself.

[Call Me Cordelia]

If there's a long-standing GC and SG dynamic, the comparison doesn't need to be explicit. It's there. My sister and I navigated it growing up by a mutual understanding that we just didn't encroach on each other's "turf." The GC and SG roles could and did flip arbitrarily between us, with me mostly the SG but not always. So we created order ourselves. If one is the academic one, the other plays small enough to do well enough to escape punishment but not outshine or in any way at all seem to be possibly competing. Athletics? Music? Popularity and social acumen? Same deal. So between the two of us we had one well-rounded person. I at least had defined areas where I knew I was able to succeed. It's messed up but it was adaptive in that it saved us both a lot of grief from our parents pitting us against each other. When both of us had no choice but to do a thing, it was really hard for my younger sister because she always had to follow my act. So she would try to sabotage me or else majorly outshine me. I took the tack of antagonizing dad at times, she became his best buddy. These dynamics are so pervasive, complex, and inescapable so it's really unfair to say your son is "putting the pressure on himself" here.

You're split between the part of you that is rationally seeing your son's case and the codependent part that just wants to appease your wife for a moment. The pressure to appease mom has been a lifelong constant. I say good for your son taking charge of decisions impacting his own future despite all that pressure and doing what is best for him. He's really in a double-bind here, as far as mom goes. If he is the scapegoat, there's no way he's going to be allowed to win. Sign up for the test and appease mom for a moment, and then have the rigmarole of the tutor and the study pressure to get worthless results that aren't going to be good enough anyway. Don't sign up, rip off the bandaid and deal with a blowup and being told he won't amount to much. That's just another day with mom, from the sound of things. At least that's how I'm reading the situation.

[square]

For what it's worth, I'm team #noSAT.

It sounds like the cost (high stress over a prolonged time, study hours wasted where more productive and mental health-supporting activities could be pursued, unlikely positive outcome, and added weight of shame and frustration at the end) doesn't come near the potential benefit, which at most might mean he is accepted to one additional college, but much more likely just to be a total waste.

I don't have any parental experience on this, because in my house my husband would absolutely put his foot down if I pushed for DD to take the SAT. (Which I wouldn't.)

But I can speak to how my husband would have felt if he was in your son's position. Not saying your son is having an experience like my husband did, hopefully not. But my husband has some pretty significant lifelong trauma around feeling dumb because of his experience testing poorly and not fitting in academically. He is very intelligent but has an enormous amount of anxiety around these subjects. He is terrified, for example, to apply for jobs because one time back in the 90s a retail chain made him take some test as part of their screening.

Anyway, not trying to conflate your son's situation with my husband's, but when I read this I think I would go to bat on this one. I'm very conflict avoidant and have sidestepped some ridiculous things just to avoid conflict. But there are some things I will take the gloves off for, and this would be one for me. It's a lot of pressure for a kid to take on for very little potential gain. I'm sure your son would feel a tremendous amount of relief from his father backing him up solidly here.

I understand your wife will catastrophize and that will be frustrating. Will she take revenge in some way on your son, or will she otherwise harm your son beyond flipping out bigtime (and granted probably bring it up over and over again)?

[IsleOfSong]

I understand your wife will catastrophize and that will be frustrating. Will she take revenge in some way on your son, or will she otherwise harm your son beyond flipping out bigtime (and granted probably bring it up over and over again)?

Thanks, square (and everyone), for the thoughtful replies. Square, you have a knack for putting into words the feelings that I'm feeling, whether I realize what I'm feeling at my core or not. Thanks for outlining a clear list of the cons (vs. the one tentative pro, at best) when it comes to the issue of my son taking the SAT.

Yes, wife will catastrophize and feel like son and I are ganging up on her. She will say that our son will be at a disadvantage, she will say that he's afraid of challenging himself, she will suggest that he won't get in anywhere, and I know all of this to be untrue. She will likely say all this to me with him nearby, so he gets to overhear her saying it. She may also likely punish me with silence or what have you for "undermining" her.

My son already feels that she doesn't like him all that much. In fact, right now, he's out pretending to be seeing friends, since if he stays in the house she will berate him for sitting around the house. If he views this SAT situation as him "causing" a rift between his parents, I fear that he'll blame himself. He's in a double-bind to be sure, but so am I. I guess at the end of the day, it's a question of how much of her BS am I (and him, by proxy) willing to endure. It's such a poop sandwich, this whole thing.

[square]

Yes, wife will catastrophize and feel like son and I are ganging up on her.

You know this, but supporting your son is not ganging up on her, nor is having a different parenting view ganging up on her. She would like to gang up on your son or you.

If you decide to take a stand on this, it will still be a very uneven score on how many times she got her way.

She will say that our son will be at a disadvantage, she will say that he's afraid of challenging himself, she will suggest that he won't get in anywhere, and I know all of this to be untrue.

Fine.

She will likely say all this to me with him nearby, so he gets to overhear her saying it.

Later:

"I know your mom is pretty anxious about this, but I think you have a good plan and I know you're going to find your own way. You're a good kid. Let me know if you need any help with the application process."

She may also likely punish me with silence or what have you for "undermining" her.

I know it's stressful and hurtful to get this kind of treatment. It may feel worthwhile if you see yourself as taking the hit so your son doesn't have to shoulder it alone. We're all here for you and cheering you on whatever you decide to do.

There are a couple of ways to deal with the stress of the silent treatment. One is to not hang around for it. Be busy, run errands, go for a jog, put in more hours at work. Granted, in some households this may be heavily policed and the PD may escalate.

The other tactic is simply to get it set in your mind that you're FINE. You didn't do anything you need to feel bad about, and she's being childish. You can feel a bit sorry for how small she's being while you are standing tall like an adult. You can be in your house and talk to the kids like nothing is wrong. Laugh with them.

Find a person, real or fictional, that you admire, who would be unfazed by this, and step into their shoes, take on their superpower.

We're with you, IsleOfSong 💪

[escapingman]

IsleOfSong, I am not sure exactly how your wife is but if she is anything like my ex you can't win. Force your son do to the SAT and there will soon be something else he is doing wrong.

I was in your situation and I tried my hardest to manipulate and control everybody including my kids to fit in to the narrative and not to upset uNPDxw. It doesn't work, I remember begging the kids when they were very little to just bloody do whatever for us all to be spared another blow up. uNPDxw pitted the kids against each other and she clearly had one GC and one SG. Towards the end it was so bad for SG that she begged me to be out of the house with her all the time as she could not function in the house.

We are two years out now, DD is close to 6 months NC with her mum and she is THRIVING. When she gets a message from her mum she doesn't even read it and definitely not replying. She was always put down and told she isn't good enough and that her sister always was the better one. Now she has the confidence to go and try for academic talent teams in her sport.

On another note it breaks my heart to see my other DD stuck in the past and not being able to break free. She is still doing well academically as that's what her mum expects of her - but everything else is falling apart.

So I say, back your son. He doesn't want to do it so don't force him just to please your wife.

[bloomie]

he's got a very strong academic record to begin with

IsleofSong - you describe an almost (very close to) adult son who is positioned to continue his education with a strong academic record and is making the choice to not sit for SAT's. It seems your son is protecting his peace of mind and willing to take a stand in that. 

I say this ever so gently, but from the bit I know sitting on this side of the screen, this is not about your wife's comfort, your comfort, or your son pleasing either of you or making things easier by just doing it. This is not about coping with dysfunctional and damaging fall out from your son exercising his human right to pass on something and make a decision that is not harmful, illegal, dangerous, or disrespectful to either of you.

It is about your son's autonomy and willingness to make a decision that is best and right for him. This is part of how we separate and individuate and potentially kowtowing to a mother because no one wants to withstand her displeasure is a dangerous precedent to set for a young man who is ready and willing to launch.

Whatever decision your son (who sounds like a very fine person) makes in his life, he is the one who will primarily experience the consequences. At this point in his development, having raised a fine young man myself, the job becomes empowering and making space for our almost adult children to make these kinds of decisions for themselves.

Learning to live with his mother's displeasure when he makes a decision she doesn't agree with is part of your son's work and journey. And yes, it is a potentially painful journey. Listening to the thoughts and wisdom of both parents and then deciding what to do in this situation, and many others to come, for himself, is something we all have to learn to do and you can be a light for him in the midst of it.

He has made this decision. Stand with him. My best thoughts on this.

[IsleOfSong]

Thanks, bloomie. My son is indeed a very fine person.

My hope is that he shares with us both that he's made this decision, vs. telling me only as we both commiserate about our shared plight of fearing her inevitable pouty, punitive response. Not that I blame him for confiding in me. It's an honor that he feels so comfortable with me, actually.

At the end of the day, yes, he has made his decision, and I will support it. As square said earlier, the cons of him pursuing the SAT test greatly outweigh any pros. He should take advantage of this opportunity to bypass the test, not exacerbate his feelings of inadequacy and frustration to please his largely impossible-to-keep-pleased mother.

I can ruminate on the fact that the cosmos gave him a bad fit for a mother, I can beat myself up for not neutralizing these situations instantly on his behalf, and so on.... but I am not responsible for her feelings. But I can at least let him know that I validate whatever frustration he feels about perpetually disappointing his mom and encourage him not to internalize it.

I've also reached out to a therapist for him, as he's started asking to resume therapy. I also have a therapy appointment later today and will talk this through with her. (Funny how my wife is the only one in the family not in therapy...)

I do like the idea of visualizing someone who can withstand the blowback without it getting to them. My late father comes to mind. He didn't suffer fools, and yet was very loving toward me.

[Rebel13]

You and/or your son could try using the Cope Ahead skill to prepare for your wife's reaction to this situation, or really anything.
https://dbt.tools/emotional_regulation/cope-ahead.php

[IsleOfSong]

You and/or your son could try using the Cope Ahead skill to prepare for your wife's reaction to this situation, or really anything.
https://dbt.tools/emotional_regulation/cope-ahead.php

I like this. Thank you! I can even see myself sharing it with my son.

[bloomie]

IsleofSong - it seems, from what you describe here, like you are already empowering yourself and your son in such tangible ways! So many of us here never had a safe parent to go to, or one that acknowledged the difficulty of living with a potentially disordered parent. Well done!!! 

[IsleOfSong]

IsleofSong - it seems, from what you describe here, like you are already empowering yourself and your son in such tangible ways! So many of us here never had a safe parent to go to, or one that acknowledged the difficulty of living with a potentially disordered parent. Well done!!! 

Thanks, bloomie. I'm doing my best to validate his feelings and be a voice (and presence) of relative calm and sanity. When he's 18, he can decide how to proceed with her.

We just got off the phone with a new therapist for our son. My wife dominated the conversation, listing out the things that she perceives as stuff the kid could work on in therapy... at one point in the call, the therapist said, "You sound like a wonderful mother." I am seriously thinking of calling the therapist back to give her some confidential backstory on how not "wonderful" my wife has been toward our son.

[Poison Ivy]

Hi, IsleofSong. I'm sorry you and your son are in this difficult situation. I have a question: What do you mean by, "When he's 18, he can decide how to proceed with her."? Why can't your son decide that now? I also have a suggestion: Encourage your son to work on things in therapy that he wants to work on.

[IsleOfSong]

Hi, IsleofSong. I'm sorry you and your son are in this difficult situation. I have a question: What do you mean by, "When he's 18, he can decide how to proceed with her."? Why can't your son decide that now? I also have a suggestion: Encourage your son to work on things in therapy that he wants to work on.

What I mean is that when he's 18, he can go to college as far away as he'd like and decide for himself how much or little he wants to have his mother in his life. Maybe it's more theoretical than anything else, but he'll have more options on who to spend his time with when that day comes.

Agreed on the therapy. I was thinking that it would be good to give the therapist a heads-up on the real issues between son and mother.

[Poison Ivy]

Thank you, IsleOfSong.