"They've really changed this time!"

Started by FoggedFrog, February 22, 2021, 12:37:46 AM

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FoggedFrog

This weekend, I went for a short, safe visit to my parents' house. And they dropped a bomb I figured would happen eventually. I was informed they had established contact with PD Sibling. And I heard a phrase that I have heard all my life, again and again:

"Your sibling has really changed this time!"

Sure, Jan.  :wacko:

I was sat down by my parents and was told, "We know we could lose you forever, but we need this. We need PD Sibling in our life." HOW AM I SUPPOSE TO RESPOND TO THAT? How am I not suppose to interpret that as, "We're choosing PD Sibling over you, even if it means we never see/hear from you again?" Am I overreacting?!?!?!

This also happened years ago. My parents were estranged from PD Sibling. They established contact and worked on the relationship. "I can see a palpable change in them! They are different!" Disaster ensued. But not before being sat down by my parents and being told I "negatively influenced" their perception of PD sibling. I was told their estrangement with PD Sibling was all my fault. This is something that deeply hurt me and one of those things I will never forgive. Of course later, they ended up re-estranging themselves. It didn't last.

Growing up, PD Sibling was in charge. The boss. They called the shots. It always felt like my parents highly favored PD Sibling, due to a mix of genuine favoring but also sheer fear. I *hate* how my parents act when PD Sibling is in their orbit. Dad seems totally against it, but as always, he just wrings his hands and says, "well this is what your mother decided." The past two days, I keep randomly bursting into tears. It feels like I'm losing my parents. When PD Sibling is in their life, I feel like I can't tell them anything. It's like they become a lot meaner themselves and any small detail can't be trusted with them. I'm suppose to be planning a wedding and honestly I don't even want them there anymore.

On top of that, I was told PD Sibling wants to apologize to me, try to repair our relationship, and cried really hard thinking about how they may never see/or talk to me again. From my end, it's like....what "relationship"? From the day I was born, PD Sibling has hated me. They never knew me. What memories could they possibly be fondly reminiscing about? Shoving me down flights of stairs? Punching me so hard in the nose that I bled? Being the first person to call me a racial slur (we are half-siblings and are different races)? Watching the horror in my eyes as they were dragged away by the police for the millionth time? Spreading lies and rumors to the rest of the family to ruin all my other relationships? Violence, mockery, humiliation, and emotional abuse against me was the only interaction PD Sibling ever had with me. Otherwise my existence was completely ignored by PD Sibling. There is no base or foundation for me to grasp onto. There is no hope. There's nothing there worth salvaging.

I know nothing has happened yet. People close to me keep telling me to calm down, wait and see. But you all know...this has happened a million times before. And the story never changes. And I WILL NOT be dragged into what will inevitably turn into a chaotic, dramatic, violent, potentially life-ruining scenario. There's a reason I left this circus behind. And if they really have changed and everyone is happy? Good for them. But I cannot risk jeopardizing my now peaceful life on a gamble. I won't.

Maybe everyone else will find peace if I leave them alone. Maybe it's really me that is ruining everything and I just have to let them all lead their crazy lives. Every chance they have, my parents pick PD Sibling over me. I'm an adult on my own, I shouldn't even care. But I do.

I feel so alone. I feel like I have no family anymore.

Hilltop

To me the relationships should all be separate.  You can have a relationship with your parents however tell them that you are not willing to have a relationship with your sibling and it is not up for discussion.  You can tell your parents that you don't want to discuss sibling or anything that happens with sibling.  That is an ok boundary to put in place.

For me personally I wouldn't want to put my parents in the position of choosing.  They can have a relationship with whoever they want.  If your parents want a relationship with the other sibling, that is their choice.  How many parents do stand by their children hoping for change, plenty do.

What I would tell your parents though, is that if they decide to have a relationship with the other sibling that is their business.  If there is any drama you don't want to hear about it.  You don't want to be included in any dinner/lunches/events with the other sibling.  You ask that they respect that boundary.

It was very unfair to blame you for the estrangement.  That is another reason I would tell them its their life and their choice. 

I do think it is unfair to say to someone if you have a relationship with that person, I will leave you.  They aren't choosing one child over the other, that shouldn't be a choice that is imposed or forced upon them.  You should decide to be in a relationship with your parents if its a healthy relationship for you, do you enjoy it, do you want to have a relationship with them.  If the answer is yes, your sibling doesn't matter.

Have your relationship with your parents on your own terms.  Leave your sibling out of it.  Sit your parents down and tell them that they can do what they want but then state your own boundaries regarding your sibling.

I get the things done by your sibling are abusive.  I agree that you don't need that in your life.  Of course with a wedding coming up its not really a surprise your sibling is back, PD people have a way of trying to ruin things.  So, I would take a deep breath, let your parents make their own decision and get on with enjoying the planning of your wedding.

The first time your parents bring up the sibling I would shut it down in no uncertain terms.  I think really there is a lot of anger and hurt over what your sibling did and it doesn't sound like you have dealt with that. 

Realise that you are not the problem here.  You really aren't.  You also don't need to be in the middle of their mess.  You can simply walk away from that and keep your relationship with your parents about you and them.  Fingers crossed they can manage that.

You are most likely right that your parents will be in for more trouble with your sibling but you know what, that isn't your problem to solve for them.  Protect yourself from your sibling but your parents are going to have to sort that out for themselves.

DistanceNotDefense

Hi FoggedFrog...I really relate to what you're saying here.

What I notice is that your parents really don't seem to value your experience and how your abusive sibling affects you. They don't realize it, but in a way, I do think they are choosing your sibling over you: they'd rather stick to their forced reality that this sibling is their favorite even if it comes with chaos and craziness.

Sounds pretty dysfunctional to me and like you're in the scapegoat position, to be honest, and that this sibling is the GC. They "prefer" them no matter the cost, and the fact this sibling is so unbalanced and abusive is because they've coddled them all their lives with this treatment - but they don't want to accept that they created the "monster", it's easier to blame you (classic scapegoat move).

You could follow Hilltops advice and attempt to keep the relationships separate. That would almost be like a LC route. It does already seem, though, that your parents do a really bad job of keeping things separate, and even if thats what you wanted they might not honor that. They blur lines and boundaries by saying that the siblings behavior is your fault. And it's more than likely to happen again once sibling is back in their lives.

I had the same thing happen to me and had the same realizations. I had a highly abusive older sibling and my FOO rallied behind them when I spoke up and their behavior ramped up. The only message I realized that my family could possibly "get" was the one I could communicate wordlessly: by taking myself out of the equation entirely and letting them see what the reality of the situation was like without me as part of the dynamic for a while (and even that, I'm not sure they will get the message).

I've been there (I am there) and I'm so sorry this is happening....it's so painful. Scapegoating is some of the worst agony there is.

FoggedFrog

Thank you for your input @Hilltop. I appreciate it.

I've been estranged from PD Sibling for roughly 10 years now.  About 4 years ago, the first time my parents "re-established contact" with PD Sibling, I laid down boundaries. Do not tell me updates about PD Sibling's life, I don't want to know. Do not invite us to the same gathering. Do not convince me to contact PD Sibling. Please respect my privacy and don't tell PD Sibling details about my life. All of these boundaries were repeatedly violated. Thankfully I was not outright ambushed at family gatherings, I was invited with full knowledge that PD Sibling would be there, but it annoyed me that it was still an issue being pushed. I was told more about PD Sibling's life than I wanted to know, each time having to re-iterate that this is not information I want. It was like information whiplash - "Did you want sandwiches for lunch? I made egg salad. By the way, PD Sibling's marriage is on the rocks....". I came to find out PD Sibling knew my new address, had my new phone number, and even one time sent their spouse to my house with one of their children for me to babysit without asking me beforehand. That's how I knew they had my address. Blam, there they were, right at my doorstep! And doing the same old stuff - no respect for what I had to do that day, the assumption that I would drop everything for them in that instant. I've learned that I can put down boundaries over and over and over again, and my parents have 0 respect for them, 0 intention of following them. They affirm over and over that they respect my boundaries but they don't. Why should this time be any different?

I also had to walk into my parents home and see physical destruction. "What happened? Did the dog bump into every surface and break everything?" Nope, it was just PD Sibling, as a full adult, having a temper tantrum. Not surprising but still disappointing! Still having to see the evidence of their destruction in my life! Still having my parents burst into tears telling me again and again how they can't take it anymore! They never want to live like this again! It's always the same old story! They always said this growing up too. They will REALLY do something about it this time. PD Sibling will REALLY have consequences THIS TIME. They'll REALLY learn this time! But it never happens.

I've always told my parents I don't want them choosing sides. I estranged myself months before my parents made the decision, a decision might I add that I never expected from them. I was not surprised the first time they "re-established contact." I was surprised they went that long without contact at all. But they were the ones who decided to tell me their first estrangement was all my fault (they must have limited memories - PD Sibling faked one of their children's death [yes really] and blamed it on my parents; that was the original reason for their estrangement; they must have so easily forgotten). They were the ones who decided to make the opening line of the big news this time with, "We might lose you forever, but we need PD Sibling!" Never did I ever insinuate that they would "lose me forever" if they invited PD Sibling back into their lives. I'd still be majorly disappointed sure, but that was all their wording. Never mine. It's the way they worded it that made me so upset, combined with reflecting about how the past has gone. They were willing to lose me forever. Fine. My wedding planning has been stalled in the beginning phases because of the pandemic. We were originally suppose to get married this Spring (which PD Sibling apparently knows when other family blabbed to them to ASK FOR AN INVITE). I can only imagine the absolute rage I'd be feeling if I was actually so close to my wedding and this happened. Because I could not trust my parents to not pull a stunt. To not tell PD Sibling every detail of the wedding, including where and when it would be happening.

And no one has even addressed the fact that PD Sibling has an abusive, criminal spouse who last I heard is still very much criminal and abusive. We will just forget? Welcome him back into the family home? Guess that's happening.

Also, I mentioned in a previous post last year, PD Sibling's oldest child (who is an adult) was estranged from them. They were for nearly two years. Oldest child accused PD Sibling's spouse of being abusive and ran away to my parents home multiple times, even though they were forbidden to see them. PD Sibling each time called the police for "kidnapping." As recently as a year ago, PD Sibling accused us (me, my parents) of "kidnapping" their adult child and poisoning us against them. But a few months ago, oldest child decided to make amends with Pd Sibling. I was 100% supportive. In fact, I wasn't a fan of oldest child estranging themselves from PD Sibling in the first place because I knew that any ounce of empathy or love that I've ever (fleetingly) seen from PD Sibling was in their interactions with oldest child. So I felt that PD Sibling probably couldn't help themselves making mistakes due to mental illness but they genuinely loved oldest child. And I trust oldest child to not disrespect my boundaries. And so far they haven't. In fact, oldest child would come up to me if I ever came up in conversation, like "my parents asked about you, and I said you were doing good. That's all I said, I just wanted to let you know." I never asked for that type of thing, oldest child did that of their own accord, and I appreciated it. So far it was smooth sailing.

Sorry for the novel, but I just wanted to provide some context on the fact that it's not about me not being supportive or trying to keep relationships separate. It's what I've been trying to do all along. Maybe I haven't been perfect, but I've done the best I can, and at least I'm trying. I'm not the one that's pitting people against each other for nor reason. Maybe I sound crazy, I don't know. But I think there is more information here on why it's more like I'm worried about the actions of my parents when PD Sibling is in their life, rather than just the fact that they have contact with PD Sibling. If they were able to keep things balanced, I wouldn't care. In fact, I'd embrace it. Because clearly my parents are in distress over their relationship with PD Sibling. But because they are in even MORE distress when PD Sibling is in their world, because they just CANNOT respect my boundaries with PD Sibling, I'm very, very worried. And I feel like the only course of action is keeping them at even more of an arm's length. I do not trust my parents.

FoggedFrog

@DistanceNotDefence Thank you! You describe exactly what I feel. I appreciate your words.

I've known about SGs and GCs for many years now, but for some reason I've never thought of me as a SG and PD Sibling as a GC. But I guess now it's so clear. This has been the dynamic all along.

What's funny is growing up, my parents always told me PD Sibling was so smart. A genius. I could only ever hope to be as smart as PD Sibling. PD Sibling could have been a rocket scientist if they wanted to, they just didn't want to! And there was real proof - PD Sibling skipped a grade. They also graduated early. I ate this information up. It was the gospel truth. Even through my whole adult life and being estranged, this was just a fact of life. PD Sibling was naturally a lot smarter than me. Well recently I had a look through a box in my parents house full of our old school records. I had never seen PD Sibling's records before. Their grades were full of C's! Sometimes even D's! Meanwhile I was valedictorian and always on the honor roll! But I could only ever hope to be as smart as PD Sibling? Okay. I guess that is some favoritism right there that I never knew was favoritism. As an adult, still surprised at the ways my parents lied and manipulated me. I feel so stupid for just believing everything. But I was only a child.

And yes, nothing is every my parents' fault. It is always everyone else's fault. Growing up multiple people told them PD Sibling needs REAL help. Serious help. They need consequences for what they do, but they also need intensive professional help. My parents threw up every excuse they possibly could to not get PD Sibling help. As a child I viewed this as legitimate. Why would my parents lie? I'm so stupid and naive. I didn't start seeing the truth of the situation until much later in life.

My relationship with my parents has always been strange and strained (at least from my view). It got better when I moved out. It's always so much better when PD Sibling is just not in our lives. But the last time contact happened between PD Sibling and parents, that was in retrospect a good experiment in seeing how our relationship really deteriorates when PD Sibling is around. And it's not even PD Sibling's fault (or at least I don't think so). I've become a lot more aware that part of my childhood trauma and all these problems surrounding PD Sibling is not just PD Sibling. It is also my parents. But they will never take responsiblity. And they will never admit (outright in plain language) they love PD Sibling more than me and they they have always and will always treat them better and do literally anything for them - including sacrificing me.

I've already written a mini-novel in this thread, but it's still scratching the surface of life with PD Sibling. But my parents many times threw me to the wolves to favor PD Sibling. If PD Sibling's bio-parent stopped by the house, I was locked outside at night for hours without access to water or a bathroom so that they all could talk together without me interrupting. Every one of PD Sibling's partners were invited to live in our home, even if PD Sibling was underage themselves, when I was very underage (PD Sibling is much older than me) - even when that partner was KNOWN BY MY PARENTS to be violent, have a criminal history, and/or be a drug addict. My parents would leave me alone with these people. Nothing ever happened to my recollection (thank god). But if PD Sibling wanted something to happen (eg PD Sibling and my parents going somewhere while I'm left at home alone for hours with a known criminal they just met), then that happened, no questions or concerns. If PD Sibling wanted me sent away while a family event happened, I was sent away. If PD Sibling was something new, they always go it. Nothing was denied them. Meanwhile I never got anything new. No clothes, no toys, I slept on the same mattress my great aunt died on that had been in her home who knows how many decades. I never got a car, my parents even refused to sign me up for drivers ed. If PD Sibling wanted me to cancel all my plans and babysit their children to go out and party, guess what my parents told me I was doing that day? If PD Sibling wanted to have Christmas in the living room without me or my parents, in my parents house, guess what happened? Like I said....PD Sibling was the boss.

Meanwhile, I was yelled at for anything and everything because I guess my parents knew they could get away with it. They weren't scared of me. I wasn't the boss. I was just a kid they could do anything to and they knew I wouldn't do anything.

DistanceNotDefense

Fogged, you are not stupid and naive! Your parents' less preferential treatment of you (locking you out, not letting you drive, etc.) sounds awful. Awful, awful, awful.

My older sibling was also chosen as the GC and was considered the best/most in this, or that, or that. None of it was true and made less and less sense growing up (my sib is barely functional and destroys all their relationships. Still, every excuse is made for her).

The parent(s) see something of themselves in the GC (the good parts of themselves) and are willing to do anything to excuse and enable it, even if it's a far cry from reality (just like they do for their own personalities).

In the SG, they see all the bad in themselves and blame them for everything almost as a proxy...and that, too, is a complete illusion and nothing but an arbitrary choice that hardly reflects who you really are.

In fact, in my own recovery I feel like I'm learning who I really am and completely de-programming what FOO taught me I should think that I am, because I was simply a vessel for a lot of guilt, shame, and self-hatred that wasn't mine (and because I was born second).

I was just a co-dependent extension of my M in her eyes: the "bad" version of herself, while my older sib was the "good" version that she pampered and praised, and we were both raised accordingly to disastrous (and hilariously opposite) results. I have my own issues, but I am far more functional and kinder than my older sibling. Funnily though I am treated as if I were the meaner and far less functional one.

Hilltop

Hey Fogged.  It looks like you have been all down that road before.  I understand because I tried to implement boundaries with my parents as well and said I didn't want to hear about my sister but nope I heard about her often. In saying that my sibling is no where near as bad as yours.

Unfortunately you know the deal.  You can try to implement boundaries and see how it goes.  As they violate boundaries you put in more distance, more restrictions and it sucks, its not having a normal relationship at all.  The other option is NC which isn't always easy either.

Really with all the info you have written about your parents they sound pretty abusive.  If they want your sibling in their life again it is their choice and I understand that hurts but I think you need to protect yourself.  You seem to be in the SG role and perhaps it is time to just quietly remove yourself from the situation.  I think its time for you to think about your own life, do you want this in your life and if the answer is no, perhaps that's where you need to go.

I feel like ultimately you need to take the option for you that protects you the most and at the moment if the sibling comes back that may be more distance from all of them.  That sucks and I'm sorry they can't see the truth about your sibling.

AlisonWonder

Fogged I am so sorry.  Here is what occurs to me:

1. How awful, just awful.
2. They can't.
3. Can you?

I hope you find peace, and soon.