Nothing has changed, nothing to say

[moglow]

Random mo decided to text md last night. I do this every few months to see if she'd actually respond - she claimed she didn't get my texts even though we could talk on that phone and she'd occasionally answer my calls. This time, she responded within minutes! Basically parroted my text back at me, that she'd not heard from me either. [Well no, you cut me off on mother's day and didn't call me back later. I failed to see the point after that ... But I digress]

She asked no questions and showed no interest, no "what have you been up to", nothing. After a few texts about the weather [it's summer, it's been so hot] she abruptly stopped responding. Not even a "I'm headed to bed, we'll talk later." I went to bed myself and hour or so later, checked when I woke up and nope. Nothing further. She was done. 

But ... Three years of insistence that she didn't get my texts, ugly confrontations from her demanding that I get my phone checked and the "yours are the only ones I don't get!" And not even a "I finally got a new phone!" or any word of explanation. 

Yes I wonder where her mind is  I think of her texts to my brothers, claiming I had been turning them against her, lying about her, the vile things that were repeated back to me from others. The things she said to me about those same people, knowing that only her audience changed, she just rotated her stories between them. Knowing finally that whatever she said to me, she was also saying about me. I think of her complete refusal to accept any responsibility in any relationship I've known her to have. She has well and truly separated herself from anyone who doesn't serve her. Me? I simply never existed. For my own mother. 

It's kinda sad in the big picture. And again, kinda freeing. There's been no fear for quite a while. My obligations there are done, any lingering guilt is gone. It all feels rather flat. Remote. Indifferent. 

Guess I'm done.

[moglow]

Update: Md text this morning, thanked me for pictures [of my cats, unsolicited and uncommented upon - I was grasping!] and admonished me to stay in touch. But ... why? To what possible purpose? So we can yet again discuss the weather, hot cold wet windy??? I know for a fact she's had much needed and complained about work done on the house, she didn't mention the improvements. I know also she's had numerous doctor's appts, supposedly gearing to eventual joint replacement. Nothing said. Just oddly that life is not wine and roses these days. Well no. If you sit alone in the dark and don't reach outside on any level for brighter, it will do that.

BUT I now know -three years later for me!- she *does* receive texts and pictures, has told us all she doesn't. Has flat out told youngest to not waste his time sending pictures of her great grandchildren, she doesnt get pictures. She just chooses to not participate. Boundaries.

[bloomie]

admonished me to stay in touch

Ummm... not "let's stay in touch" or "I would love for us to stay in touch" nothing that would require anything of her is what I am hearing in her admonishing YOU to stay in touch. 

What a stand off she has backed herself into. I hope her pride and whatever kind of odd power struggle with the universe this is, is good company for her. 

[moglow]

Bloomie, she didn't ask one question, offer anything by way of conversation. It's like pulling teeth to get any kind of response or interest. She berates me for not knowing what's going on with her, when she literally doesn't talk to me? But I'm to stay in touch, she snipes that she's not heard from any of us? Common denominator is lost on her.

The mind boggles.

[moglow]

Y'all. Now she's sniping because I said I'm glad her new phone was working and she can get my texts again. She believes "someone has been talking" because she said nothing about a phone - um okay, no. I assumed and made mistake of being glad for her about it. DAFUQ???

Truly no good deed goes unpunished with an angry bitter person. They can and will find a mad and beat you over the head with it.

[Cat of the Canals]

Ummm... not "let's stay in touch" or "I would love for us to stay in touch" nothing that would require anything of her is what I am hearing in her admonishing YOU to stay in touch. 

This jumped out at me, too, because my PDmom and PDmil say exactly the same types of things. My mom's go-to is: "We'll talk again in a few days." Her tone makes it obvious enough that this is an order, the implied bit is that I am expected to call her.

And actually, one of the reasons that I've been able to [somewhat easily?] reduce calls to once a month or less is that the onus has always been on me to keep up with her "preferred" left of contact. In the past she actually got angry when I wasn't keeping up and had enDad pass on the message: "Mom is mad you haven't called and says she's not calling you until you call her."  Third grade called, it wants its maturity level back.

[Sneezy]

admonished me to stay in touch. But ... why?

The demand that you call her puts all the responsibility on you.  Everything is up to you.  And if you don't call, then you are the bad daughter.  Well, even if you do call, you are the bad daughter.  Our moms think the entire universe is a play about them.  Everything that matters is solely from their point of view.  Something tragic can happen to someone else, but what matters is how it affects them.  It's their worrying, their sorrow, their loneliness, their boredom that matters.  It's all about them.  We are just actors, with an assigned role to play, in the great dramatic masterpiece that is their lives.

Your mom isn't going to change, you know that.  I'm glad you have let go of the obligation and guilt. 

And the "someone is talking" bit?  There is not a big enough eyeroll for this.  Who cares?  Even if someone had casually mentioned that your mom had gotten a phone, who the heck cares?  This is what she chooses to get her undies in a bunch about?  Yikes, I think Cat may be off by a few years when she says third grade is calling.    Most third graders are more mature than this.

[moglow]

Third grade called, it wants its maturity level back.

Right? The irony of that would be lost on them all. They're the PARENTS here, one would reasonably assume that they'd have a titch of interest, want some involvement with their families' lives. They demand it of others rather than even pretend themselves. Must blame someone.

But no. The onus is on ME/us and yet within 24hrs of contact after lengthy silence, she's picked that new nit to tussle over as if ANYONE cares about *her* phone and "someone has been talking" after I dared comment on it. Oh.My.Goodness. Is it a state secret? And no, no one's been talking to me about it - I assumed because somehow after years she can see and respond to my texts. She either got a new phone or repaired the old one. Her response is that I've started the old blame game again. WT actual??

So let me clarify: it's somehow offensive if I ask anything about her/her life AND if I voice anything of my own. And she demands that I stay in touch. Truly damned if you do, damned if you don't.

Yikes, I think Cat may be off by a few years when she says third grade is calling.    Most third graders are more mature than this.

Fo realz. Cannot make this shit up.

ETA - but had to step away from the keyboard lest I respond to her with:  And yes, I'm doing well, thanks for asking!!

[Hilltop]

Sorry Moglow that sounds hurtful.  Also crazy making.  The whole I'm not getting messages but she can get them and does.  Was it fun for her to see you all stirred up. See you stressed. Yet you suffered enormously from those games.  To them is just what,  a bit of fun.  That's maddening.

For some reason information is a thing with them. She isn't giving you any information,  it's withholding isn't it. A way to keep you out and by doing that hurt you,  punish you? You can only assume what is behind it but the actions are not kind.

I also find it interesting she says you need to keep in contact.  Again making it seem like that will be on you,  she isn't that interested.  Again trying to hurt you,  trip you up,  stir up anxiety in you. 

Her actions are quite rejecting and hey she will tell others that she complimented your photos of the cats and so she tried. 

That's the thing I'm really starting to see with these PD types. The games and all the negative emotion that goes with that.  How much energy is lost dealing with them.

I'm sorry she couldn't be normal and just have a normal conversation.  It seems such an easy thing but with them it's not possible.

[Hilltop]

She's fired up about the conversation about the phone, seems like she needs the drama. 

Don't get drawn into it.  Protect yourself.

[doglady]

Yep, it's all just a game, isn't it? They are playing by any different rules: rules that change all the time and in fact appear to be played on a different playing field altogether.

Whereas we value direct, adult, kind, truthful and rational communication between ourselves and others, they seem to get their joy from engaging in the complete opposite: obfuscation, fabrication, childishness, drama, inconsistency and irrationality.

I feel your pain, Mo. This sort of nonsense is all too familiar to me. There can be no winners in this game. I hope you can take good care of yourself and give yourself a break from this.

[moglow]

Her (most recent) phone drama of "someone's been talking"? Simple: she got called out on how she'd treated me over that issue, all without me saying a word. Far be it for her to apologize!

Instead of addressing her phone and associated issues *years* ago when there was an obvious failure, she clung to the drama of it all. She refused to have it seen to, preferring to blame me "it's just your texts I'm not getting so a. You're lying, or b. Your phone is malfunctioning." Never, "hey like you said, we can talk on this phone and I can send texts but I don't receive yours. Let's backtrack and see where shows my phone/phone line receiving."

And yet she kept texting me, demanding that I test my phone and have it checked out!! Even when I upgraded, she maintained that I was the problem. Guarantee if she'd looked at her itemized message list with her cell carrier (I did mine!) it would show messages sent and received *on that line* regardless of malfunction the phone was having. They could have them addressed issues with her equipment, badda bing badda boom and done. No, I got accusations and spite, name calling and withering putdowns of MY incompetence and shortcomings. It couldn't possibly be her phone!

I'd even told her - I set up read receipts way back, every one I send showed delivered. Did you maybe block by mistake and something needs to be reset? But no. It's me and my phone. Until it's not - new phone clearly says so.

BUT she has new phone - did she at any point text me, ask to test it out? Hey I got a new phone, let's see if l get your messages now. Also no. I stumbled onto that information. Had I not sent that random hello you've been in my mind just touching base with you, I wouldn't know this now.

Confirmation yet again: She was perfectly okay with no contact whatsoever or maybe an occasional "this is a call so we can say I called" where she didn't have to pretend to care. So yeah - instead of having actual conversations, sharing our lives or even remotely pleasurable relationship, this is where we are. And yet she takes pot shots at me about my silence.

[moglow]

UPDATE - you knew this was coming, right?

Md text me last week, asked me to call if I wanted details about her most recent appointment/cardiologist this time. [I'd already had thorough discussion with Bro #2 on that very subject, we agree she's on a muck dragging mission, probably trying to drive wedges] I was sickly myself over the wknd and in no condition to talk to her or anyone else, so no. Having a few days to chill herself out was probably a good thing regardless. I called yesterday as I was settling in after the day - bro had cleared the decks for me, let her know I'd not been well so she could just let that one go. 

Enter: the good fairy/her nice self. Her "details" varied somewhat from what he'd shared [he was there with her and apparently much more engaged with her new doctor than she was]. Yes, seems she's been referred to new doc to replace her pacemaker - this will be her fourth. Pacemaker, that is. According to tests she's near total reliance on the pacemaker to prompt her heart to beat, so they'll have to insert heart cath to provide temporary pacemaker during the changeout process [she neglected to share this bit, or simply still doesn't grasp the seriousness of it]. No electrical impulses to her heart?? How the hell does that happen and how could she not know? I have no idea, but she didn't ask obvious or applicable questions, just there for the ride apparently. It doesn't even sound like she's got any concerns about aftercare, recuperation etc. They pop one out, pop a new one in and all is well?

She did go into more detail than I felt necessary about her preop instructions, such scrub twice daily with particular antibacterial soap and prescription wash. Major concerns about possible infections this round. This, for a woman I believe has been "sponge" bathing for quite some time - can't get into deep claw foot tub in her older house, can't stand long enough due to knee issues to shower, one-human shower stalls there arent big enough for a bathing stool and move around room. Logistically I'm not sure how that's all going to work. [Bro has suggested that she get herself a room at local motel where she can get in and out of shower on her own, enlist aid of a shower stool and have at it as many times a day as she wants.]

Anyhoo, she moved on to relative friendliness for a rather disconcerting conversation. She offered a leading question or too, then would randomly laugh inappropriately [nothing funny being said] or go off into another sideways tangent. She was fairly flippant and dismissive about what sounds to me a rather serious situation. I told bro about it, and shared my gut feeling: she thinks she can grease the grids like this into whatever it is she wants from me. She'll play nice then assume that I "take care of" her/her house/something because clearly now "everything is okay between us." She's ever on the lookout for someone to blame or rage at [was doing this to bro just last week, immediately prior to reaching out to me. Hmmmmmm?!] and take out her anxieties. I'm the girl after all and of course that's the most logical option.

Except, it's not. I'm still not interested. I've found a pit of indifference that surprises me - bro's suggested option is actually doable. Or she could accept the home health care she was offered. She has options other than this hard hearted hannah she raised, who she can barely be civil to 98% of the time.

What say ye, siblings all?

[Cat of the Canals]

Anyhoo, she moved on to relative friendliness for a rather disconcerting conversation. She offered a leading question or too, then would randomly laugh inappropriately [nothing funny being said] or go off into another sideways tangent. She was fairly flippant and dismissive about what sounds to me a rather serious situation. I told bro about it, and shared my gut feeling: she thinks she can grease the grids like this into whatever it is she wants from me. She'll play nice then assume that I "take care of" her/her house/something because clearly now "everything is okay between us."

Again, sounds like my MIL. The idea that her children MUST serve her is something that is absolutely unshakable. No matter how many boundaries they erect, how far they run, how clear they make it that they are not her servants. We often say that her ability to use logic boils down to: "Because you have to." That's how huge/deep/all-encompassing the entitlement is. It doesn't matter how rude, cruel, and judgmental she is towards her children. They will do her bidding "because they have to."

And actually, I think it's all a circle. She thinks she's "allowed" to be as hurtful and brash and disrespectful as she wants for precisely the same reason. They have to put up with her behavior... because they have to.

My husband lately has been talking about how little it takes to reassure his mother that everything is fine between them. If he calls once a month or so, she can tell herself "all is right." It doesn't matter that she's on an extreme info diet, so he divulges almost nothing about our lives. That we said no to their last visit. That we have both grown incredibly distant, emotionally. She takes the crumbs and tells herself, "See? Everything is fine!"

[moglow]

Makes sense - for the first time in countless months she was civil for the entire conversation, so to her mind "everything is fine." No ma'am. The fact that it's even noted would tell any thinking person [!] that it's not normal for us and frankly the hackles raised for that reason. I know, you know, we all know that should she be challenged on any subject under the sun, and the gloves are off again. Or she may just sit back and start overthinking, read drama into whatever randomness stuck with her. She does that, gets comfortable and decides she can activate the punching bags by digging through things better left unsaid.

Bless her heart, literally and figuratively. She really has no idea who I am.

[bloomie]

Bless her heart, literally and figuratively. She really has no idea who I am.

No, she really doesn't know you. And it seems is incapable of realizing that with the level of deterioration you describe of her health, this IS the season to get her house in order with her children she has harmed.

I was just reading and studying about the folly of isolating ourselves like your mother has. Isolating and refusing to live in relationship and community with others is a breeding ground for self indulgence imo.

Your mother has deftly avoided having to make the sacrifices and show the humility it takes to get along with others and be accountable for her deeds and love others enough to, in this final season of her life, offer something of value and worth of herself to another in order to edify and bless them.

The great take away, as I see it, is that you have far out distanced and left the hard, rocky soil the relationship with you mother has been, and have cultivated a life with deep roots that bears much fruit! (it's harvest time all around me, can you tell?  )

So, what may truly be indifference may also be an indicator of healing and an accurate assessment of the realities of your mother's character and the limits she is choosing for herself. And it may hopefully also be an indicator of a kind of peace despite and through it all.

[moglow]

Bloomie, I've read and reread your words above and I hope others have as well. Today, I'm just not so peaceful. It is indeed a process.

Another day, another fruitless doctor's appt for md yesterday. Brother is at a complete loss what that one was even for - basically it was a recap with her cardiologist of her recent appt with the surgeon replacing the pacemaker. Surely to goodness that could have been handled with a simple phone call, advise the surgery date and carry on? But no, there's the angst and preparing to go to appt, normal traffic delays and her turmoil that they might be late etc etc. But for what, why were they even there? He has no idea and she can't seem to communicate it. She has questions before and after the appts, during them while physically with the doctor she sits quietly or questions ancient irrelevant info. She doesn't write her questions down to ask the doctors, will literally bring it up as they get in the car to leave "I need to remember to ask next time ..." 

She seems to be losing or simply doesn't communicate pertinent issues, but will batter away senselessly during appointments "but they said I shouldn't have to have this replaced until ..." That was a guesstimate many months ago, it was speculation at that time. You were with us two weeks ago when we actually tested and that has changed. Now. Let's go over this schedule [stopping meds, starting others, etc] ... Oh but what about the heartbeats per minute and they said the test... Ma'am. You may be remembering previous discussions ... 

He said they're very patient with her but you can see the exasperation. I bet so! I'm frustrated for him, that he's trying so hard to get her through these hoops when she's just as hard pulling back the other direction. For her, it's all just more visits and chats while words drift around her. It's still all about attention, with no apparent connection that this is her LIFE they're talking about, literally. I'm not sure it's remotely crossed her mind that she should have questions and needs those answers, that she should pay attention not only to what they're saying but the tone, their body language. They're conveying serious information and she's twittering around as if it's no big deal and we'll see you again soon. Maybe that's just her coping mechanism.

I'm not sure she's going to survive this, or if she even truly survived the last one or possibly the ones before that. Some vital pieces seem to be missing mentally, emotionally and even physically. And she's absolutely unconcerned other than getting through doctor visits.

[Sneezy]

They're conveying serious information and she's twittering around as if it's no big deal and we'll see you again soon. Maybe that's just her coping mechanism.

Mo - It could be her coping mechanism.  It could also be a little confusion based on her age.  I think it's also related to having a PD.  People with PDs are perfect.  They don't have serious medical issues.  They have all kinds of "emergencies" that require attention and phone calls and coddling from their children.  But real, true, medical conditions that might actually be serious?  Nah, that's the kind of stuff that happens to other old people, not them.  That's been my experience with my mom.  She will happily ask me to rub lotion on her latest rash (I am NOT a hands-on caregiver).  And she loves to tell me all about her latest stomach issues (yeah, TMI).  But will she ever admit that she has diabetes or clogged arteries or major depressive disorder or any other true, serious medical condition that most people would want to address?  Of course not - because she is perfect!

[moglow]

@Sneezy - good point. She's been openly offended when brother has called her on obvious issues that he sees, including the unquestioned 30+ years of high blood pressure and statin meds for starters, that MAYBE those are precursors to the multitude of issues that seem to now be snowballing through her. I'm not necessarily saying that some is/was needed, but questioning and complaining when something is stopped rather than them adding something new? Never paying attention to known spelled out side effects, but taking additional meds to counteract them? AND taking whatever over the counter she feels she needs - specifically stated on the label to not take if you have XYZ conditions?? But no - all that is for "old people" with complete disregard of her long standing known issues.

We're wondering what she's been told all this time and just trying to cope with what is, now. And she's oblivious. Willful ignorance, with rude dismissive confrontations when questions are asked. He said she's openly hostile much more often than not. Well not a surprise - there are reasons I skipped my bootay out of there!

[Hilltop]

I also wonder if it's a coping mechanism.  People don't like to face their own mortality. I also wonder if she is so use to leaving everything up to everyone else to sort out. My inlaws are like that.  Dh has to do everything for them including making decisions for everything from what paint colour to pick to major health decisions.  They sit back and he decides for their life.  I sometimes wonder if he will feel guilt when something happens and FIL dies. The number of times I have said that FIL needs to ask an actual doctor about that but no, they ask DH and of course he runs around and sorts it all out for them.  Dh is capable but it is a lot of stress which doesn't need to be there.  He is not only managing his own life but theirs as well.  FIL is now starting to get a bit confused and so some help is now needed but DH has been doing this his whole life.  MIL the other day was using over the counter medication which stated do not use if you have this condition or that condition which they have. I'm not sure if it's normal elderly confusion or she is so use to not thinking for herself or simply not thinking for so many years that she now seems incapable of making any decisions at all.

I wonder if your mother simply thinks someone else will ask the relevant questions for her.  If she is at an age where confusion has set in, it may be more helpful to have your brother ask the relevant questions and take more ownership of the doctors appointments.