Pre-holidays anxiety

[walking on broken glass]

Hello everyone,

As the Christmas break is approaching, once more I am getting stressed about the decisions I will have to make about family.

Quick background: my sis is an uBPD who has targeted me all my life (rage, tantrums, obsession, love bombing and the cycle went on and on) and my parents were 100% complicit and enablers. I eventually went low contact with her, which was made easier by our living in different countries. My dad recently passed away and the interaction with my sis over those days surrounding and after his death was particularly painful. I haven't spoken to her since then, which I am very happy about.

But she will go back to my mum's place for sometime during the Christmas break, and I will be there too for a few days with my partner. I would like to know when exactly she plans to be there so as to avoid her and book for different days, but I don't want to get in touch with her to ask, plus she might lie to me. I asked my mum and she said she didn't know, which I find hard to believe because sis would need to book tickets early, as she lives in a different continent and tickets are expensive. Last year she came just after Christmas and stayed until after New Year's. If that's the plan again, we will go before Christmas and leave just after, when she arrives.

It is just really emotionally complicated this year because it's the first holiday without my dad and it will be difficult for everyone. Ideally I would like to stay home with my partner and our cat, and away from family. But I do feel sorry for my mum and I don't want her to be on her own, so the compromise I will make is to be there, if my sister isn't there. I am willing to go as far as coinciding for one day with sis, but definitely not living with her in my mum's place. We will go to a BnB in that case.

The problem is that I will definitely face backlash for not staying longer while sis is there, not just from mum but also from extended family. Everybody is in denial about sis: they will go as far as saying she is a bit of a loner or she has a temper etc but no one sees the situation for what it is. I wonder if I should be upfront this time and, when pressed, openly acknowledge that I can't get along with sis and that's that, instead of making up excuses, as I normally do (work, cat, partner's family etc). But is this the right time? Is it disrespectful to my mum's mourning? But then, what about my mourning and how I experience all this?

I am stressing about having a blueprint, a plan as to how to react when something like this comes up, but I know that in reality my reaction will depend on the moment and my mood. This is just my anxiety to be prepared and get it right, which I am sure is a familiar feeling to many people here.

The other thought I have is what if sis decides to go to my mum's place for the entirety of the holidays? What do I do then? It will be a nightmare to be there when she is there, even if we live in separate places. And I hate that my plan is dictated by her plans

[treesgrowslowly]

Hi walking,

This is very familiar territory for many of us here at Out of the FOG. Over the years, we have shared together about how to manage the holidays, given the FOG that our relatives are in about the PD.

The dilemma you face (if I am reading correctly) is that you want to show support for your mom during this time, with her grief, while also having good boundaries to deal with your sister's PD stuff.

It really depends on your relationship with your mum and what you would want to tell her, and how much you want to tell her right now, while she is grieving. As you said, this might not be the right time to give her that info about how you feel about PD sis.

I would definitely plan to stay at a BnB, and I'd be fine with giving the judgy relatives a white lie about why (as you have done before). I don't think it is bad for us to do this because we're dealing with people who are putting their nose in our business. It is not their business where we stay - we're adults now!

The PDs in my family lie all the time so I agree with you about that it is pointless to ask your sister when her visit dates are with mum. Who knows if she'll be honest with you. Lying about dates and times for visits is common in my messed up FOO - so I hear you on this for sure. It took me years to realize this was a tactic that all the PDs and FM's used to confuse and control everyone. Not saying when they were arriving, not saying how long they were staying, changing their dates and not telling us, they've done it all over the years. It creates unease and anxiety because no one is telling me anything I can rely on. Ugh right?

One thing you might consider is the possibility of a visit to spend time with your mum in January instead? Would you mum be open to that?

Trees

[walking on broken glass]

Thank you Trees
Yeah, there is no point in trying to get a solid travel plan from my BPD sis. I was just reminded that last year, when she found out that I would be leaving the day she was arriving (which, in that case, was a happy coincidence and not pre-meditated!) was really angry with me, and said to me that I can't be treating our parents' place like a hotel, coming and going whenever I felt like it. Oh the irony!

Anyway... I can definitely go and spend time with my mum at a different time and I have also invited her to visit me where I stay right now. (I have moved to a different country in Europe from the one I live with my partner, for work for a year; my mum lives in another country in Europe and sis in an altogether different continent). She decided she will visit sis in November (I am sure she feels sis needs her more, and she understands being needed, whereas she is awkward with me because I am a functioning adult), but she could easily come and visit me some other time. The problem is the bloody holidays: she won't be happy with me saying 'I will stay home for the holidays but will come to stay with you at a different time' because 'it's the holidays' and all the family should be together and it's important etc. etc. On the other hand, if I go back during holiday time, my partner can come with me, which is always a great comfort (he can't take time off work later). So ideally we would go a week before Christmas, stay for the Christmas day and go back home straight after. But if sis decides she will come home early for Christmas this year, we will have to change plans. I am not booking anything just now until we are more certain, but I wish I knew what we were doing because the uncertainty stresses me.

[Rebel13]

Hi WOBG! I'm having some similar stress, visiting my home area soon but not telling certain family members I will be there! First time ever!   

I am also a "planner" personality and uncomfortable with uncertainty, so I really feel your pain on this.

I'm just going to put a few questions here in case they help you, and I would really love to hear any specifics of what you ultimately do to help yourself plan, and contingency-plan, and comfort and take care of yourself through all of this.

• How long can you realistically wait to book your holiday trip? What can you do in the meantime to soothe the panic/stress of not-knowing?
• Can you tell your mom cheerfully, without bringing up the drama, "Please let me know when sis tells you her plans! That will help me make my own plans." And trust her to do it in time? Or "I need to know sis's info by X date, or I'll postpone our visit until another time." 
• Is it worth paying more for refundable reservations? So you could cancel last minute if your sister pulls some shenanigans you aren't comfortable with? Or move up your return if you want to?
• If you decided you'd rather visit after the holidays, without your partner, could you find a way to be OK with your mom's displeasure? (Especially since she'd be welcome to visit you anytime.)
• Can you book your trip for your preferred time, and if your sister shows up earlier than usual, just absent yourself? Relax at the BnB, do local things you enjoy until it's time to leave?
• If your relatives inquire why you are staying elsewhere, can you say, "Why do you ask?" If they make a comment, can you say "That's a rude thing to say"? I only say this because telling white lies about this stuff makes me feel weaselly, but if you're comfortable with polite evasion that's also fine.
• If you decided you were going to stay home, as you say you'd prefer, are there ways you can cope with the guilt you'd feel for not being with your mom? Can you visit via Zoom on the days your sister isn't there? (It seems like she helped with the tech so maybe phone if your mom can't manage video calls?) Can you do some creative thing like send a bunch of small meaningful gifts to arrive or open each day? Or a series of cards wherein you write a special memory of a time you spent with her and your dad?

This is also a great question that you ask yourself:

But then, what about my mourning and how I experience all this?

Yes, what about that? Your dad's death is a major event and it could make A LOT of sense that it sparks a rearrangement of "what we always do".

Sending you lots of good wishes about this!

[walking on broken glass]

Thanks so much Rebel for your thoughts! I liked the questions and I am considering possible answers. I think this is the trickiest one:

If you decided you'd rather visit after the holidays, without your partner, could you find a way to be OK with your mom's displeasure? (Especially since she'd be welcome to visit you anytime.)

I think this is what stresses me the most, the feeling of guilt for not doing what my mum would want me to do during a difficult time for her.

Also, if I ask her that I need to know my sister's plans in order to make my own plans, I will have to openly admit that I don't want to see her. I am sure my mum knows that deep down, but she is putting her head in the sand.

[Rebel13]

I think this is what stresses me the most, the feeling of guilt for not doing what my mum would want me to do during a difficult time for her.

Oh, that guilt is terrible. This reminds me of that saying "Worrying just means you suffer twice." If you feel the guilt, and then go and have to deal with your sister, you suffer twice. If you do what you want, and have a nice peaceful holiday, at least you only suffer once. 

[walking on broken glass]

I like that saying

Well if sis decides to spend both Christmas and New Year's at my mum's, there is no way we are going. At least that I know! We will only go if my mum is on her own. There is no way I am having Christmas dinner with sis, even the idea is giving me shivers.

[treesgrowslowly]

Hi again Walking,

You have a good handle on what you want and how you feel. That is a lot of work just to get that stuff sorted out so kudos to you for that! What I've learned about the PD family system over the years, a lot of it I learned from chatting with different people so that we could see the patterns that we are stuck in. And how to deal with it.

From what you wrote it sounds like you are worried about how to deal with the situation when your mom will ask you to be at Christmas dinner with her and your sister. Do you think your mom will ask you to be there that day?

There's a lot of FOG around holidays for families with a PD family member. It is understandable.

No matter what you end up doing this year, it was helpful for me to remind myself that we are not the root cause of this chaos and mess and FOG during the holidays...the person with the PD behavior is creating drama for everyone else (and themselves).

It sounds like the goal of your trip in December, if you end up going, is to spend some time with your mum, as this is her first holiday as a widow. The gift you want to give her is your presence.

Knowing that you would like to do this (for yourself and your mum) without having to spend December 25th with your sister is good to know. Some of us spend years realizing this stuff!

One realization I had about the holidays is to realize "I gave what i could". What I mean is, I look back and see that I brought what I wanted to bring to those holiday family visits. I brought my presence and my kindness.

I also refuse to spend Christmas dinner with someone who can't behave. I put those days behind me several years ago. I no longer do it. I don't care if they are 'related' to me.

I hope we're helpful in helping you think about how you'll find a way to address your worries about the holidays and look at how valuable it is that you already know what you will and won't do during this time of year. Many of us were in our FOG for years about that stuff!

Trees

[LemonLime]

Hi WOBG, I just want to extend my best wishes to you on this.  You've written a thoughtful post and have clearly done a lot of work in realizing your values and wishes.

As you might remember, I have a remarkably similar situation, even down to my dad passing away in the past year.  I too fit my visits to my grieving mother around my sister's visit to her.  I'm fortunate that my mom does not insist that we visit at the same time, and for that I am grateful.  The guilt, however, is there because I know mom just "wants us to get along...." and would love to have everyone under the same roof for the holidays.

I learn from what you post, and the wise replies from others. I hope you feel less alone in this situation.

[walking on broken glass]

Thank you, Trees! It is so encouraging to hear that I have a good handle on what I want to do, because quite often it does not feel that way. I will keep reminding myself of my 'red lines' so as not to lose perspective. I love what you say about bringing your presence and kindness. It is so true, even if it is not always appreciated.

And thank you, LemonLime I wonder if perhaps my mum might be relieved if I end up visiting separately from my sister. I know she wants us to get along but since this won't happen magically, I wonder if perhaps she finds separate visits less stressful because she can manage my sis on her own and she won't have to worry about me. Maybe that's wishful thinking!

My friend suggested that, if I talk to my mum about how I cannot be around sis, I also bring my partner into this and say 'we feel it is too difficult' etc instead of 'I'. I am not sure if this is a good idea. On the one hand, all my family loves my partner so this might lend more credibility. On the other hand, I worry whether it will bring more complications, if my mum for instance will want to know details or even if this turns her against my partner. I don't know. We spoke yesterday and I only managed to ask about her trip to Japan and when it's happening, hoping we could move on to the holidays subject after that. But she just said that she doesn't know when she will go and changed the subject, and so I didn't persevere.

Thank you so much for the chat and the advice, it really helps.

[clarityjane]

I do want to say that I feel deeply sorry for your struggle. I, too, understand the anxious planning involved months ahead of holidays. Reading your account is like my own experience in many ways. My heart hurts for you at this time. Years ago, I stopped making decisions based on who's feelings were hurt because of protecting mine. I can say that I do not regret it. There have been countless attempts by others(sometimes my own self) to enforce the guilt I have but that guilt subsides. I have learned. Having a game plan if choosing to go is a great idea. Either way you decide, don't let others put you down for doing what you need to in order to have peace. I hope you find peace, walking on broken glass. Even if it takes time to get there, I sincerely hope it.

[walking on broken glass]

Thank you so much, clarity Jane.

Since I wrote here there have been developments. My mum went to the hospital yesterday because she had abdominal pain and she discovered she has a kidney blockage. She needs to have a small operation this week to understand what causes the blockage. She probably won't stay in the hospital overnight. My aunts are there and can help but I feel guilty: should I go there to be with her? Truth is I really don't want to, unless it cannot be avoided. I feel very guilty saying this but I know that if I am there, there will be Skype calls from my sis all day and I don't exactly have a space to myself in the house. It will be awful. But I feel sorry for my mum. If this is stressful and difficult for me, it must be so much more for her. I had booked tickets to go back home to my partner and cat for a week and I was really looking forward to it too. I am dreading that I will have to cancel it.

I know I shouldn't be thinking about it in these terms but it also really bugs me that my mum had told my sister about the pain and the hospital in the morning of the same day and I only got to hear about it the evening after she came back home from the hospital. It's like I am the person who will give her the actual support because sis is far away and she is always too busy with work and can't take time off, but I am not the one kept in the loop, even though I am much closer geographically and can be relied on for help.

[Sheppane]

Hi Walking

Firstly I am very sorry for your loss. I hope you are doing ok.

Re your arrangements for Christmas the thing that strikes me is : what do you really want to do ? What is best for you, given the situation ?

I completely hear that ideally you would like to stay home. That is an option that is always there to you - but equally I know certainly in my FOO the stress of the backlash from that I would find hard to manage. So I guess it is a question of which option has the easiest consequences to manage. In an ideal world , not visiting might be what you would like the most , but we know that will not come without consequences.

So which would be "easier"?
It is going to be a tough time of year and I really relate to your point of " what about my mourning ". These family dynamics often demand our attention on everyone else's mourning and while I can hear the compassion and kindness in relating to wanting to support your Mum , it is so important to focus on how you support you and what that might look like.

If it were me I would decide first which of option a ) going and b) not going would be the easiest. I would then make my plans around that, to suit me, and not wait to hear of your sister's plans. We all know with PD dynamics how plans can change at a moments notice so you will get no clarity there anyway.
Could you stay in the BNB and prepare yourself for the likely backlash of why you are staying there / why you won't stay longer with an answer like " actually I am finding this Christmas quite tough and need a bit of space for my own grieving " . No need to explain any further.
I really feel for you as I know the weight of expectations in these situations can feel like a lot to bear. Look after yourself first , and let the plans fall into place around that. Remember you can leave the house at any time / need a walk / feel sick / whatever excuse you need. most importantly, look after you.
Hope that helps

[Sheppane]

I've just read the follow up about your Mum now being in hospital - I had missed that. I'm sorry to hear that and can hear the stress there.
In my FOO I have often been the last to know - with one of my sibs taking charge , being in the middle of the drama , and only informing me late in the day. I remember asking why wasn't I told about this earlier to be told " I knew you'd be busy ". It is a tool of control to withhold information like that.

I hope your Mum improves soon. You are asking should you go to see her ? If your aunts are there already to help maybe it's not necessary ? I would say go if you want to see her but not because of the guilt. And remember you absolutely do not have to take all those Skype calls from your sister. PD dynamics seem to thrive on drama and I would engage minimally just to pass on factual information , even just by text if needed. I've been in those situations before where I was being asked for moment to moment updates and it really is exhausting and infuriating. Honestly I don't think you should cancel your trip home , but if you really felt the need to see your Mum perhaps you could visit for a day and then return back ? I hope everything goes ok.

[walking on broken glass]

Thank you so much Sheppane. It's so good to read some level-headed, compassionate advice.
My mum is having the operation on Thursday. She won't stay in the hospital and my aunt will be there with her. I asked her if she wants me to go and she said there is no need. In truth I didn't really want to go. I will reserve my visit for when it is a real emergency (fingers crossed there won't be a need).

I still haven't decided what we are doing for Christmas. I guess my indecision is also some kind of decision. I will see how I feel when the time comes and maybe the price of the tickets will be an extra argument for what needs to be done. Thankfully my sister hasn't been in touch with me at all, not even about mum. I hope it stays that way

[walking on broken glass]

My mum had to be rushed in the hospital today because she was in pain. She had the operation but they still don't know what causes the kidney blockage and will have to do more tests. It looks like this won't be resolved easy. At least my aunt and uncle are there. I am stressed

[Sheppane]

Hi walking. I hope your mum is ok.
As regards what you said in your previous post about Christmas , that your indecision is some kind of decision I think that sounds very wise. In times like this when no decision seems the right one I think there is a lot to be said for leaving things be and sometimes no decision at all is the answer for the moment. You can trust that the right path will become obvious to you nearer the time.

[walking on broken glass]

So, I think the time has come for me to ask my mum again about my sister's plans and put pressure to get an actual answer. We are thinking of going there before Christmas and leaving straight after, when my sister, I imagine, would arrive, but I need to be sure that she won't be there for Christmas, otherwise we are not going. I am planning to frame this in a very practical manner, saying to my mum something like 'I want to be sure that you won't be alone for any of the holidays'. So if I ask when sis is coming and she says I don't know, I will press on saying 'well, I know that she normally says she only has leave for New Year's, so we were thinking of coming for Christmas so that you won't be on your own'. I am hoping this will prompt her to have a discussion with sis about holidays and get a concrete answer before we book. Part of me feels pathetic for relying on other people to make our plans, but I can't think of another way if I want to see my mum over the holidays and avoid my sister. Ugh. I will ask her when I talk to her tonight and I am already stressed and playing out possible conversations in my head.

[walking on broken glass]

Second message because I was chatting with a friend and she gave me another idea: to go to my mum's just before the holidays, mid-December. If I decide that I shouldn't feel guilty about not spending the holidays with her, this is perfect for us: it's easier to find a cat-sitter, the flight prices are much lower, we get to decide about our plans without having to worry about running into sis, and we can spend the Christmas holidays in our place, doing all the things we love and having our routine. My partner will also be able to take time off before Christmas so we can go together and I can have some support while there. Just thinking about this, I breathe a sigh of relief.

I am trying to fight my guilt by saying to myself that I will still see my mum and that she spends all mornings talking to my sis on skype anyway, so why is it a big deal if we are not there during the festive time? I am also trying to remind myself that I am an adult woman who has the right to decide how to spend her holidays. They still see me as an extension of the family of origin, but the truth is I am almost 40 years old and I have my own family now (even though in their eyes this is not exactly true because we don't have children).

What do you guys think? Should I rip that bandaid?

[Call Me Cordelia]

That sounds like a fabulous plan to me. Doing what's best for you!