Does PD mother ever take accountability?

[sweet1987]

Sorry 3rd post in 24rs but my mother's recent PD message rage at me has sent my head in a twirl.
I know I'm choosing to have a relationship with her and I need to reevaluate my boundaries but I also know I can't change her and she isn't in any kind of treatment and most times oblivious or doesn't think she is doing anything. In her mind she is always the victim. I'm wondering even if I take time away from messages when she's being mean, not engage with her tactics etc.
 I still cant tell her 'look I don't like the way your treating me and you need to stop' because that will just provoke another rage. I feel a bit stuck, does this mean I have to accept she will never really take any accountability and our relationship can only ever be surface level and guarded to stay safe?
I understand I can't fix her, but it's so difficult when today she is acting super nice and sending heart emojis after the hurtful messages a couple days ago. How am I meant to just carry on like everything is now okay. Is it normal to feel annoyed and resentful. I know I have my role also in allowing her access to me. But I don't know so confused.

[DaisyGirl77]

Sorry 3rd post in 24rs but my mother's recent PD message rage at me has sent my head in a twirl.
I know I'm choosing to have a relationship with her and I need to reevaluate my boundaries but I also know I can't change her and she isn't in any kind of treatment and most times oblivious or doesn't think she is doing anything. In her mind she is always the victim. I'm wondering even if I take time away from messages when she's being mean, not engage with her tactics etc.
 I still cant tell her 'look I don't like the way your treating me and you need to stop' because that will just provoke another rage. I feel a bit stuck, does this mean I have to accept she will never really take any accountability and our relationship can only ever be surface level and guarded to stay safe?
I understand I can't fix her, but it's so difficult when today she is acting super nice and sending heart emojis after the hurtful messages a couple days ago. How am I meant to just carry on like everything is now okay. Is it normal to feel annoyed and resentful. I know I have my role also in allowing her access to me. But I don't know so confused.

The short answer:  Yes.  Unfortunately.

Longer answer:  With PDs, generally speaking, there will be no admittance of wrongdoing because that would mean they have a flaw, & they can't have a flaw because they're perfect.  So...  In order to protect your peace, in the long run, it's easier on your mind & emotional wellbeing to make peace with the fact that you will (most likely) never get an apology.  That you're better off accepting them as they are & choosing to keep them in your life as they are knowing they'll never change, or going LC/NC because you've decided each exposure to them results in damage you're not willing to take.  The choice is yours, & only you can decide how much is too much & how little contact is good enough for you & your family.

[sweet1987]

Sorry 3rd post in 24rs but my mother's recent PD message rage at me has sent my head in a twirl.
I know I'm choosing to have a relationship with her and I need to reevaluate my boundaries but I also know I can't change her and she isn't in any kind of treatment and most times oblivious or doesn't think she is doing anything. In her mind she is always the victim. I'm wondering even if I take time away from messages when she's being mean, not engage with her tactics etc.
 I still cant tell her 'look I don't like the way your treating me and you need to stop' because that will just provoke another rage. I feel a bit stuck, does this mean I have to accept she will never really take any accountability and our relationship can only ever be surface level and guarded to stay safe?
I understand I can't fix her, but it's so difficult when today she is acting super nice and sending heart emojis after the hurtful messages a couple days ago. How am I meant to just carry on like everything is now okay. Is it normal to feel annoyed and resentful. I know I have my role also in allowing her access to me. But I don't know so confused.

The short answer:  Yes.  Unfortunately.

Longer answer:  With PDs, generally speaking, there will be no admittance of wrongdoing because that would mean they have a flaw, & they can't have a flaw because they're perfect.  So...  In order to protect your peace, in the long run, it's easier on your mind & emotional wellbeing to make peace with the fact that you will (most likely) never get an apology.  That you're better off accepting them as they are & choosing to keep them in your life as they are knowing they'll never change, or going LC/NC because you've decided each exposure to them results in damage you're not willing to take.  The choice is yours, & only you can decide how much is too much & how little contact is good enough for you & your family.

Hi DaisyGirl,
Thank you for your reply. Ugh such a sad thing to have to accept. But makes allot of sence, this is exactly what she is like. I did get an apology in the past..as close to genuine as I think she is capable of, but this was for really big things that happened to me in the past, although even after she still remains either the victim or hero in every story of the past. The link wasn't working, can you please post or send again. Thank you for sharing your story. 

[NarcKiddo]

I agree with DaisyGirl. The answer, I am afraid, is yes.

It takes hard work and suffering and grieving to accept that you are never going to get a normal relationship with them because they are simply incapable of it. If you wish to cling to the hope that you might one day have one, that is up to you, but you will need at the same time to accept that there is literally NOTHING you can do to facilitate that except keep lines of communication open as much as you can bear to. Which you are doing. It is theoretically possible that she will one day wake up to her behaviour, desire to change it, and apologise. But please don't count on that happening. And any progress in that direction can only come from her. You cannot make her do anything or influence her behaviour in any way.

The work you need to do is on yourself - to nurture yourself gently through the process of accepting that she is unlikely to change, and grieving the mother you wish you had, but don't. It's really hard. But the only person you can change is you, and you need to find a way of at least sitting somewhat comfortably with the situation even if you don't like it and wish it were different.

They are very, very skilled at recognising when they may have pushed you to a limit and when you might be withdrawing a little to protect yourself. That endangers their supply and they often change tactic to reel you back in. Look up "hoovering" and "lovebombing". In many cases I don't think they are doing this deliberately with malice aforethought. They just instinctively recognise that they need to do something to maintain their supply. This is why you get bombarded with the hearts and nice messages. It is not about you. The horrid messages are not about you and the nice messages are not about you either.

Wishing you well.

[sweet1987]

Hi NarcoKid,

Thank you for your message. Yes this makes allot of sence and so familiar as well. I done so much work since I left home 8 years ago. Therapy and many self help books. It's frustrating because I know those terms but for some reason it's like everything has almost gone out the window. Yes grieving the mother I wish I had was the most painful thing and
I'm not sure I'm even fully over it or if I ever will be. I think where she has been so different the past year it's allowed her to slip past the net and now I feel almost back to square one. But I guess it's a journey  . Thank you for this reminder. 

[bloomie]

sweet1987 - what came to my mind reading through your thread is how important it is to stay aware of the lure of the familiar. Our long established relationships with our parents, siblings, old friends are a mix of good and really hard. We grew up with these people and their ways are familiar to us. We made memories and shared experiences that are foundational to our lives.

Expecially when it is a parent that we long to believe will change enough to end the relationship on a healed and reconciled note, we are vulnerable to falling for the part of the cycle where they are 'better' or even kind.

In my own case, I finally came to the place where I had to accept that I could never engage with either of my parents as if they are safe people. They may be safe people for others, even well thought of and adored by others in our community, but for me, even though there were times of normalcy and nostalgia, they would never be accountable for their behaviors and choices and could flip out and verbally abuse me on a dime. Take advantage of me and use me up if it was a question of perceived need and their flourishing versus mine.

It helped me to learn about abuse amnesia which I have struggled with. How easy it is to forget how awful things can be when we really want a loving relationship with someone and we have been conditioned to forget and act as if abuse never happened, accept misconstruing the facts of our experiences and outright rewriting of scripts where, yes, they are the hero or had no idea what was going on in their own homes. 

Here is a link to a great article that explains, better than I could, the concept of abuse amnesia: Abuse Amnesia

Something else to be noticing is the abuse cycle. 

From a greater understanding of what you may be encountering with your mom and with greater self compassion and prioritizing protecting your peace I believe you will find a way to shift your focus to what your mom is thinking or how she perceives herself to what you are thinking and what you need to do to set limits on abusive behaviors and overcome your fear of her potential raging.

[moglow]

@sweet1987 - one of the hardest things I had to do was not responding to mother's nastiness, like not at all. Not taking it on as mine or taking it personally was incredibly hard for me - that is my mother saying those things, after all. I had to force myself to not even acknowledge the ugliness. Yes, at times she spun up even harder trying to force a reaction, but that was all on her. It just wasn't my fight, know what I mean? So I learned to cut it off and change the subject then end the call. Enough already.

For many years I compared mother to a pressure cooker - you know how it build and builds then has to release the pressure or explode? Only for her the release was always an explosion. I never knew what would set it off or when it would come but it always happened again. Then days or weeks later she'd pop up as if all was right with the world, all sunshine and daisies [now she's discovered emojis so I get all of those too, Lord help us]. But there was not one whit of remorse or apology or even acknowledgment of what she'd said to me before. When I dared bring it up trying to find some resolution, it's ON and I'm suddenly digging up the past and creating problems??

What I DID do, on the rare occasions when she'd actually ask what's wrong or why I was quiet, is forward a couple of those messages back to her. THIS is wrong and and I'm trying to move past it. She didn't like it AT ALL, but she asked so ... I was then told things like I took it wrong and that's not what she meant and I read something into it that wasn't there, etc. No, I didn't. THIS is what was said and THIS is how I responded, now you're pretending it didn't happen at all? No. It was meant to hurt and it did and I'm not ready to pretend all is right with the world. So we'll have to talk some other time.
 
Giving her access doesn't mean you have to roll over and revert to a little girl again. You can shut down as much of that access as you need, to keep your peace.

[DaisyGirl77]

Sorry 3rd post in 24rs but my mother's recent PD message rage at me has sent my head in a twirl.
I know I'm choosing to have a relationship with her and I need to reevaluate my boundaries but I also know I can't change her and she isn't in any kind of treatment and most times oblivious or doesn't think she is doing anything. In her mind she is always the victim. I'm wondering even if I take time away from messages when she's being mean, not engage with her tactics etc.
 I still cant tell her 'look I don't like the way your treating me and you need to stop' because that will just provoke another rage. I feel a bit stuck, does this mean I have to accept she will never really take any accountability and our relationship can only ever be surface level and guarded to stay safe?
I understand I can't fix her, but it's so difficult when today she is acting super nice and sending heart emojis after the hurtful messages a couple days ago. How am I meant to just carry on like everything is now okay. Is it normal to feel annoyed and resentful. I know I have my role also in allowing her access to me. But I don't know so confused.

The short answer:  Yes.  Unfortunately.

Longer answer:  With PDs, generally speaking, there will be no admittance of wrongdoing because that would mean they have a flaw, & they can't have a flaw because they're perfect.  So...  In order to protect your peace, in the long run, it's easier on your mind & emotional wellbeing to make peace with the fact that you will (most likely) never get an apology.  That you're better off accepting them as they are & choosing to keep them in your life as they are knowing they'll never change, or going LC/NC because you've decided each exposure to them results in damage you're not willing to take.  The choice is yours, & only you can decide how much is too much & how little contact is good enough for you & your family.

Hi DaisyGirl,
Thank you for your reply. Ugh such a sad thing to have to accept. But makes allot of sence, this is exactly what she is like. I did get an apology in the past..as close to genuine as I think she is capable of, but this was for really big things that happened to me in the past, although even after she still remains either the victim or hero in every story of the past. The link wasn't working, can you please post or send again. Thank you for sharing your story. 

Thanks for letting me know of the broken link.  I figured out that everything pre-2019 disappeared & I'm very confused, so clearly I missed something around that time, lol.  Here's the new one, after rewriting it:  https://www.outofthefog.net/forum/index.php?topic=95567.0

You're lucky you got an apology.  They're notorious for the "I'm sorry but if you..." non-apology, & the only ones I've ever gotten.

[sweet1987]

Thank you all so much, it really helps me feel less alone. Your replies really mean allot 🤗