So sad

[Dinah-sore]

Hi, thank you all so much for your continued support. I am setting more boundaries with my mom and talking to her less, still checking in with a positive tone.

But we did see her for a family birthday about a week ago. There were several passive aggressive comments she made. But she also made comments about my daughter's appearance that upset her, she kept bringing up her weight, "omg you lost so much weight." And she wouldn't let it go or drop it. My dd is the same weight, she looks the same. My mom acted like she needed me to agree with her that my dd lost so much weight. It was weird and she wouldn't accept me saying no she is the same weight. And then my dd told her she was going to change her hair color, and my mom put her fists in the air to cheer "yes!" Like it was an answered prayer, it was like she was thankful my dd wouldn't look like this pretty soon. Again, not a compliment. Also, stuff she used to do to me all the time and I never noticed why I always felt like crap.

I am forgetting several digs at my expense that she made in front of everyone, but she meant to do that each time, I saw the look on her face, but she did manage to tell me that it is my fault that she is gaining weight, and every time we fight she has to binge on unhealthy fast food. She then implied it is hurting my dad too, because he had a heart attack last year and can't eat that. So she is feeding him fast food because of me? lol. He is an adult, he can make his own choices, he can make himself oatmeal or a salad or bbq protein. So he is choosing it too. But it sucks. She is hurting them, and blaming me. At a birthday party.

She seems so angry at me, even when she is talking polite, there is this feeling of seething rage under the surface where she is just looking for anything to be upset at me for. And at the same time I feel like she is so desperate to attach to me that anything I do feels like rejection to her.

The thing that hurt me bad today, was yesterday my dd happened to call BPDm while me and dd were in the middle of a conflict, and I don't know what she said to my BPDm, but she discussed something. Today my dd was upset and she apologized for telling my mom whatever she did about our conflict, but told me "grandma said something that really upset me and I don't want to tell you because I don't want it to hurt you."

So she ended up telling me what my mom said to my dd yesterday while dd and I had a conflict. She said, "why can't Dinah be a f***ing mom for once."

It upset my dd so bad, I mean we were irritated with each other, but we made up within the hour, and she felt that what my mom said was too far and disproportionate to the situation. She got upset with my mom and asked her not to talk like that.

But omg.

My mom used to make me (as a child), sit in drug houses with her till the sun came up, and she would yell at me when I said I was hungry or cold or tired. I couldn't bother her. She was partying. Be quiet.


I have taken care of very sick children, and gotten them almost back to health, under terrible stress emotional and physical, their endless seizures, etc. I have suffered to care for the people I love. And I don't want anything in return, I am grateful for the loving relationship I have with my kids. But they don't owe me and I never complain or ask for recognition.

But my mom said "can Dinah be a f***ing parent for once."

It makes me so angry, cuz she said it on speaker phone and my dad was in the room, and he has been so cold with me this last year, I feel like she is turning him away from me. And it hurts so bad. He never stood up for me, but I could talk to him and he would support me privately.but now he is completely on her side and I think she just sits over at her house and bitches about me every day. I just know she always has someone she obsessively bitches about. And it is me. Now it is me.

I am so sad. I think every positive interaction I have with her feels fake. She literally called me yesterday after she said that to dd, and told me what a wonderful mom I am. It means nothing. I can't trust her compliments anymore, even if something is true, it is said to manipulate. And it makes me so freaking angry. I can see moments in my past of her flattery and it is so gross. I hate that I have let her control and manipulate me my whole life.

I feel disgust. And I feel guilt for feeling. This way.

I am really hoping this anger will help me cut off any more invisible strings that link me to need her approval. Like she doesn't deserve my patience with her. She is cruel. Sorry if this is coming off too angry, mean, or crazy. If I look like I am behaving like a PD please tell me. Thank you all.

[walking on broken glass]

I am so sorry Dinah. What you said here:

She seems so angry at me, even when she is talking polite, there is this feeling of seething rage under the surface where she is just looking for anything to be upset at me for. And at the same time I feel like she is so desperate to attach to me that anything I do feels like rejection to her.

Right there, that's exactly it! You hit the nail on the head. That's the core of your mum's unhealthy dynamic. I can see a shift in your thinking, I can see that you are distancing yourself from her and you see her clearly for who she is and how much she is hurting you. I think this knowledge will make you more and more proactive in protecting yourself and your daughter. It hurts but you are doing all the right things.

I am really hoping this anger will help me cut off any more invisible strings that link me to need her approval. Like she doesn't deserve my patience with her. She is cruel.

Yes to all of that!

[Rebel13]

I'm really sorry Dinah. I can tell how much you are struggling and how much it hurts. My hope is that, like you and WOBG both said, this time of strife will bring you to a clearer, stronger place within yourself. I'm not just saying that; it has been my experience with my own mom. Those of us who are kind and try hard to have good relationships can only take so much mistreatment before our self-protective anger comes to the fore and helps us create more psychological safety for ourselves, in whatever way makes sense for our own particular situation. For me, that anger and frustration, the sense of injustice about how much I did to try to make my mother feel happy and valued, and how she more or less threw it back in my face, snapped me out of the guilt and duty I was stuck in.

And I had to chuckle a little when I read your worry about sounding "too angry, mean, or crazy." I have felt like that too, and worried that I am just like one or the other of my dysfunctional parents. People who don't understand our situation often see us as "too angry" but I believe we are justified by the years of mistreatment we have withstood. The other side of that coin is, people who have disordered tendencies don't seem to ever worry about sounding "too" anything. If a behavior helps them get what they want from other people, it seems to be all good with them! So the fact that we worry about acting disordered is kind of proof that we aren't, if you see what I mean.

Hang in there! It sounds like you are a terrific mom and have a great relationship with your daughter. She's lucky to have the loving, caring mom that we didn't. I hope you have or can find the love and support you need to get through this difficult time.

[moglow]

Dinah, going out on a limb here based on my stuff and what I recall of yours- you were taught that mother comes first and you must obey. That obey comes with a whole long list of thou shalts, whether spoken or implied. She is not wrong, she does not acknowledge or apologize. You must obey or face the wrath, period end of.

At this point I tend to doubt you can get through to her how damaging her words have been and are, or even to accepting responsibility for them at all. When it's said to a third party it's hearsay and I'd about guarantee she counts on that level of protection (i.e. that's not what I said, I'd never say that, she misunderstood, right down to her insistence THATS A LIE!!!). Again, speculating based primarily on mine.

Thing is, y'all all know dd isn't in a position to speak up. It's still triangulation where mother brings in a third person who those things should never be said to. If your mother can drive a wedge or engender doubt, I suspect she'll go with that, as it removes any culpability on her part.

My best suggestion: calm rational honesty with your mother. If she gets mad she just does. If she can't conduct herself respectfully with your children, they won't be visiting. You know things have been said and/or repeated to your children that condemn your parenting. NO ONE has a right to do that. Ever. If she has a concern, she needs to either come to you or stfu. Your children aren't the ones to convey that message, ever. It's not their stuff.

No, none of that would go over well with her. You'll still need to wrap your mind around the idea that's who she is, what she's chosen. None of that is yours to carry and you can refuse to carry it any longer. You're not "allowed" to speak up? Okay then neither is she. Disagree without being disagreeable in the process - or leave you alone.

All of that sounds bold and brave I know, but I've been there and done it too. It was hard for me to grasp that what mother says about me is none of my business. If she continues saying it to my (imaginary) children, I see nothing wrong in withdrawing that access. You're *their* mother and until they are adults you get to decide for them. Sometimes we truly do reap what we sow.

Boundaries. Do what you need to find and protect your and your family's peace.

[Psuedonym]

Hey Dinah!

I just happened to log in to see how everyone was doing and saw your post. On top of the wise comments everyone has already left here's what I would add:

"why can't Dinah be a f***ing mom for once."
People with NPD personalities are rooted in shame, but it's a shame they can't admit let alone process, so they project it onto other people (i.e. you). That's why they use you as an emotional dumping ground. Her saying 'why can't Dinah be a f***ing mom for once' is her literally saying this about herself. I would take it as an admission of guilt and nothing more.

She seems so angry at me, even when she is talking polite, there is this feeling of seething rage under the surface where she is just looking for anything to be upset at me for. And at the same time I feel like she is so desperate to attach to me that anything I do feels like rejection to her.
She is jealous. Jealous and resentful. Because of your relationship with your daughter and of the life you've managed to create for yourself. It's hard to wrap your head around the idea that your parent would want you to feel as miserable as they do but it's true; they've decided in their heads that a) you are responsible for making them happy and when you b) fail to do that because, duh, nobody can make them happy that c) you deserve to be as miserable as they are. The snide comments and backhanded compliments and passive aggressive statements are designed to do just that, and in her head it's completely justified.

I feel disgust.
Good! You should feel disgust and anger. It means you're sticking up for yourself. The guilt is the part you need to let go of. Easier said than done, but as you have these insights into who your mom really is and how she really feels it will get easier to do.

 

[Liketheducks]

Dinah, as painful as this is, you're doing SO great.   

I am convinced that all of our PD moms are working off the same play book.   My mom doesn't criticize my parenting where I can see it....but she lambasts so many other mom's in our family.   (Likely because she uses trashing others as a way to bond with me....like I have to agree with her in lockstep...or somehow be on "her" side - but that is another long post).   When I brought it up to my BFF, BFF stated "like your mom is somehow mother of the year".   It was funny at the time.   Though it also struck me that the irony of MY mom bringing up how other moms aren't doing it right....somehow slipped my mind.   There is so much concrete evidence to the contrary in my childhood.   Drugs, check....minimizing her children's needs, check.....gaslighting and triangulation are daily occurrences.   
I don't want to sound like a narc myself, but sometimes I just believe a lot of this stems from her being jealous of me.  And, also failing to take virtually any responsibility for her own life.

I'm sorry you're here....but glad you found us.   You're doing it right.   You sound like you have an amazing relationship with your daughter.   

[NarcKiddo]

Wow. Just wow. I am not at all surprised you are angry about that. I feel like spinning into orbit just reading about it.

It is testament to the wonderful, proper, loving relationship you have with your dd that she was angry at what her grandmother said even though she was in the process of complaining to her grandmother about you. You have brought your dd up very well and are obviously a proper mother to her.

Your disgust at her flattery resonates very, very much with me, too. Mine has always used that tactic when she wants something or if she realises she may have gone too far. It is insincere and foul. But please do not beat yourself up about having believed such tricks in the past. You were brought up to do just that, as was I.

[TimetoHeal]

Dinah,

I'm sorry this is a bit late, but I just wanted to chime in with my support.  You've been given some great advice and insight already, and you are gaining your own insight every day.  I encourage you not to be afraid or ashamed of the emotions that are coming up.  Anger, disgust, all of these are natural reactions to the situation you are in and the realization of what kind of person your mother is.  It's sad.  But it's also self-protective and empowering.  I have made the most progress this last year since ceasing to fight these true feelings and thoughts I have toward my mother.  And I have simply stopped caring what she thinks or says about 99.99% of the time.  You are making progress, and it hurts in the meantime.  But is so worth it in the end.