I can't seem to pull the trigger on leaving :-(

[IsleOfSong]

It was a rough Valentine's Day weekend here, and I'm trying not to be too hard on myself, but I *cannot* seem to get over the hump of telling my uNPD wife that I want to end our 26-year marriage. I am so frustrated, at least for now.

For backstory, I will say that we've been living as roommates for the past couple of years. We are civil to each other for the most part, but bickering and flareups tend to happen a fair amount as well, and occasionally she resorts to the silent treatment for a day or two at a time before it burns off and she returns to her normal. She is often bossy and controlling, extremely brittle and fragile when it comes to things she perceives as attacks no matter how calmly and evenly I speak, and she is wildly incurious about my interests. She also has long complained that "we're so different" because we have differing interests, whereas I have always seen those differences as entirely normal between two different people. I hold a lot of resentment over her inability to control her anger, whether it's with me or our two kids (both of whom are out of the house at college), and as a result I have no desire to be intimate with her. She's just not a consistently "safe" person to me.

So V-Day rolls around, and we exchange cards in an admittedly check-the-box sort of way, and then she hits me with "Are we ever going to be intimate again?" I am caught off-guard, and I freeze. Even though I realize intellectually that this is an opening to tell her how I really feel, that I've been working on getting up the nerve to end the marriage, that I've literally been touring apartments in recent weeks and doing the work with a therapist to gain the strength to assert myself with this person, I revert back to general statements like "Well, I mean, I don't want to go the rest of our lives without intimacy..." I do, eventually, gain the strength to point out that her anger issues keep me at arm's length with her — there's some honest sharing there that I do see as a positive step for myself — though I don't push things to a point where we talk about separation. She does eventually ask, "What do you want to do? Should we stay together??" I dodge the question instinctively, rather than use the opening to make the break. Eventually we go to bed, and the subject hasn't come up again yet.

I know better than to beat myself up over this, but I can't help being disappointed in myself. My people-pleasing history and submission to "bigger" personalities over the course of my life have once again gotten the best of me here.

I'm in therapy (with a good therapist who totally gets it), I'm doing the work... and yet I'm still stuck. I don't have young kids in the house to use as an excuse for staying, and yet I can't make the break. What will it take for me to get out? How can I get over my fear of upsetting (enraging?) this person who can get really nasty when she's narcissistically wounded? I realize the trauma bond is insidiously real, and yet I want nothing more than to sever it, at least long enough to tell her what I really want to do with the rest of my life (i.e., not be with her).

Open to your thoughts, and thank you for reading this far.

[SeaBreeze]

A few months before I left, ex-uNPDh directly asked me if I was happy in the marriage. I paused a moment before calmly, evenly saying "Well, I'm not totally unhappy" in vague response. Mind you, I was actively planning my exit. I think he was picking up on that, and I knew if I told him the truth, he would try to talk me out of it or start lovebombing me (or, freak out and hurt me and/or himself...)

May I gently suggest you are still in survival mode? Not to mention trauma bonding is hard to overcome, even when we recognize that it's happening?

[IsleOfSong]

Oh, I don't doubt that I'm still in survival mode — it certainly feels that way when I get "cornered" by her line of questioning. And, I am still too anxious/fearful to bring up separation on my own. As long as I'm with this person, I fear, part of me will feel the need to protect myself by freezing, I think. It's not good.

Just feeling frustrated today. Hoping this frustration will inspire me to pivot into a different mindset and direction very soon.

[Poison Ivy]

Have you had a chance to talk to your therapist about this most recent incident?

[IsleOfSong]

I have not. Unfortunately I'm not seeing the therapist for another week. I'll survive until then, but getting over this hurdle has been something I've discussed at length with her. A lot of the rationale seems to stem from unresolved "inner child" trauma that goes back to how I was raised (as a docile people pleaser who always stayed small to stay safe, particularly around bigger — and occasionally explosive — personalities like my father and older brother). I've been working with the therapist on neuroplasticity exercises to "reshape" my brain to want to challenge the past and to see conflict and pain as a necessary path to my growth and ultimate freedom.

[MaxedOut]

You have developed a lot of instincts at this point in dealing with your PD, so I would not get too hung up on this or feel like you missed an opportunity. It's probably not best as a seat-of-the-pants revelation. I think you know that. It may be more about guilt from feeling you are hiding things from her in planning an exit and talking through things with your therapist. Which is normal and with PDs often how things are best sequenced.

To me, "Are we ever going to be intimate again?" sounds charged - maybe not "it's a trap!" level but not really like the sort of space with solid ground for vulnerable conversations. It sounds like she may be thinking about the future, which is good. You didn't jump to reassure. I think you navigated that pretty well given it was a surprise conversation.

As communicated in other posts, there are a multitude of ways people have ended chosen relationships, with more and less planning.

[IsleOfSong]

You have developed a lot of instincts at this point in dealing with your PD, so I would not get too hung up on this or feel like you missed an opportunity. It's probably not best as a seat-of-the-pants revelation. I think you know that.

I do, but I also feel that I need her to instigate something with me in order for me to feel strong enough to have an "I've had it!" moment and tell her I'm done. I don't (for now) see myself as brave enough to push through my fear and initiate a breakup. That's been my catch-22 for longer than I care to admit.

To me, "Are we ever going to be intimate again?" sounds charged - maybe not "it's a trap!" level but not really like the sort of space with solid ground for vulnerable conversations. It sounds like she may be thinking about the future, which is good. You didn't jump to reassure. I think you navigated that pretty well given it was a surprise conversation.

It was definitely charged. If she really wanted an open, candid conversation with me, she wouldn't have come in with anger/wit's end frustration in her voice. But narcs don't typically go that route.

She is definitely thinking about her future — in a year or so, she is hoping to leave her job and become an independent contractor in an entirely different field. She's on my healthcare plan through my job (and she is a type 1 diabetic), so she is likely thinking about her healthcare coverage. While she didn't mention healthcare specifically, she did mention her career plans and was pressing me to know how committed I am to the "plan" for her future. In the meantime, she has a seven-figure balance in her retirement/stock accounts (she works in tech) and is poised to someday inherit her parents' estate, which is quite sizable (including a $2M home and a 6-unit apartment building). In other words, she'll be more than fine financially whether or not I'm married to her.

[GoodPesto]

Hi IsleofSong,

I understand your frustration. Being aware of the mechanism of people-pleasing and being able to watch oneself acting it out and at the same time seeming unable to act differently is a tough point. When I read you post though, I thought of this apparently very smart part that seems to be protective of you and that might have concluded it's safer to not yet share your plans with the person you do not feel consistently safe with and whose reaction you fear, surely for very good reasons.
There are some stories of PD-ridden couples where the part that is being left will not know until the other one is out of the house or has tied necessary legal knots. While this may look like a cowardly move to some it's completely fine or even necessary under PD-circumstances. So maybe more time will pass until you get to go over the hump of telling her, and maybe you will be able to go to your own apartment afterwards and safe yourself from witnessing her blow-up.
From what I witnessed and experienced, it's far more likely to talk oneself out of sensible protective messures than to exaggerate them. From this perspective I applaud the part of you that seems to know it's not yet time to spill the beans.
Leaving is one of the MAJOR narcissistic injuries you can inflict upon someone. The fear of her reaction is justified. Your wish to want to overcome it could be stemming from moral standards (e.g. the moral obligation that one owes such a talk prior to leaving a partner) or from an unjustified loyalty (which is a typical trait of 'PD-prisoners'). It's not necessary or maybe not even possible to overcome that justified fear before leaving.
This fear is what keeps you seeming unable to leave and is at the time a solid reason why you should. To me that's the paradox of the trauma-bond in a nutshell. But you have great instincts it seems, maybe try trusting?
My two cents.

Best wishes

[Rebel13]

There are some stories of PD-ridden couples where the part that is being left will not know until the other one is out of the house or has tied necessary legal knots. While this may look like a cowardly move to some it's completely fine or even necessary under PD-circumstances. So maybe more time will pass until you get to go over the hump of telling her, and maybe you will be able to go to your own apartment afterwards and safe yourself from witnessing her blow-up.

This is what I thought when reading your initial post, IsleofSong. Thanks to GoodPesto for articulating it so clearly.

It's OK to prioritize your safety (including emotional safety). It's even OK to prioritize your comfort a little bit more than hers -- see the 51% rule.

Good luck with this, IsleofSong. It's a tough one. Take care of yourself.

[IsleOfSong]

Thanks, GoodPesto and Rebel13, for the reminder. After 26 years of marriage, a "cowardly" departure feels off to me, but then again if the marriage is ending anyway, what difference does it make how the news is ultimately conveyed?

Tomorrow she leaves on a 2-week work trip to Europe. I'll be doing some heavy-duty thinking and internal work while she's away, for sure.

[MaxedOut]

I'm glad you'll have a couple of weeks to yourself, Isle. From my experience, it helped to identify specific beliefs/issue keeping me stuck and talk through each, in my case over a number of sessions with my therapist. Part was critical examination (what were the underlying beliefs, were they true/likely, is there some layoff, what is the cost of staying).

And I walked through fears for each "ok, what if that happens? What would you do? That's doable! Are there things that might lessen the chance of that fear that you want to do?" Running a bit parallel was planning and preparing in case of leaving (from intentionally and permanently down to simple leaving temporarily due to abuse/crisis). It sounds like you are going through those steps if looking at apartments.

I did not get to a space to intentionally leave my marriage. It was more of what you mention - my ex starting in on another set of cycling blow-ups and mistreatment. But the prior work meant I was clear about boundaries in the couple of days leading up to stuff, felt strong to have a talk about not being willing to accept abuse any longer, and then when a lash out happened I could actually say I was leaving.

You don't owe her or anyone a certain kind of exit, and the "heavy-duty" thinking and prep helps create more and more open exit points. I went from being unable to conceive of what leaving looks like to having a number of likely scenarios mapped out.

Part of the issue can be dealing with the dissonance about what we normally value in our handling of relationships - so less about owing it to them and more about owing something to ourselves/acting within values. But those priorities are about general relationship treatment - not the context of being a non-PD in relationship with a PD. And the 51% piece comes in here. What we really owe ourselves is protection and prioritizing our safety and welfare. If it were a close friend or an adult child in a similar position we would likely have zero hitch thinking about various ways to leave that prioritize our friend-not leaving a certain way. Heck, we would probably advocate for that of the person felt like they owed the person some sort of talk that would no doubt be a chance for manipulation, abuse, control, etc.

[Rebel13]

After 26 years of marriage, a "cowardly" departure feels off to me, but then again if the marriage is ending anyway, what difference does it make how the news is ultimately conveyed?

I also see both sides of this issue as you state here, IsleOfSong. Ultimately, after 26 years, is there really anything left unsaid? I'm sure you have tried your best to communicate your wants/needs/wishes, without sufficient change, in this kind of relationship. I am glad you will be getting some space. Sometimes things don't come clear until one gets space from the abuse, even if only temporarily.

Wishing you the best.

[SeaBreeze]

A 2-week break sounds lovely! Enjoy that time to breathe, decompress, and think. (Or not think... whatever is best for your emotional health!)

[IsleOfSong]

Thank you all!

Now you've got me thinking that a "traditional" conversation about ending things isn't necessarily "required," though she would definitely throw it back in my face if I went the "cowardly" route and quit the marriage, say, over the phone while she's away or by writing her a letter. Food for consideration...

I'm also keeping an eye on that apartment I toured a couple of weeks ago — it's still listed online as available, a revelation that is comforting and tantalizing/slightly torturous at the same time. :-)

[MaxedOut]

Is she not going to throw something back in your face anyway, regardless of how you handle it?

And even if that's not the case, like I said, it can help to continue the inquiry. So what if she does throw it back in your face?

I am not suggesting there may not be good reasons why an in person conversation is a better option, just suggesting thinking through paths and examining what baggage may be coloring things.

(For the record, I think leaving someone with PD or a marriage of 26 years is a pretty brave thing to do! And exactly how that happens doesn't matter in my view when it comes to that. Arguably, deciding what you need and how to care for yourself in that process is showing strength and change.)

And I second SeaBreeze, enjoy the time and in whatever way is best for your emotional health!

[IsleOfSong]

Is she not going to throw something back in your face anyway, regardless of how you handle it?

And even if that's not the case, like I said, it can help to continue the inquiry. So what if she does throw it back in your face?

She definitely will. My well-meaning friend suggested I adopt a mantra: "She already doesn't like you very much." I need to remind myself of that, and that our relationship never really existed in the way that I thought it did.

I am not suggesting there may not be good reasons why an in person conversation is a better option, just suggesting thinking through paths and examining what baggage may be coloring things.

(For the record, I think leaving someone with PD or a marriage of 26 years is a pretty brave thing to do! And exactly how that happens doesn't matter in my view when it comes to that. Arguably, deciding what you need and how to care for yourself in that process is showing strength and change.)

Thanks, MaxedOut. You know, I went back and read some of the posts you made when you suddenly found yourself separated without any prior warning. It provides a good day-by-day account of what it felt like for you when the big moment happened (and you didn't necessarily see it coming). So thanks for that as well!

[Rebel13]

though she would definitely throw it back in my face if I went the "cowardly" route and quit the marriage, say, over the phone while she's away or by writing her a letter.

I like your friend's suggestion! I will also say, she can't throw it back in your face if you stop communicating with her. If your children are grown, there's no reason to be in touch unless you want to be. You may need to work out things regarding the dissolution of the marriage, but you can arrange for communication to go through attorneys or a family member, and have them transmit basic facts to you without commentary. You can also use one of the tools where communication is monitored by the court. Sometimes that keeps people on their best behavior. When I stopped communicating with my mother, my partner read her subsequent (few) texts and cards, and let me know if there was any information I needed to know. (There wasn't.)

I'm not saying you are ready to, or would even want to, cut off communication, but it is an option you have.

[MaxedOut]

IsleOfSong glad that look-back helped. To add, life is so much better now than I had hoped. And while the breaking point was unplanned, I am glad it happened when it did rather than something later (planned or unplanned).

The immediate aftermath was *something* but none of my biggest fears were realized. In part I think because there was a finality to it, so a lot of lashing out but applying the tools meant it really didn't get traction, so there was no payoff, just a period of high anger, attempts to hook me into abusive convos, some really unrealistic and distorted divorce agreement stuff, having to block her on phone, then... nothing.

I get some updates from her family and she apparently shifts from hate/anger to more that the relationship got to where it "wasn't good for either of us" but no attempts to contact (or realizations of abuse/mistreatment - which I had let go of expecting).

My nervous system is back to what it was like before - amazing difference. And triggering moments, anxiety, and rumination are rare now. I had a good milepost this past weekend... Pretty much every time I do some deep clean in one of those blue-moon cleaning places, I find some artifact of anger or reminder of how very different reality was.

It usually catches me and might trigger anger or anxiety echoes or just rumination. Well I had pulled the stove out from the wall to clean and one of the more common artifacts was underneath: a couple broken pieces of a mug handle. The size and placement means it was something she threw at the counter or wall (not just stray breakage from a dropped mug). And no anger, resentment, anxiety, or rumination. Just kind of shook my head and thought about how much I love my life now and how glad I am to be on the other side.

And unexpected or not, I still consider leaving one of the bravest things I have done in a long time.

[IsleOfSong]

IsleOfSong glad that look-back helped. To add, life is so much better now than I had hoped. And while the breaking point was unplanned, I am glad it happened when it did rather than something later (planned or unplanned).

So glad to hear it. I'm hoping to follow in your footsteps sooner rather than later...

And unexpected or not, I still consider leaving one of the bravest things I have done in a long time.

I can understand. Now, can I borrow some of your bravery?

[square]

Hey IoS,

I think I've mentioned this before, but on the day I made the big announcement I took a beta blocker shortly before showtime.

A beta blocker reduces fight-or-flight responses. Instead of my heart pounding and my brain getting scrambled and my tongue getting twisted up saying all the wrong things, I was calm. Yeah, I was nervous and afraid but my mind and heart kept working five by five. Atenolol seems to have that effect better than metoprolol imho.

I took it not daily but just as needed, when I anticipated problems or to calm down after H had a blowup. I haven't needed one since I left.

My nurse practitioner prescribed it to me off label for anxiety. It.starts working within 15 minutes of taking it, so it is realistic to use in a pinch.

I was terrified too. I only pulled the pin because I wound up in a "now or never" situation. Otherwise I would have wanted to wait for one of those "special occasions" where I was perfectly ready to run, but of course on all the prior occasions I had nowhere to go.

She is not going to say "yeah, I get why you're leaving me." Serious question, do you think there will be ANY difference in how it goes down if you leave under this circumstance or that? Or will you be the most horrible person in the world whether you "were a coward" or "broke your promises" or "left me for no reason" or "left me over one silly argument" or or or?

That is an honest question, maybe you can take "left me over one silly argument" better than "you're a coward."